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Author Topic: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate  (Read 212278 times)

UncleUB

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #240 on: August 31, 2011, 08:53:07 AM »

Quote
e.g. when BT reset my profile a few visits ago to only 24 Mb, stating that was all my line could ever achieve
Unless Plusnet can do some arm twisting I feel the above statement could be correct.
Regardless of the connection achieved when the FTTC was first installed for what ever reason BT are now saying your line can only achieve 24Mb.
Depending on the wording of your contract you will be receiving a satisfactory (to BT) connection rate.
I hope you and the Plusnet guys are successful in your quest, but remember who you are ultimately dealing with.
My post is not a reflection on OR or anyone other than the provider of the system/line, and I don't mean Plusnet.
Good Luck.

I have been thinking along the same lines having followed this epic thread with great interest.

So if BT say that 24 mb is a satisfactory outcome for your line what else can you do? Does their t&c's say up to 40mb?

I think this has been a good insight into the world of FTTC,as its relatively new and most consumers have little knowledge of all the ins and outs of it.
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waltergmw

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #241 on: August 31, 2011, 08:57:20 AM »

@ Uncy,

I don't think it's only the end users who lack some knowledge or possibly experience !

@ paul,

Amen to that, but you're a better man than I Gunga Din !

Kind regards,
Walter
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #242 on: August 31, 2011, 09:07:15 AM »

Quote
e.g. when BT reset my profile a few visits ago to only 24 Mb, stating that was all my line could ever achieve
Unless Plusnet can do some arm twisting I feel the above statement could be correct.
Regardless of the connection achieved when the FTTC was first installed for what ever reason BT are now saying your line can only achieve 24Mb.
Depending on the wording of your contract you will be receiving a satisfactory (to BT) connection rate.
I hope you and the Plusnet guys are successful in your quest, but remember who you are ultimately dealing with.
My post is not a reflection on OR or anyone other than the provider of the system/line, and I don't mean Plusnet.
Good Luck.

@ silversurfer44,

BT & Plusnet have already confirmed that 15 Mb is the contractual "fault threshold" & that as I am currently achieving in excess of that speed, there is nothing that either of tham can/will do about my current issues.

However, fair play to Plusnet (& BT), they do accept that the various issues have also been affecting the quality of my telephone communications & have been & still are pushing for a complete resolution.

It would surely also be in BT's interests, as a general PR exercise if nothing else, to demonstrate that they can actually deliver a stable "up to 40 Mb" FTTC service as a "caring provider", over their aged infrastructure, given time, & genuinely dealing with broadband "faults" as & when needed.

From what has been determined to date, it could be rather embarassing for BT if I were to publish these matters to a much wider audience.
As long as my issues are finally resolved, I will be publishing the outcome with a much more positive outlook, putting the bad experiences to get to the resolution as a learning curve for all involved (including the FTTC broadband providers).

I also realise that I am but one tiny voice in this matter & BT could very easily ignore my issues, simply re-quoting the 15 Mb minimum speed "guarantee".
However, I genuinely believe they have a real interest in resolving this matter as it may even go some way to setting the scene for similar issues going forward.

Paul.
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #243 on: August 31, 2011, 09:28:17 AM »


I have been thinking along the same lines having followed this epic thread with great interest.


@ UncleUB,

Hahaha, good point :), but this thread has only been epic due to the actions/lack of actions by others (mainly BT).

They have:-

Quoted my FTTC line length as 5283m, even though that is the distance from the exchange.

Stated my line could never have achieved downloads of 30+ Mb, despite their own performace tester results confirming the contrary.

Unnecessarily replaced modems with absolutely no testing or proof that they were actually faulty.

Somehow caused me to lose my telephone & broadband services for a 4 day period.

"Stupidly" (the engineer's word, not mine) double jumpered my line within the cabinet.

Run various basic tests that would knowingly not find the relevant faults. How many users would have just accepted LTOK?

Not physically checked their own cabinet/exchange equipment for potential & probable faults.

Demonstrated their lack of understanding of their own technology (various visiting engineers and "agents" either quoting inaccuracies, and/or contradicting each other)

etc, etc, etc.......................................


Paul.
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Oranged

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #244 on: August 31, 2011, 11:52:29 AM »


How many users would have just accepted LTOK?


