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Author Topic: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration  (Read 22894 times)

Chrysalis

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #45 on: July 18, 2022, 04:50:39 AM »

I think every single report is from people on Openreach FTTP products not CF FTTP?
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bogof

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #46 on: July 18, 2022, 10:13:42 AM »

I think every single report is from people on Openreach FTTP products not CF FTTP?
I think that is the case.  Certainly for folk having had a Zen GEA Migration - I don't know if there have been any similar migrations from CF FTTP (I assume all the Zen CF FTTP start out as native Zen backhaul, but maybe not?).

Whether or not they have similar or different performance - who knows.  I've not seen many reports of performance on CF Zen FTTP to know how it generally performs.  Do they still have the gateway lottery that seems to be a "characteristic" of the Zen connections?

This was what I saw the other day, a few minutes apart on Manchester (worse latency yet better throughput) vs London gateway, to a London test site.  In the example of my case you might only really notice because it was an obvious step-change in behaviour before / after migration.  In the case of a connection that is freshly installed and above the minimums expected on the service, I guess you'd perhaps be none the wiser.

« Last Edit: July 18, 2022, 10:15:57 AM by bogof »
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Ixel

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #47 on: July 18, 2022, 10:33:11 AM »

I guess London's gateway is a little more congested, not sure though.

As for CF Zen 'lottery', from what I've heard it still happens on CF sadly.
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craigski

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #48 on: July 18, 2022, 10:43:42 AM »

Conspiracy theory - maybe some Zen users think they have a performance issue, and are running regular speed tests that are congesting the networks, that are causing the network to run slowly, so more users think they have a problem are running speed tests that are congesting the networks even more, causing more users to think they have a problem who are running speed tests congesting the network even more.........?
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #49 on: July 18, 2022, 10:30:16 PM »

I'm going to have to test Manchester now at some point, I always bounce the connection when I get on it due to the higher latency but curious if the throughput would be better.

I can't seem to get over around 200Mbit single-threaded for the last few days on what I assume is BTW seeing as I can't seem to get Zen to tell me my backhaul.

Looks like it might be a peer issue as TBB is somewhat better:


