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[mck1nlay]

Hey,

I'm looking for some advice with my O2 broadband connection. Over the past 2 weeks I have bee experiencing connections issues. My connection will drop and sync again usually within a couple of minutes, once it syncs it's at a much lower speed, typically under 1mbps and the noise margin is reported as around 33db.

The first thing I did was check my connections from the router supplied by O2 and my cordless phone and tested another microfilter. All equipment is connected to the master socket and I have no extension sockets. When this did not reveal any problems I contacted O2 who confirmed they could see I was experiencing a significant number of disconnects. They advised me to run some tests through the master socket which I did with no improvement to my service. The next step was for them to send me out a new router (Thomson TG585 v7) I tested this with a new microfilter provided along with it to no avail I was still experiencing the same problems as before. I don't use the phone line itself very often but having made repeated calls to O2 I noticed there was some intermittent crackling noise on the line. O2 then recommended I contact BT but not to mention the broadband issues just the noise on the line. There intial test showed there was no issue on the line but they did arrange for openreach to investiage and send an engineer. Later that day I recieved an sms message to confirm this was taking place and the next day (today) I recieved a second message stating that a fault on my line had been repaired. Great news I thought, so when I returned home from work I tested out my connection. Straight away I checked my router stats... my connections was at 300ish kbps and had last sync'd about 10 minutes previously. I rebooted the router at this point and it immediately connected at around 8000kbps which is more like what I was expecting. This lasted around an hour until the connection dropped again as was happening previously.

I've included below my current stats and the router stats graphs of what is described above. Any advice on what to do next would be much appreciated before I call O2 or BT again as I really want to avoid any charges if they send an engineer out and report a fault no found. Oh and as far as I can tell a quiet line test now shows no noise on the line although it was intermittent so who knows really...

Link Information
         

Code: [Select]

Uptime: 0 days, 0:33:29
DSL Type: G.992.1 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 796 / 830
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 17.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 23.0 / 38.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.0 / 33.0
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / BDCM
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 268 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 545 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 519 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 275 / 3,023
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 275 / 331
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 145 / 254

[attachment deleted by admin]

[jeffbb]

Hi and welcome

quote
 Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]:   23.0 / 38.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]:   6.0 / 33.0

Loss of Framing (Local/Remote):   268 / 0

Loss of Signal (Local/Remote):   545 / 0

Error Seconds (Local/Remote):   519 / 0

FEC Errors (Up/Down):   275 / 3,023

CRC Errors (Up/Down):   275 / 331

HEC Errors (Up/Down):   145 / 254

these stats are very odd ,you seem to have lots of UP stream problems ,the Upstream SNR margin is particularly bad , would expect about 20db .
upstream problems are often associated with internal wiring or filter problems .
are you still connected to the master socket ?

might be worth another check see the link below .
http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/socket.htm

you may have already done some of this .

could you do a speedtest using BT to get a full picyture of your present line condition.
http://www.speedtester.bt.com/

what does your BITSWAP grapph look like


regards Jeff

[mck1nlay]

Sorry, when I said master socket what I meant to say was Test Socket.. I've already removed the faceplate and everything is currently plugged into the test socket.

Tried doing a speedtest but i'm currently getting 'The system is currently busy. Please try again shortly, however if this problem persists, raise the issue with your service provider'. I'll do one as soon as I'm able.

I was only using routerstats lite which doesn't have the bitswaps graph. I've got the full version now and it's running at the moment so I'll post a graph when theres some more data.

[jeffbb]

Hi

Ok 
Regards Jeff

[mck1nlay]

Right so, current stats from my router and the graphs requested.

Code: [Select]

Uptime: 0 days, 0:43:05
DSL Type: G.992.1 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,211 / 7,199
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 18.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 23.0 / 37.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.0 / 7.0
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / BDCM
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 64 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 142 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 68 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 5,798
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 1
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0
Cheers,
Graham

Edit: Just as i posted this my connections dropped again

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Oranged]

With an attenuation of 37/38dB, I can't understand why you are on ADSL rather than ADSL2+.

O2 must be seeing a significant number of disconnections to drop the connection down rather than increase your Target SNR

[mck1nlay]

With an attenuation of 37/38dB, I can't understand why you are on ADSL rather than ADSL2+.

O2 must be seeing a significant number of disconnections to drop the connection down rather than increase your Target SNR

Well to give you an idea of the number of disconnections I called O2 this morning and the guy I spoke to said it had disconnected 72 times in the last 24 hours....

Anyway from what he said he's changed it back to ADSL2+, increased the target snr and started another 24 hours line test. Someone from their second line support will contact  me when its done either tomorrow or Thursday. I wasn't able to confirm the changes he made this morning as I had to leave for work as soon as I got off the phone.

[jeffbb]

Hi
These stats are radically different to the first ones
A rather unusaual set of Bits?tone graphs . Normally I would expect to see tones up to about 255 used . If not then there would be a loss of synch . Yours however is synching at near max for adsl1 .
One problem may be that your bitload Table has shown the tones from 187+ as unusable . yet has been able to load enough bits ,up to near maximum(15) .

edit: there seems to be LOTS of bitswapping between tone 124to 184 .
Then it may be that when noise comes on the line there is not enough tones to spare at the nearly full tones to cope for the bitswapping required so you lose synch

Another thing  I don't understand is the US speed I thought it was only annex I that would provide additional speed (probably misunderstood that) .