In respect of FTTC I would suggest not that many.

Because those users who are willing to pay for Infinity (or Broadband with Fibre) are not the average user, they are users who want/need the high spec. connection and are probably more knowledgeable than Mr/Ms AverageUser
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #245 on: August 31, 2011, 12:14:20 PM »


How many users would have just accepted LTOK?


In respect of FTTC I would suggest not that many.

Because those users who are willing to pay for Infinity (or Broadband with Fibre) are not the average user, they are users who want/need the high spec. connection and are probably more knowledgeable than Mr/Ms AverageUser

Hi Oranged,

You may have a very valid point there.

My own main reason for switching to FTTC (& I suspect quite a few others too) was simply that I really do live too far from the exchange to get anything better than a flaky 1 Mb connection on ADSL1.
I have also previously tried mobile phone dongles & looked at satellite as other options.

Unfortunately mobile phone reception is also very poor at my location & satellite appears very expensive.

razpag has previously hinted at current investigations into broadband being delivered via unused channels/frequencies of digital TV.

Unfortunately, I don't get very good digital TV reception either.

I do have a nice view of all the surrounding hills though :lol: :lol:

I would guess that most of the users who switched to FTTC for the same reason that I did are reasonably happy anyway that they are now achieving "proper" broadband speeds, despite the relatively high cost.

In my case, although I wasn't fully aware of the technology involved, it felt like I had won the lottery, achieving somewhere approaching full fibre speeds (well, just over 3/4 of the full speed).

Just imagine how it feels when you have just got used to living the high life, & then have to give back the rest of your lottery winnings  :(

I also have much better/more important things to do than contributing to 17 tiresome pages so far in an online forum, along with all the time I/we have spent in researching matters. Thanks again everyone for all your help & advice.
I know; it's all my own fault for asking the initial question ::).

Paul.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2011, 12:28:11 PM by Bald_Eagle1 »
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #246 on: September 01, 2011, 09:34:34 AM »

Dear Readers,

Just a quick update.

I was informed yesterday that my port has now been "flexed" & my profile reset.

Plusnet's test results from yesterday:-
GEA:
Test Outcome                   Pass
Test Outcome Code           GTC_FTTC_SERVICE_0000
Description                       GEA service test completed and no fault found .
Main Fault Location            OK
Sync Status                      In Sync
Downstream Speed             23.987001 Mbps
Upstream Speed                 1.9970001 Mbps
Appointment Required          N
Fault Report Advised           N
Profile Name                      16.2M-32.4M Downstream, Interleaving Off - 0.5M-2M Upstream, Interleaving Off
Time Stamp                       2011-08-31T05:45:0

Summary:  DLM reset complete. Line profile allowing sync up to 32.4Mbps.  Need to allow time for speed to pick up.
**************************************************************************************

I have asked Alex at Plusnet to confirm why my profile had not been reset to "20M-40M Downstream, Interleaving Off - 0.5M-2M Upstream, Interleaving Off" as promised, & that it was before any of the issues started.
I await a response.

I have also requested my connection statistics from when FTTC was installed, to compare with the latest JDSU readings.
Again, I await a response.

I was advised to allow up to 120 hours for DLM to stabilise & hopefully allow the higher speeds again.

There is very little change to my download speeds as of this morning:-


I still have the theory that DLM and/or DSLAM/Exchange port(s) may be may be confused, faulty, or "stuck" due to all the previous line instabilities (now possibly cured), requiring a port switch / Lift & Shift.

This apparently only takes a few minutes at the cabinet & a few minutes back at the exchange & as a belt & braces matter, another few minutes to check the results using a JDSU at my home.
Indeed, all-in-all probably a bit quicker & cheaper than unnecessarily swapping modems.

I have no idea why this has not been tried at this time.
Only when "everything" physically possible has been tried, in effect taking my connection back to the equivalent of a brand new installation will I/we have the full picture of what has caused/is still causing the low speed issues.

22 Mb download speeds aren't that bad in general, but they are really poor for a FTTC connection, especially one that was downloading at some 10-11 Mb quicker for the first couple of weeks.