My VPS concurs something is a bit odd:
Code: [Select]
[ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bandwidth       Retr  Cwnd
[  4]   0.00-1.00   sec  8.77 MBytes  73.5 Mbits/sec    0    160 KBytes
[  4]   1.00-2.00   sec  21.8 MBytes   183 Mbits/sec    3    259 KBytes
[  4]   2.00-3.00   sec  23.2 MBytes   195 Mbits/sec    0    284 KBytes
[  4]   3.00-4.00   sec  25.2 MBytes   212 Mbits/sec    0    311 KBytes
[  4]   4.00-5.00   sec  29.7 MBytes   249 Mbits/sec    0    335 KBytes
[  4]   5.00-6.00   sec  32.4 MBytes   272 Mbits/sec    0    355 KBytes
[  4]   6.00-7.00   sec  33.6 MBytes   282 Mbits/sec    0    373 KBytes
[  4]   7.00-8.00   sec  34.7 MBytes   291 Mbits/sec    0    392 KBytes
[  4]   8.00-9.00   sec  43.5 MBytes   365 Mbits/sec    0    447 KBytes
[  4]   9.00-10.00  sec  52.5 MBytes   440 Mbits/sec    0    556 KBytes
[  4]  10.00-11.00  sec  57.9 MBytes   486 Mbits/sec   29    571 KBytes
[  4]  11.00-12.00  sec  50.8 MBytes   426 Mbits/sec    0    583 KBytes
[  4]  12.00-13.00  sec  66.1 MBytes   554 Mbits/sec    0    600 KBytes
[  4]  13.00-14.00  sec  57.8 MBytes   485 Mbits/sec    0    614 KBytes
[  4]  14.00-15.00  sec  59.4 MBytes   498 Mbits/sec    0    626 KBytes
[  4]  15.00-16.00  sec  63.8 MBytes   536 Mbits/sec    0    666 KBytes
[  4]  16.00-17.00  sec  69.4 MBytes   582 Mbits/sec    0    723 KBytes
[  4]  17.00-18.00  sec  69.6 MBytes   584 Mbits/sec   93    573 KBytes
[  4]  18.00-19.00  sec  58.9 MBytes   494 Mbits/sec    0    639 KBytes
[  4]  19.00-20.00  sec  59.3 MBytes   497 Mbits/sec    0    718 KBytes
[  4]  20.00-21.00  sec  78.2 MBytes   656 Mbits/sec    0    752 KBytes
[  4]  21.00-22.00  sec  68.4 MBytes   574 Mbits/sec    0    782 KBytes
[  4]  22.00-23.00  sec  68.2 MBytes   572 Mbits/sec    0    793 KBytes
[  4]  23.00-24.00  sec  66.7 MBytes   559 Mbits/sec    0    802 KBytes
[  4]  24.00-25.00  sec  74.6 MBytes   626 Mbits/sec    0    802 KBytes
[  4]  25.00-26.00  sec  80.1 MBytes   672 Mbits/sec    0    802 KBytes
[  4]  26.00-27.00  sec  82.8 MBytes   695 Mbits/sec    0    805 KBytes
[  4]  27.00-28.00  sec  66.7 MBytes   560 Mbits/sec    0    812 KBytes
[  4]  28.00-29.00  sec  71.8 MBytes   602 Mbits/sec    0    827 KBytes
[  4]  29.00-30.00  sec  81.0 MBytes   680 Mbits/sec    0    858 KBytes
[  4]  30.00-31.00  sec  82.3 MBytes   690 Mbits/sec    0    901 KBytes
[  4]  31.00-32.00  sec  90.5 MBytes   759 Mbits/sec    0    963 KBytes
[  4]  32.00-33.00  sec  88.6 MBytes   743 Mbits/sec    0   1.00 MBytes
[  4]  33.00-34.00  sec   106 MBytes   891 Mbits/sec    0   1.00 MBytes
[  4]  34.00-35.00  sec  81.8 MBytes   687 Mbits/sec   57    795 KBytes
[  4]  35.00-36.00  sec  87.9 MBytes   737 Mbits/sec    0    881 KBytes
[  4]  36.00-37.00  sec  81.3 MBytes   682 Mbits/sec    0    977 KBytes
[  4]  37.00-38.00  sec  96.0 MBytes   805 Mbits/sec    0   1024 KBytes
[  4]  38.00-39.00  sec  82.6 MBytes   693 Mbits/sec    0   1.01 MBytes
[  4]  39.00-40.00  sec  80.7 MBytes   677 Mbits/sec    0   1.01 MBytes
[  4]  40.00-41.00  sec  70.2 MBytes   589 Mbits/sec    5    758 KBytes
[  4]  41.00-42.00  sec  60.6 MBytes   509 Mbits/sec    1    564 KBytes
[  4]  42.00-43.00  sec  57.8 MBytes   485 Mbits/sec    0    608 KBytes
[  4]  43.00-44.00  sec  57.2 MBytes   480 Mbits/sec    0    645 KBytes
[  4]  44.00-45.00  sec  56.9 MBytes   477 Mbits/sec    0    663 KBytes
[  4]  45.00-46.00  sec  54.0 MBytes   453 Mbits/sec    0    672 KBytes
[  4]  46.00-47.00  sec  58.7 MBytes   493 Mbits/sec    0    675 KBytes
[  4]  47.00-48.00  sec  60.8 MBytes   510 Mbits/sec    0    675 KBytes
[  4]  48.00-49.00  sec  66.8 MBytes   560 Mbits/sec    0    675 KBytes
[  4]  49.00-50.00  sec  73.2 MBytes   614 Mbits/sec    0    680 KBytes
[  4]  50.00-51.00  sec  74.6 MBytes   625 Mbits/sec    0    693 KBytes
^C[  4]  51.00-51.47  sec  29.1 MBytes   521 Mbits/sec    0    701 KBytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bandwidth       Retr
[  4]   0.00-51.47  sec  3.18 GBytes   530 Mbits/sec  188             sender

