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[burakkucat]

My HG633 supplied by Talktalk is an all in one router/modem. I assume that process still applies.

Yes, indeed. 

[DMZ]

Thank you.

Here's hoping this can help me. 

If it comes back with vengeance I will kick the ECI cabinet when I pass it. 

[DMZ]

My line is certainly taken hostage by DLM's interleaving:

Downstream Interleave Depth: 1858
Upstream Interleave Depth: 1

My actual downstream sync is: 64.020
My actual upload sync is: 20000

Upstream SNR: 6dB
Downstream SNR: 6.5-6.8dB

I again think I will be dropping below 6dB SNR eventually as my upstream SNR won't budge above the target SNR of 6.

I'm not taking into account of maximum data rates as I'm still interleaved.

The downstream interleave depth has dropped from 1865 which is a small start.

If anything (Too early to tell.) it hasn't made much difference. Downstream sync is slighlty less than it was before.

I will have to shake off interleaving if that's even possible. Up until last week I was on fast even when I was on 4.2dB.

As previously posted I should have not messed around as much as I did. As it's caught up with me.

Looks like I'll be in the same boat as kitz eventually. Whatever is causing these silly issues, I wish it would go.

We might just have to wait it all out. For me; getting off interleaving would be a BIG start, the SNR stuff...I don't know anymore.

Thanks again anyhow for the tips guys. 

[ejs]

The interleaving depth dropping from 1865 to 1858 is not significant, and does not indicate that the DLM has reduced the interleaving depth. The exact interleaving depth, and the other framing parameters, and the exact speed, are likely to vary slightly each time the DSL connects. The DLM will set in the line profile a minimum INP value, and a maximum delay, and then it will be for the modem and DSLAM to work out the exact framing parameters (such as the interleaving depth, block size and amount of FEC data) to fit the INP and delay constraints while maximizing the bandwidth.

[DMZ]

@ejs Thanks for the detailed reply. That makes more sense.

My upstream SNR is dropping again below 6dB. Downstream SNR still fine.

I'm kicking that cabinet now...

[Chrysalis]

I see kitz is now back on fast path but at a lower sync speed previous to the mess on her line.

94 ES in 6 hours, so providing the ES rate is steady it shouldnt get DLM'd again.

SNRM is still very erratic.

[skyeci]

doh! - back to oscillating snr today...hope it clears as quick as it came..

[kitz]

I see kitz is now back on fast path but at a lower sync speed previous to the mess on her line.

Yep.  Prior to this mess starting my attainable was something like 83Mbps.  Now interleaving has been removed Im currently syncing at 76Mbps, but my SNRm has gone down again so if I did a resync now I'd only get about 72Mbps.
My upstream is oscillating quite badly between 12.2 and 7.8, but I doubt Openreach would do anything because the upstream is still syncing at 20Mbps.

[les-70]

  The behavior is very odd and puzzling.   Currently apart from the snrm wobbles the line looks fine and it hard to say whether your reduced speed is the ever increasing crosstalk with FTTC take up of something else.  When you had the error burst and went interleaved it looked like a real and severe impact but now it is just puzzling. I had severe error and snrm wobble response from xmas lights but not wobbles without horrendous errors,  as you now have.  Have you tried a very different modem like a HG612 and different PSU? Sampling with dslstats separate from MDWS at about 5s rather than 60s might show if the apparent 5-6mins frequency is an aliasing effect.

[DMZ]

Great to see DLM let you go kitz!

I'm still stuck on interleaving, how long did you have to wait for DLM to release you from interleaving?

I understand it varies from line to line, my uptime is 7 days, 23 hours - Nearly 8.  At least it's been stable. Guess I'm lucky.

After all of this I wish I never messed around with my router in the first place. I bet it'd be fine this very moment if I ignored my stats that night...

I miss my fastpath. 

[kitz]

  The behavior is very odd and puzzling.   Currently apart from the snrm wobbles the line looks fine and it hard to say whether your reduced speed is the ever increasing crosstalk with FTTC take up of something else.  When you had the error burst and went interleaved it looked like a real and severe impact but now it is just puzzling. I had severe error and snrm wobble response from xmas lights but not wobbles without horrendous errors,  as you now have.  Have you tried a very different modem like a HG612 and different PSU? Sampling with dslstats separate from MDWS at about 5s rather than 60s might show if the apparent 5-6mins frequency is an aliasing effect.