I think that some further help is required from someof the more knowledgeable gurus

Regards Jeff

[mck1nlay]

So a quick update, I recieved an SMS this afternoon requesting that I call O2 support as they require more information. So after 45 mins on hold there 1st line support didn't know what information was required so I was past on to 2nd line. She asked about my call to BT and while I explained she stared adjusting my profile not having read all the notes about the line test being started this morning. When I got to that part she had to change the profile back and said to let the test complete and the would contact me then. So currently it's back on the 2+ profile but I'm now noticing some noise on the voice  calls again. I've left the computer on to monitor the connection myself and I'll have to wait till tomorrow to get any further with O2. I'm not sure if I should contact BT again or wait on O2.

[jeffbb]

Hi
Give it a day then check stats etc .
Regards Jeff

[mck1nlay]

Having been messed around by O2's support a fair bit I finally had a BT engineer out yesterday morning. Up and till he had arrived the connection had stayed stable at around 1mb for a day or so (I'd just left it well alone).  When he got to my house and unplugged my own equipemt and replacing it with his own. He ran some tests on the line and connected at the max speed his moden would allow. He didn't lose connection the whole time he was there including checking the line from the house to the nearest pole and from that to the next pole. There was no loss of sync even when shaking the cable, all appeared fine from his tests so he left saying he would check the entire line back to the exchange. He put the faceplate back on the master socket and pluged my O2 box back in. I checked the stats before he left, connected at a respectable 11mb or so. It struck me as strange that all of a sudden with no fixes or changes everything seemed fixed.

4 hours later the connection dropped again and sync'd slightly slower and again a few minutes later. Since then it's been dropping frequently and I'm seeing the same sort of stats on it as before. I'm currently waiting on O2 calling me today (as the said they would, not that i'm expecting them to bother). I've included my current stats and a recent graph of sync speed and noise margin. Doesn't look very pretty to me...

I'm also a bit concerned I'm going to be charged for BT's visit when they never found a problem with the line., something certainly isn't right and I don't want to end up paying for it.

Code: [Select]

Uptime: 0 days, 0:01:55
DSL Type: G.992.5 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,282 / 6,794
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 19.0
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 22.5 / 40.5
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.5 / 7.0
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / BDCM
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 273 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 567 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 1,000 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 20 / 32,022
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 20 / 364
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 320,913 / 353
I think the HEC errors shown aren't reset when there is a resync, so the value shown is probably around a day and a halfs worth.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[BritBrat]

Maybe the router is faulty and breaking down when it gets hot.

Can you try another?

Looks like you did, but did you also changed the power supply?

I would get a Netgear router off Ebay maybe a SKY version, reflash it and try that.

I would guess you will get the BT charge around £200.

[Oranged]

Almost certainly the router.....look at those Error Seconds for <2mins uptime 

The HEcs do reset so those shown are for start up.

[jeffbb]

Hi
quote : I checked the stats before he left, connected at a respectable 11mb or so.

that is about right for your attenuation on adsl2+.

This last SNR margin graph is a nigthmare. You appear to have disconnected about 15 times in an hour .

Can you switch off and leave everything to cool down .Say at least 12hrs.

Then restart everything thing . make sure routerstats is running .

Check and record  your stats immediately on reboot.

Record and save  SNR/synch graph and bitswap graphs for some  period say the first hour (depending on what is happening).


What we are trying to do is to see if there is a temperature problem.
btw how long was your router disconnected ,was it switched off?

Keep an eye on the stats and graphs note time of any significant changes.

Have you tried manipulating your cables, router etc to see if you have a bad connection problem.

Have you got another router ?(as suggested by Britbrat)

Regards Jeff

[mck1nlay]

Maybe the router is faulty and breaking down when it gets hot.

Can you try another?

Looks like you did, but did you also changed the power supply?

I would get a Netgear router off Ebay maybe a SKY version, reflash it and try that.

I would guess you will get the BT charge around £200.

I've tried two O2 Wireless Box II's (Thomson 585 v7 being the latest), both give similar results. I used different power supplies with each and I've tried multiple microfilters. I also have no extensions from the master socket at all. I'm now currently using an old Linksys WAG354G V.2, results so far are not good with the connection dropping out once already. As far as I can see this isn't an issue with a particular router or my internal wiring..


Regarding the HEC error count, I checked and it doesn't appear to reset in the router stats on a resync, unless is possible to get up to 300k errors in under 5 seconds? It only seems to reset on a cold/warm restart. Looks like the O2 box isn't reporting this properly.

Edit:

I wrote the above while Jeff was replying.

The O2 box was never switched off at the socket, so it was still powered on when it was reconnected to the phone socket as the BT engineer left. It was disconnected from the phoneline for around 35 minutes.

I'll do what you're suggesting Jeff and post again sometime tomorrow morning. Thanks for the help everyone.