Interestingly, UDP is more what I'd expect:
Code: [Select]
[ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bandwidth       Total Datagrams
[  4]   0.00-1.00   sec  93.7 MBytes   786 Mbits/sec  67877 
[  4]   1.00-2.00   sec  92.8 MBytes   778 Mbits/sec  67200 
[  4]   2.00-3.00   sec   109 MBytes   918 Mbits/sec  79286 
[  4]   3.00-4.00   sec   107 MBytes   895 Mbits/sec  77293 
[  4]   4.00-5.00   sec   109 MBytes   917 Mbits/sec  79182 
[  4]   5.00-6.00   sec  99.3 MBytes   833 Mbits/sec  71920 
[  4]   6.00-7.00   sec  99.1 MBytes   832 Mbits/sec  71788 
[  4]   7.00-8.00   sec  97.5 MBytes   818 Mbits/sec  70620 
[  4]   8.00-9.00   sec   109 MBytes   915 Mbits/sec  79003 
[  4]   9.00-10.00  sec   106 MBytes   892 Mbits/sec  77029 
[  4]  10.00-11.00  sec  92.1 MBytes   772 Mbits/sec  66660 
[  4]  11.00-12.00  sec   109 MBytes   911 Mbits/sec  78677 
[  4]  12.00-13.00  sec   109 MBytes   913 Mbits/sec  78850 
[  4]  13.00-14.00  sec  98.5 MBytes   827 Mbits/sec  71355 
[  4]  14.00-15.00  sec  94.8 MBytes   795 Mbits/sec  68670 
[  4]  15.00-16.00  sec   108 MBytes   904 Mbits/sec  78050 
[  4]  16.00-17.00  sec   109 MBytes   915 Mbits/sec  79020 
[  4]  17.00-18.00  sec   110 MBytes   920 Mbits/sec  79381 
[  4]  18.00-19.00  sec   108 MBytes   907 Mbits/sec  78289 
[  4]  19.00-20.00  sec  92.2 MBytes   774 Mbits/sec  66783 
[  4]  20.00-21.00  sec  96.7 MBytes   811 Mbits/sec  70011 
[  4]  21.00-22.00  sec   102 MBytes   853 Mbits/sec  73665 
[  4]  22.00-23.00  sec  97.4 MBytes   817 Mbits/sec  70557 
[  4]  23.00-24.00  sec   105 MBytes   878 Mbits/sec  75753 
[  4]  24.00-25.00  sec  99.9 MBytes   838 Mbits/sec  72345 
[  4]  25.00-26.00  sec   109 MBytes   916 Mbits/sec  79082 
[  4]  26.00-27.00  sec   109 MBytes   918 Mbits/sec  79211 
[  4]  27.00-28.00  sec   105 MBytes   885 Mbits/sec  76365 
[  4]  28.00-29.00  sec   103 MBytes   864 Mbits/sec  74621 
[  4]  29.00-30.00  sec   109 MBytes   911 Mbits/sec  78627 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bandwidth       Jitter    Lost/Total Datagrams
[  4]   0.00-30.00  sec  3.02 GBytes   864 Mbits/sec  0.017 ms  2128/2237169 (0.095%)

I can't perform a test with an idle connection so some variance is expected.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2022, 12:35:22 AM by Alex Atkin UK »
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #50 on: July 19, 2022, 03:05:12 AM »

