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[torqpoc]

Hello Walter,

When I last spoke to the UKOnline tech guys, I got through to the same engineer who logged the lift and shift with BTO, who pretty much said a lift and shift is what they (not sure who he means by they) consider to be the last resort. He said he needed to speak to a specialist within UKOnline and would call me back.

When he called back that was what I was told was going to happen. I did mention I wasn't too keen on losing bandwidth, as essentially all I need to do is not answer the phone, however bizarre that sounds. But i'll be honest i'm kind of feeling a bit deflated and defeated. I did push when all of this happened to speak to a supervisor, and did threaten to switch ISP which got them to push BTO in the first place.

If the ultimate outcome is 4Mb and stable i'll have to resign myself to that. 4Mb is about what I think i'll get with a 14db SnR.

I'll try and find some more gusto and give them another call tomorrow and ask to speak to a supervisor again to express my lack of enthusiasm as you recommend.


Cheers,
T

[attachment deleted by admin]

[torqpoc]

Hi again,

Right quick update. I called UKOnline again, asked to speak to the supervisor who I rambled at for about 5 minutes explaining everything. It seems BTW are outright lying as they state when the lift and shift was performed the DLM was told to retrain the line. However there has been no change to the Bras, no change whatsoever in the sync speed, SnR, nothing. It truly seems "stuck" on someone else's profile.

So, I asked for that to be investigated and a general what the fiddlesticks is going on. The chap said he'd call me back, which he duly did saying he'd spoken to BT and they are "investigating" and have asked for another appointment. I wasn't asked to be home at any specific time so i'm guessing it's an appointment to send an engineer back out.

I'd like to ask for advice now.. I know I can keep flogging this dead BTW horse until it either works or they cap me down to 2Mb saying this will fix the problem. As it stands currently (please see the attachment in the post above) i'm not even getting anywhere close to the 6Mb I should be.. more like 1.5 to 2. It's worsened since the lift and shift.

Do I:
1) Keep fighting
2) Suck it up
3) Change ISP (there's no LLU at the exchange) in the hopes another one will push harder
4) Change my phone number/phone provider

I'm getting very irrate with this now, i'm sick of waiting for what should be a simple thing to be fixed.

Cheers,
T

[kitz]

Definitely sounds like a HR fault on the line to me, and increasing the SNRM is a bit of a cop out :/

See ~ adsl drops out when phone call is made or received. 

Most cases ARE incorrectly fitted/faulty filters..   so we have to check those possibilities have been eliminated first....  then its most likely a fault on the physical line itself..   
See also the 2 sections below that because both are related to HR faults.

Usually it turns out to be either a worn cable or corroded joint.

[torqpoc]

Hello Kitz!

I have one of these which I bought when I read your site initially and followed a link about how to fix SnR problems:
http://www.adslnation.co.uk/products/xf-1e.php

Just to check I also have one of the white BT branded ADSL filters, exactly like the filter the OpenReach engineer utilised when he came to do tests.

I've done the 17070 option 2 (so did he) and there's not a thing. I've also had BT do a line test by claiming there was noise on the line.. *cough* well I had to try everything =)

I have a very old style BT branded mastersocket, i'm plugged into the test socket as there is a terrible extension connected to the bottom face plate. I've take the entire front plate off to take a "look" and it looks very much like this:
http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=7479.0;attach=3749;image

There is only one phone point, i'm currently using the x1-fe as it used to have slighter better attenuation than the white bt filter. In there is plugged my DG834GT, with a very short RJ11 (it is 11 isn't it) cable and a cordless Panasonic phone. I've also tried a BT branded wired phone, just in case it was the cordless phone causing interference.

Cheers,
T

p.s. your site rocks!

Edit - Bras woke up it seems

[attachment deleted by admin]

[torqpoc]

Hello,

Just a quick update from me. It seems the Bras profile is now working. There is however something still of concern which is that the target SnR doesn't seem to be set to 6db, as I am never syncing at 6db, always at 8 or 9 (or in between). This isn't too bad for the sync rate, it's sitting around 7000kbps, i'm ok with that.

Bras is currently at 6Mbits, that's ok even though I don't agree with any kind of artifical capping, c'est la vie.

I tried with Routerstats to set the target SnR to 6db, which I think can be done with the DGTeam firmware and low and behold, I sync'd at 7500 with SnR of 6.5. That makes me think the DLM is either being artificially bumped up as I was told was going to be the case.

Incoming phone calls still cause a drop out as of today.

