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[exo]

Are you sure as according to this Scottish Power have put up gas by 19% and electricity by 10% from next month.

No price increase with Online Saver 14 when their other tariffs go up. It will go up at some point in the future though.
They all operate as a cartel with a captive market.

I fail to see the point of smart meters being installed nationwide at some cost.
Due to the high cost of energy, I suspect we all use as little as possible, so I don't need a smart meter to tell me how much it is costing at any particular time.

exo

[UncleUB]

 

UB goes into a chorus of ........Underneath the arches.....

[tuftedduck]

There are five wind farms within a thirty mile radius of TD Towers.

Us poor mugs paying our energy bills to Scottish Power are currently funding a scheme whereby the wind farm operators are being subsidised
to not produce power. 

Seems that there is too much of the stuff in the country 

[roseway]

The wind farm companies are a very powerful lobby, and seem to be able to get whatever they want. The problem with wind power of course is that it only produces energy when the wind blows, so you still need other sources to supply energy when the wind isn't blowing. That sounds like a recipe for over capacity.

[AdrianH]

The wind farm companies are a very powerful lobby, and seem to be able to get whatever they want. The problem with wind power of course is that it only produces energy when the wind blows..........

Which is why they should have a few turbines at Westminster 

[CurlyWhirly]

Are you sure as according to this Scottish Power have put up gas by 19% and electricity by 10% from next month.

No price increase with Online Saver 14 when their other tariffs go up. It will go up at some point in the future though.

That's a good deal that you are on then 

I fail to see the point of smart meters being installed nationwide at some cost.
Due to the high cost of energy, I suspect we all use as little as possible, so I don't need a smart meter to tell me how much it is costing at any particular time.

My view exactly and I expect that if you opt to have smart meters then you pay for this through higher bills and if true this defeats the object 

[CurlyWhirly]

Us poor mugs paying our energy bills to Scottish Power are currently funding a scheme whereby the wind farm operators are being subsidised
to not produce power. 

Seems that there is too much of the stuff in the country 

I read about this in the papers a while back.

Apparently this is because if the wind farms produced power on a windy day then the National Grid can not cope 

[tuftedduck]

The wind vanes here half been out of commission for months now. 

[CurlyWhirly]

The wind vanes here half been out of commission for months now. 

No wonder why electricity prices are going up if this is going on 

[sevenlayermuddle]

I fail to see the point of smart meters being installed nationwide at some cost.
Due to the high cost of energy, I suspect we all use as little as possible, so I don't need a smart meter to tell me how much it is costing at any particular time.

exo

I looked into smart meters some time ago, when British Gas tried to persuade me to accept one.

The 'point' turned out to be buried in the small print.  By accepting the smart meter, consumers are deemed to also be accepting a change to the T&C of the gas supply.  It means that consumers who accept a smart meter give British Gas (or Centrica or whatever name they want to use) permission to remotely disconnect the supply, without consent of the home owner.

The significance of this goes back to the winter of 09/10, when it became apparent that this country does not store nearly as much gas as our European neighbours.  For that reason the supply nearly ran out, at which point supplies to essential industry, hospitals, etc would all just have petered out -it would have been a national disaster. 

With smart meters, if things get that bad again, BG will be able to switch off non essential users - ie householders - without switching off essential industry.  It would be a last resort, but smart meters are basically a cheap alternative to the other way of solving the problem, which would be to provide proper storage facilities to see us through another extreme winter.

It's not just the T&C of course.  Without a smart meter, BG would have to send a man around to every house when the gas was re-enabled to ensure that all pilots etc were lit.  That would cost BG too much of course and, if they were willing to spend big money on the problem, they would simply have improved storage facilities.

If we do have another extreme winter, and the gas storage proves to be inadequate, those with smart meters may live to regret it.  That, at least, was my analysis.  So far, I have avoided my smart meters by refusing to accept the change to T&C.   Whether that tactic will work indefinitely, only time will tell.

Mr Allison (BG director of Smart Metering) still has a long way to go to convince me, at least.

Rant over

[jeffbb]

Hi
quote so you still need other sources to supply energy when the wind isn't blowing. That sounds like a recipe for over capacity.

When you have any form of unstable energy supply  ie Wind power ,Wave power then you have to have that power produce by other stations generators .Nuclear power,Coal fired , oil fired stations produce the basic load  . So regardless of the wind condition the Total demand has got to be available . That means that some Power stations are NOT running at full potential or some may just be Idling ,still costing money of course . The more efficient ones are kept at full power for obvious reasons . When the wind is not enough  or is too fast then these stations are bought on line . Generally these stations are the least efficient ones so cost more to produce power . The generators will not invest in New plant just to have it on standby .
The other point to note about this FREE power ?? is that they get preferential treatment when it comes to generating 
under the rules for  Non-Fossil Fuel Obligation
quote the Non-Fossil Fuel Obligation has been generating a trading surplus, expected to have reached £500m by 2008. The Government have been criticised for siphoning off funds from this surplus to contribute to the exchequer, instead of using it to support renewable energy in other ways [4]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-Fossil_Fuel_Obligation

Regards Jeff
 

[BritBrat]

Just think how high prices would have been if we had not privatised them?

[jeffbb]

Hi
quote Just think how high prices would have been if we had not privatised them?

Probably not as high ! for political reasons and No share holders
I believe the French Electricity generation (or at least controlled )  is government owned and cheaper than ours ? 
Regards Jeff

[UncleUB]

Thank the Tories for selling the energy companies off to foreign companies...

Like anything of value,its sold off.

How many other EU have their energy controlled by foreign companies...

[CurlyWhirly]

I looked into smart meters some time ago, when British Gas tried to persuade me to accept one.

The 'point' turned out to be buried in the small print.  By accepting the smart meter, consumers are deemed to also be accepting a change to the T&C of the gas supply.  It means that consumers who accept a smart meter give British Gas (or Centrica or whatever name they want to use) permission to remotely disconnect the supply, without consent of the home owner.

The significance of this goes back to the winter of 09/10, when it became apparent that this country does not store nearly as much gas as our European neighbours.  For that reason the supply nearly ran out, at which point supplies to essential industry, hospitals, etc would all just have petered out -it would have been a national disaster. 

With smart meters, if things get that bad again, BG will be able to switch off non essential users - ie householders - without switching off essential industry.  It would be a last resort, but smart meters are basically a cheap alternative to the other way of solving the problem, which would be to provide proper storage facilities to see us through another extreme winter.

If we do have another extreme winter, and the gas storage proves to be inadequate, those with smart meters may live to regret it.

Crikey that's an eye-opener 

I'm glad I didn't go for one now !