A bit better but still seems to take unreasonably long to ramp up:
Code: [Select]
[ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bitrate
[  5]   0.00-1.00   sec  10.2 MBytes  85.7 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   1.00-2.00   sec  28.5 MBytes   239 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   2.00-3.00   sec  41.5 MBytes   348 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   3.00-4.00   sec  52.3 MBytes   438 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   4.00-5.00   sec  60.5 MBytes   508 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   5.00-6.00   sec  62.1 MBytes   521 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   6.00-7.00   sec  67.1 MBytes   563 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   7.00-8.00   sec  71.1 MBytes   597 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   8.00-9.00   sec  51.2 MBytes   429 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]   9.00-10.00  sec  54.4 MBytes   457 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  10.00-11.00  sec  58.4 MBytes   490 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  11.00-12.00  sec  64.5 MBytes   541 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  12.00-13.00  sec  67.9 MBytes   570 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  13.00-14.00  sec  68.8 MBytes   577 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  14.00-15.00  sec  70.9 MBytes   595 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  15.00-16.00  sec  72.6 MBytes   609 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  16.00-17.00  sec  72.2 MBytes   605 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  17.00-18.00  sec  75.0 MBytes   629 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  18.00-19.00  sec  74.1 MBytes   621 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  19.00-20.00  sec  69.2 MBytes   580 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  20.00-21.00  sec  74.6 MBytes   626 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  21.00-22.00  sec  76.1 MBytes   638 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  22.00-23.00  sec  76.6 MBytes   642 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  23.00-24.00  sec  79.4 MBytes   666 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  24.00-25.00  sec  77.3 MBytes   648 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  25.00-26.00  sec  90.2 MBytes   756 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  26.00-27.00  sec  86.5 MBytes   726 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  27.00-28.00  sec  91.6 MBytes   769 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  28.00-29.00  sec  86.8 MBytes   729 Mbits/sec                 
[  5]  29.00-30.00  sec  91.8 MBytes   770 Mbits/sec                 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bitrate         Retr
[  5]   0.00-30.00  sec  1.98 GBytes   566 Mbits/sec    1             sender
[  5]   0.00-30.00  sec  1.98 GBytes   566 Mbits/sec                  receiver