I will be patient for a few more days, even if just to disprove the theory that DLM will eventually get its act together, & then (but hopefully not) the saga will continue, making this epic forum thread even more epic in the scale of epicness.

Paul.
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #247 on: September 01, 2011, 12:49:34 PM »

Here we go again



The modem disconnected & reconnected while I wasn't around, so I couldn't check the phone for crackling at the time.

The phone is quiet now though (as per usual).

It's a bit warmer out again today.
Maybe the DSLAM overheats & not the modems?

I wonder if a faulty DSLAM could have been causing the intermittent crackling, just at the same time as the modem disconnects.

Has anyone checked the equipment in the FTTC cabinet?
Not that I am aware of.

Paul.
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burakkucat

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #248 on: September 01, 2011, 06:49:05 PM »

D'oh! That's half of what I would expect you to be achieving for download speed. Clearly there is still something wrong, somewhere. :'(

With regards to the 15 Mbps download speed, that is just an arbitrary marketing limit used by BT retail. A fibre connection that can provide >= 15 Mbps download will be called BT Infinity. A connection < 15 Mbps download will be called BT Option 3 with Fibre (or something like that!)
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waltergmw

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #249 on: September 01, 2011, 08:06:13 PM »

@ BKK,

I believe it is also a contractual limit for a BT Infinity product; i.e. if you have a BT Infinity fibre connection it must achieve that limit and might be used by the supplier as a get-out clause, as indeed was mentioned in Paul's case.
IMHO it is absolutely vital that you recored your initial performance figures that you accept at start of contract. This is similar to the MTR and FTR limits on "ordinary" broadband.

Kind regards,
Walter
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #250 on: September 03, 2011, 07:27:22 AM »

Dear Readers,

Not much change yet.

I rebooted the modem early doors this morning & download speeds have gone up slightly from last time.



My IP Profile / bRAS rate is currently 19410 k, so download speeds are running at approximately 97% of my current profile.

Dooes a lift & shift now seem like the only option remaining in order to get the full 40 Mb at the cabinet & therefore treat my connection as a brand new installation & start the DLM training again on what is now considered to be a good quality, stable, but not too short line?


Paul.
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razpag

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #251 on: September 03, 2011, 07:29:59 AM »

I would say so going from the info on here. Can't do any harm for PN to request one can it ??!! :)
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waltergmw

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #252 on: September 03, 2011, 10:34:18 AM »

@ Paul,

Might it be better just to ask for PlusNet's suggestions rather than make a direct request?

@RP,

Do you know if a lift and shift task / procedure is yet defined for a FTTC solution?

Kind regards,
Walter
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razpag

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #253 on: September 03, 2011, 01:10:41 PM »

Walter ..... never one one, but I'd be pretty damned sure it'll be exactly the same as if the DSLAM were in the Exchange. A pone call to BTw, tests and circuit history explored, then hopefully a new port given. Quick re-jumper in the Cab. Job done. ;D
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Bald_Eagle1

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Re: FTTC - Distance from the Cabinet - Realistic speed estimate
« Reply #254 on: September 04, 2011, 09:36:51 AM »

@razpag,

Quote:
Unfortunately, most EU's are left at the behest of the SP's and the advice they are given. I call SP's (as part of my Broadband work) most days, and am left flabberghasted at some of the conversations we have !!!. Poor training perhaps ??
http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,9154.msg188060.html#msg188060

Hi razpag,

I noticed your above comment in the topic linked to above.

Is it still BT's position that engineers may make direct contact with SPs?
In my reply #214 in this current thread, I mentioned that the visiting engineer had told me that he had emailed his JDSU results directly to Plusnet, but that he was not allowed to actually speak to them.

I am aware that throughout my case, communications (or lack of) between the various parties have made the whole issue perhaps a little more difficult to diagnose/determine the next step(s).
I would imagine that a simple telephone discussion could often help clarify matters much better than emails.
It certainly helps within my field of work.

e.g. I may receive an emailed repair order such as "water coming through ceiling".
I would suspect a variety of causes such as roof leak, internal rainwater or soil/waste pipe leak, concealed plumbing or heating pipework leaks etc.
A quick telephone conversation directly with the person reporting the problem usually determines whether to send a plumber, a heating engineer or a roofer to quickly expedite the correct "first time fix".


Paul.
 
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