The oscillations and drop in SNRm happened at about 4.30am after an outage of 15mins, so I doubt that at that time it would be a new crosstalker coming on line - nor would it account for the outage.   Hence the topic title. 

I bought a new but ex-Zen VMG1312-B10D on ebay to see how a different chipset performed.  I didn't leave it on very long as the sync rate was lower (quite a lot on the upstream) and the error rate was higher.   At least it ruled out the VMG8324.

I havent tried changing the sampling time as I have DSLstats running in compatibility mode.  However I shall try it and see what happens.

Re errors - The line is running on amber E/Secs most days.  It reaches amber MTBE for Standard profile by about 3-4 pm, and usually towards the end of the day for Speed MBTE although sometimes I may scrape through on green on the odd occasion.    If I was on Standard profile, rather than speed the chances are extremely high that I would be permanently interleaved.   I've tripped red a couple of times since this very first started.

how long did you have to wait for DLM to release you from interleaving?

Cant recall exactly as I have other stuff on and dont watch it every day.   I think it was 10 days but I should be able to tell from MDWS.

----

ETA - Nov 29th to Dec 14th so thats 16 days.

I note you are with TT who use Standard profile.   I'm with Plusnet who use Speed profile.   
I was considering changing ISPs a few months ago, but I know that if I went with an ISP who used Standard then most likely I'd permanently trip the interleaved status. 

[les-70]

  Thanks for the clarification.  From MDWS you lost most speed back on Sept 2 with what looked like cross talk.  The wobbles in snrm started Oct 19th and have gone and then returned a few times since.   The wobbles only seem to a give slight extra attainable reduction but about 5 times the errors and they, as you say, don't seem to be associated with a cross talk change.   It may be worth trying the very different HG612 modem but I agree that if two modems work it is not likely a modem fault.  If you used the same PSU when you changed  Zyxels that PSU would be worth changing.

[DMZ]

Seems I'm in a bit of a pickle if a standard profile won't revert back after being interleaved.

It's happened once before with TalkTalk and eventually went back to fastpath, back then I checked my stats a couple of times a week unlike now.

I will just have to sit tight and wait it out then. 

[kitz]

@les-70.  Thanks for your input

The reduction in sync on 9th of Sept does indeed look like crosstalk and I accepted that.  However it did come back up again to 80Mbps on Oct 5th after I did a resync after noticing I had surplus SNRm   It stayed sync'd at 80Mb with 5.5 SNRM until the Oscillations first started on Oct 19th at 04.45am. 

I know is several pages ago now but the times are documented in my first post and how the spikiness came, then went after more down time.  Then the spikiness re-occured after a remote sync that occured at 04.55am on the 27th and this is when they became permanent.    The oscillations do certainly not appear to be related to crosstalk.

may be worth trying the very different HG612 modem

Unfortunately I dont have it atm after lending it out to someone on a Huawei cab that was given an ECI modem by Openreach at the beginning of the year when they got vdsl. I could get the HG612 back if need be, but I cba going round to swap it out with something else. Hence me picking up a VMG1312 to test with.

If you used the same PSU when you changed  Zyxels that PSU would be worth changing.

Yes I swapped out the PSU and even the modem lead.   Modem is sited right next to the SSFP.  I have no internal wiring at all now.
Quiet Line Test seems OK when tested with both my cordless..  and an old corded phone.

Sampling with dslstats separate from MDWS at about 5s rather than 60s might show if the apparent 5-6mins frequency is an aliasing effect.

As you suggested Ive just done an hours worth of logging every 6 seconds.  The oscillations are definitely cyclic and occur every 5 mins 30 seconds. - See below.

I've attached break downs of both upstream and downstream tones, showing that U2 is the most severly affected.
I had previously noticed that it only affected D1, D2, D3 and U2 but wasnt quite sure what to make of that.   Obviously though both U0 and U1 have PSD masks applied.

Ive also included the graph showing effects of the oscillations on my sync speed which is 68Mb to 76Mb.

[les-70]

  I can't think what might give such a strange and regular impact.    In desperation i would be inclined to wonder about powering down each evening and up again in the morning.  If that does anything is would seem that it must be the DSLAM or your equipment.