Code: [Select]
[ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bitrate         Jitter    Lost/Total Datagrams
[  5]   0.00-1.00   sec  92.1 MBytes   772 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  314/66445 (0.47%) 
[  5]   1.00-2.00   sec   102 MBytes   858 Mbits/sec  0.023 ms  0/73474 (0%) 
[  5]   2.00-3.00   sec  93.9 MBytes   788 Mbits/sec  0.026 ms  0/67443 (0%) 
[  5]   3.00-4.00   sec  96.0 MBytes   805 Mbits/sec  0.029 ms  0/68942 (0%) 
[  5]   4.00-5.00   sec  89.9 MBytes   754 Mbits/sec  0.017 ms  0/64534 (0%) 
[  5]   5.00-6.00   sec   103 MBytes   861 Mbits/sec  0.017 ms  98/73818 (0.13%) 
[  5]   6.00-7.00   sec   102 MBytes   854 Mbits/sec  0.019 ms  0/73076 (0%) 
[  5]   7.00-8.00   sec   104 MBytes   870 Mbits/sec  0.017 ms  0/74447 (0%) 
[  5]   8.00-9.00   sec   103 MBytes   865 Mbits/sec  0.020 ms  0/74061 (0%) 
[  5]   9.00-10.00  sec   103 MBytes   868 Mbits/sec  0.019 ms  0/74278 (0%) 
[  5]  10.00-11.00  sec   100 MBytes   842 Mbits/sec  0.017 ms  0/72064 (0%) 
[  5]  11.00-12.00  sec  99.7 MBytes   836 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  2384/73954 (3.2%) 
[  5]  12.00-13.00  sec   102 MBytes   852 Mbits/sec  0.019 ms  0/72966 (0%) 
[  5]  13.00-14.00  sec  99.7 MBytes   837 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  0/71631 (0%) 
[  5]  14.00-15.00  sec   104 MBytes   872 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  0/74636 (0%) 
[  5]  15.00-16.00  sec   103 MBytes   866 Mbits/sec  0.019 ms  0/74182 (0%) 
[  5]  16.00-17.00  sec   102 MBytes   854 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  0/73126 (0%) 
[  5]  17.00-18.00  sec   105 MBytes   877 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  0/75121 (0%) 
[  5]  18.00-19.00  sec   104 MBytes   870 Mbits/sec  0.019 ms  0/74527 (0%) 
[  5]  19.00-20.00  sec   101 MBytes   846 Mbits/sec  0.024 ms  0/72416 (0%) 
[  5]  20.00-21.00  sec  92.9 MBytes   779 Mbits/sec  0.030 ms  0/66695 (0%) 
[  5]  21.00-22.00  sec   101 MBytes   848 Mbits/sec  0.020 ms  0/72573 (0%) 
[  5]  22.00-23.00  sec   103 MBytes   864 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  0/73978 (0%) 
[  5]  23.00-24.00  sec   101 MBytes   850 Mbits/sec  0.024 ms  0/72748 (0%) 
[  5]  24.00-25.00  sec   104 MBytes   870 Mbits/sec  0.017 ms  0/74512 (0%) 
[  5]  25.00-26.00  sec   103 MBytes   864 Mbits/sec  0.022 ms  0/73977 (0%) 
[  5]  26.00-27.00  sec   101 MBytes   843 Mbits/sec  0.019 ms  0/72205 (0%) 
[  5]  27.00-28.00  sec   102 MBytes   854 Mbits/sec  0.023 ms  0/73145 (0%) 
[  5]  28.00-29.00  sec  93.0 MBytes   780 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  0/66816 (0%) 
[  5]  29.00-30.00  sec   104 MBytes   872 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  0/74668 (0%) 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bitrate         Jitter    Lost/Total Datagrams
[  5]   0.00-30.00  sec  2.95 GBytes   844 Mbits/sec  0.000 ms  0/2166458 (0%)  sender
[SUM]  0.0-30.0 sec  3047 datagrams received out-of-order
[  5]   0.00-30.00  sec  2.94 GBytes   842 Mbits/sec  0.018 ms  2796/2166458 (0.13%)  receiver
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skyeci

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #51 on: July 19, 2022, 05:58:37 AM »

How are you running those latter tests? Thought I would run them on my zen 900 for comparison.

Thanks
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #52 on: July 19, 2022, 06:10:08 AM »

The previous tests were from my main Linux box, the second two were using iperf3 on my VPS in server mode connecting using iperf3 on pfSense, so that I could remove NAT as any possible issue.

I have PMed more details but bear in mind that VPS is IPv6 aware so you might need to tell iperf3 which protocol to use.  I forgot to check if iperf3 supports IPv6 and test that separately.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2022, 06:19:17 AM by Alex Atkin UK »
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bogof

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #53 on: July 19, 2022, 07:54:23 AM »

I don't think the gateway story is quite as simple as Manchester=higher throughput, higher latency;  I think perhaps the best overall gateway for me seems to be London  lo0-0.bng2.ixn-lon.zen.net.uk.  The other three London ones are generally a bit worse.  The Manchester ones perform faster than the two slower London ones for some tests into London.  But Zen's own Speedtest server for me on any gateway is always well below par and Zen's own server via Manchester for me is the worst of all, often recording results below Zen's guarantee., which is useful I guess.

I did a bunch of testing again yesterday evening with the Fritzbox router "just to make sure" as Zen are insisting they need to get an Openreach engineer out to check the line (even though it makes line rate to some servers and some gateways).  Seems fundamentally to be a waste of time to me because of being able to achieve line rate with their router sometimes (or with mine), just depending on where I end up or try to go, but what do I know.
Anyway, I guess I should be grateful it is a next step. 