Cheers,
T

[roseway]

It looks as though your target noise margin has been increased to 9 dB as a result of the earlier instability. If you're still getting connection drops caused by incoming phone calls, then you still have a problem with a probable line fault.

[torqpoc]

Hello folks!

Right-o, quick udpate from me on this continuing issue. FYI Walter I did PM that chap you mentioned and am considering switching ISP, but I wanted to get this fixed first.

So, UKOnline have been very kind an have chased BTW who in their infinite wisdom have followed this path in "trying" to fix this issue of the connection dropping everytime an inbound call to the land line is answered:
Target SnR changed from 6db to 9db: no change
Target SnR changed from 9db to 12db: no change
Target SnR changed from 12db to 15db: no change.

All in all i've gone from a 6.5Mbit connection to a 4.5Mbit connection now with BTOpenreach/Wholesale having done all the tests they deem consistent with trying to fix this problem: Copper pair test, etc..

I've now asked UKOnline to tell BTW to reset the target SnR back to 6db as i'm essentially just getting a throttled connection for nothing.

Oh the fun..

Cheers,
T

[torqpoc]

Hello,
Really not sure what to make of this. Phoned UKOnline to ask what is happening with the SnR change, and BTW/BTO have asked for an appointment to come check if there isn't some kind of electro/magnetic interference causing the issues.

Do they mean REIN?

Cheers,
T

[roseway]

There are other types of EM interference apart from REIN (which is specifically impulse noise). But anyway, if they want to send an engineer to do a check for EM interference, that sounds like a good suggestion.

[torqpoc]

Hello and thanks for that =)

I am wondering, if the enginneer does turn up tomorrow at the house is there anyway I can "force" him to change the master socket seeing as those it's very old (see links in this thread for what mine looks like), one of those with the old old style BT symbol on it and massive capacitor, for one of the newer style with inbuilt filter? A friend has told me it could be this which may be the cause/root of the problem?

Cheers,
T

[waltergmw]

Hi T,

Tea and bacon butties usually work quite well !!!!!!


Kind regards,
Walter

[torqpoc]

Hey Walter,

 :clap2: 

Thanks for that, that really made me chuckle! I'll try this super sleuth approach =)

Cheers,
T

[torqpoc]

Alrighty then...

Well first off there seems to be huge disparity between OpenReach engineers. This latest chap was awesome. First off he went to the green cab and changed the filters or somesuch there, as he stated that they used to use one manufacturers bits which weren't up to standard. That was changed. He then went to the exchange and changed the E-side pair.

Attenuation went from 44db to 52db, I notified him of this and he changed it back. He then came to the house, changed the master socket completely and put one of those pre filtered dual faceplates on it with an inbuilt bell wire filter. Excuse the terminology I didn't understand everything he said.

He then proceeded to investigate the drops when an inbound call was being answered. I showed him routerstats and the drops as they happened, he then disconnected all my equipment and tested with his and weirdly he didn't see half as many CRC errors, or drops on his equipment. He then got a radio out, he said it was at 690hz on the medium wave, checked for interference, didn't find any.

Next he did a copper pair test and was NOT impressed. Apparently the minimum is 5ohms, and my line was at 4ohms. Again I don't know the specifics, he just showed me the screen on his device and explained. I told him three copper pair tests had now been done, including his and he stated "well there are engineers and then there are engineers". Apparently this should have been picked up on when the first OpenReach engineer came to the house and although all the tests were "ok" this was below specifications.

Next he went up the pole to the little black box and redid the terminations and checked the wiring from the pole to the house and noticed that the phone line cable goes right next to the power line cable, again he said this should have been picked up on and he was not impressed. He then looked at the actual run and said it was going through a lot of trees and it's possible the insulation had been worn by time. I told him that UKOnline had told me there was no chance in hell this would be looked at or ever changed. He laughed, said a few explitives and said this was part of their job and HAD to be done.

Last but not least he told me he would ask to be put back on the job (he worked 30 mins over his 2 hour slot) and may be back tomorrow.

I must say this guy was awesome. Attentive, professional, complete.

So my line has a fault! Somewhere there's problems on the actual copper which are going to be investigated!

I now await the next phase.

Cheers,
T

[roseway]

That's real progress! It's certainly true that BT engineers vary, and this chap has probably gone beyond what he's supposed to do by staying more than two hours. Hopefully he will be allowed to stick with it and will get it sorted for you.

[torqpoc]

  Just got a call from the engineer who came out this morning, BT have already turned it around and he's being sent back out, today!

Ok now i'm impressed..

 

Cheers,
T