The Zen staffer said they'd prefer to work out what it is rather than just migrate me back as the plan is that the BTW links would be removed eventually and then the Zen one would be the only option.  Which I can understand at a technical / operational / commercial level, but as an end user it's a bit of a bitter pill.  The BT check of the line is the next step as all the remote checks they can do on the line check out with no fault. 

Of course, there is the possibility that the Speedtest anomalies and the gateway variability is just a separate thing to the migration; but I can't shake the feeling that due to the coincidental timing one is exasperating the other.

It does look like separately the Ubiquiti UDM Pro SE only just / not quite manages to saturate the link when routing through it over PPPoE, though running the speedtests locally on the UDM over SSH to the internet does saturate the link (and has similar gateway dependent issues).  It's a bit annoying that the PPPoE doesn't quite cut it, and I'm debating whether to hold onto the router as it's still within returns window.  Though I otherwise like it, and am wondering if it is possible to use another device as a plain PPPoE "modem" and provide a DHCP IP based connection to the router, but without ending up doing double NAT, and it working seamlessly if Zen re-balance me onto a different gateway (ie the DHCP IP link then getting taken down and up gracefully etc).  Has anyone set up such a thing in the past?
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bogof

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #54 on: July 19, 2022, 07:57:51 AM »

The previous tests were from my main Linux box, the second two were using iperf3 on my VPS in server mode connecting using iperf3 on pfSense, so that I could remove NAT as any possible issue.

I have PMed more details but bear in mind that VPS is IPv6 aware so you might need to tell iperf3 which protocol to use.  I forgot to check if iperf3 supports IPv6 and test that separately.
What VPS service are you using?
I had a quick look at setting one up to check with, but the costs look like more than I want to spend to get something I know could push the connection repeatably.
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bogof

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #55 on: July 19, 2022, 08:52:03 AM »

Of course, the Openreach guy came, checked the light levels and connection and found it to be fine. 
He mentioned that last week he attended maybe 3 post-Zen migration "speed not what it ought to be" type issues, with similar results (all checked out fine from his point of view).
We shall see what's next.
Edit: there was one that the OR engineer attended thst a fibre clean fixed, so there is I guess some evidence for the benefit of sending them out in some cases... :)
« Last Edit: July 20, 2022, 08:35:35 AM by bogof »
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craigski

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #56 on: July 19, 2022, 12:53:09 PM »

but I can't shake the feeling that due to the coincidental timing one is exasperating the other.

Can I give you a little shake please? If so read on :)

I checked the spec of my car, it says it can do a maximum speed of 'X', but I don't take it to a race track every day to verify the maximum speed, when I just need to pop to the shops.

I think you maybe chasing your tail. Forget the marketing fluff on these products. My expectation of a '900' residential type product is it should perform at 450-900 most of the time. If you are expecting an 'average of 900', I think your expectations maybe too high.

I know it can be frustrating sometimes when there is an expectation of something, and that expectation is not met, but its sometimes worth revaluating the original expectation, putting the potential 'issue' into context. If there is an issue with Zen network infrastructure, I am sure their clever network engineers will fix at some point.

Looking at your speed test results above, 739-925 down, consistent 111 up, if I was getting that, I would be happy  :) You found a gateway that works for you, keep the PPPoE up on that gateway and enjoy.  :)
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bogof

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #57 on: July 19, 2022, 03:04:02 PM »

Can I give you a little shake please? If so read on :)

I checked the spec of my car, it says it can do a maximum speed of 'X', but I don't take it to a race track every day to verify the maximum speed, when I just need to pop to the shops.

I think you maybe chasing your tail. Forget the marketing fluff on these products. My expectation of a '900' residential type product is it should perform at 450-900 most of the time. If you are expecting an 'average of 900', I think your expectations maybe too high.

I know it can be frustrating sometimes when there is an expectation of something, and that expectation is not met, but its sometimes worth revaluating the original expectation, putting the potential 'issue' into context. If there is an issue with Zen network infrastructure, I am sure their clever network engineers will fix at some point.

Looking at your speed test results above, 739-925 down, consistent 111 up, if I was getting that, I would be happy  :) You found a gateway that works for you, keep the PPPoE up on that gateway and enjoy.  :)
The sentiment isn't lost on me, and to be frank I've got better things to do with my time than wait for Openreach engineers to tell me what I already know...  However the 739 was just an example making a point to Alex on a particular speed test server in London (not the Zen one).  Others may vary depending on the gateway, with the Zen one coming in below their guarantee quite a lot of the time.

Gateway hopping to get a better one is just naff.  It was years ago when I last had to endure that rubbish with Plusnet on FTTC and I did indeed make some custom scripts on an OpenWRT running hacked up BT home hub that would drop crap connections.  This GEA change has taken me from not really caring about gateway changing under me to it now being worth trying to jump.  If someone would moan at me about something loading slow in the house I could always previously just pull up the AppleTV speedchecker and instantly see that the connection is basically fine.  Now the connection more often than not looks like it's not particularly fine. 

The "average 900" comes straight out of the Zen order info, and I really do believe that on average you should be able to expect 900Mbps on a well running 1G network outside of  obvious things like peak hours or very unlucky local contention ratios (30x 900Mbps gamers living in a culdesac all downloading the latest shoot'em'up...).  There's no way Zen have the same volume of traffic at 1am or 9am as they do at 9pm, yet these numbers don't seem to shift massively with what you might expect from normal contention coming and going, which I'm sure means something a bit deeper going on.  I'm sure they do seem to be having some kind of issue with migrated circuits in some circumstances - witness folk being unmigrated in some locations - and without people who have an interest in trying to get the peak performance out of things I wouldn't like to bet that issues would naturally get full attention.

So for now I'll carry on complaining... :)  At the end of the day, if my money could get a better service elsewhere, then I think why ride it out, pursuing getting out of contract makes sense.  They can improve it, or if not I'll move somewhere else.  In the meantime such posts provide a possibly useful insight to would-be customers who can consider if the kind of variation discussed might or might not be worse than their expectation.
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #58 on: July 19, 2022, 10:23:04 PM »

If its not performing at full speed at 3am then I definitely think there IS a problem.

Were a technical bunch on here, if we can see a problem we want to know what it is.  Its particularly pertinent as any problem Zen are having now could get much much worse if nobody is looking into it.  People are still discussing why they will never go back to Zen because of their last single-thread performance issue, we're doing them a big favour if we nip in the bud a second issue before it starts impacting more of the customer base.

I don't think any of us expect 900Mbit 24/7 and my contribution to this thread now is more a curiosity than anything, especially if I'm NOT on GEA but still something feels off.

My VPS is Mythic Beasts but a legacy BHost product.  If I were getting a new one today I'd go with IONOS, in fact I got a US VPS a few months back on offer for £2.50/month that I use to bypass geoblocking.
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j0hn

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Re: Worse Zen FTTP 900 performance following GEA migration
« Reply #59 on: July 19, 2022, 11:00:15 PM »

It's a known issue that Zen have acknowledged and are investigating.
I agree to expect 900Mb/s 24/7 on a contended residential service is expecting too much. Never getting 900Mb/s isn't right though.
He's had a recent GEA migration which coincided with a large drop in throughput. That's exactly what other users are reporting.
He absolutely should be reporting it.

My expectation of a '900' residential type product is it should perform at 450-900 most of the time. If you are expecting an 'average of 900', I think your expectations maybe too high.

It is quite literally sold as having an average of 900Mb/s.
Zen have Samknows boxes in the homes of random, geographically diverse users and they must meet an average of 900Mb/s to be able to advertise the service as it is.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2022, 11:09:01 PM by j0hn »
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