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[Zoe]

Hi  


Is there any way of seeing Output Power on a Netgear Router without first having to install something like Routerstats?


Why I'm Asking...

DLM has now put me on a 6db profile.
And whilst I was going through the Talk Talk/AOL authentication problem .. Now Over! - Thank God!  
Was in and out of my router so many times... Realised something about my noise margin.
Basically!
Used to think my noise margin was dropping due to the PPP disconnection problem that I was having.
But Now That's Over - & - Noise Margin Still Likes To Drop  
Think my router is a bit aggressive when it Syncs - & - Has a tendency to sync too high for any give Target Noise Margin.

Attenuation
Down = 35.0
Up = 17.3

Example: 1
While on a 12db profile - & - Was still having the PPP problem.
Sync Quite High: 10968
Noise Margin: 12.1
After approx 9 days my noise margin would have dropped slowly down to something like 4.5db

Example: 2
While on a 6db profile - & - Was still having the PPP problem.
Sync Quite Low: 11830
Noise Margin: 7.1
Noticed my noise margin dropped to 6.8 ... Then seemed to stay at 6.8  

Example: 3
While on a 6db profile - & - Was still having the PPP problem.
Sync Very High: 13404
Noise Margin: 3.4
My noise margin went straight to 3.4db   Next day was 2.8db ... At which point I rebooted my router to avoid DLM changing my profile.

Example: 4 ... 9th July - to - Today! ( PPP Problem - Gone! )
Tried to sync as low as I could.
Was aiming for 12000 .. But the best I could do was....
Sync Little High: 12498
Noise Margin: 6.3
By the next day my noise margin dropped to 3.6db  
And since then has slowly bobbed up and down from 3.6db - to - 5.0db
But never seems to get back to it's target of 6.0db


Reason I'd Like To See My Output Power...
1) There always seems to be a time in the day when my BB slows to a crawl.
This could be coz of my noise margin being too low - or - Could just be flamin Talk Talk and AOL playing around at their end.
2) Throughput Speed never seems to get close to my Sync Speed.
Note: Noise Margin 6.8 - or - 4.5 ... Doesn't seem to make any difference.

3) I'd like to see if my Output Power is adjusting to fit with where my Noise Margin is at.


Note!
Really don't want to be messing with router reboots and router software at the moment.
Coz...
1) It's lovely to be finally settled and free from disconnections all day every day.
2) School holidays about to start - & - Don't want anything going wrong with broadband, routers, or computers just now.
But if there's any way of seeing my Output Power from within my Netgear Router... It would be great if someone could tell me where to find it  

Thanks!

Zoe

[UncleUB]

Hi Zoe. 

Have a look here to see how to get your router stats which should include the output power

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/frogstats.php

* Scroll down for Netgear routers *

[Zoe]

Hi UncleUB  

My router ( Netgear DGND3300 ) isn't on the list.
However!
It's so similar to other Netgear routers... That I do know where to find most of my router stats  

It's Just That...
Netgear routers ( Considering They're So Popular ) don't seem to give as much info as some other routers do  
Note: I've posted my Stats below so you can see what I mean.


Thought there might be ( Someone Might Know ) some kind of calculation I can do instead... To Find My Output Power  

Thanks!

Zoe



[attachment deleted by admin]

[roseway]

I think this should work:

First enable debug mode in the router by going to this address:

Code: [Select]

http://192.168.0.1/setup.cgi?todo=debug
The result should be the message 'Debug enable'.

Close the browser and open a command-line window. Type:

Code: [Select]

telnet 192.168.0.1
You will be asked to login, so enter the username - type 'admin'

and then the password: type 'password' (unless you've changed the password of course)

You should now see a BusyBox prompt. Now type:

Code: [Select]

adslctl info --stats
This will result in a stream of information, including the upstream and downstream power, near the beginning.

Type 'exit' to exit from the telnet interface.

[Zoe]

Hi Eric  

Was hoping to avoid anything complicated.

Can't afford to have anything go wrong with our BB now that my teenage son is going to be off school for the next 7 weeks.

Bit of thunder in the air - & - I'm Thinking...    .. Just got my router ( BB ) settled down.
Don't want DLM to kick in coz of Thunder Storm - or - Thunder Storm to blow up my Router.
Can't afford to buy a new router.

I Know... I'm a cowardy custard  
Might have a go once he's back at school.

Thanks!

Zoe

[jeffbb]

Hi

quote :My noise margin went straight to 3.4db  Shocked Next day was 2.8db ... At which point I rebooted my router to avoid DLM changing my profile.

The Noise margin will constantly very depending on how much noise there is on the line .

The noise margin you get immediately after a router reboot is about = your target SNR margin . It is a part of the negotiations  between your router and the DSLAM, that and the noise on the line ,gives you your synch rate . From that moment your SNR margin will change as the noise changes . As noise increases SNRM will drop,as noise decreases it will rise.

Certain times of the day are said to be noisier than others so if you synch during a noisy period then you will get a lower synch rate .If you synch during a quiet time then the Synch rate will be higher .Which ever it is the snr margin will be about your target SNR margin at that point in time .  From then on IT WILL vary in response to the noise on the line .

The affect of rebooting will be totally dependant on the line quality at that time .

quote I'd like to see if my Output Power is adjusting to fit with where my Noise Margin is at.

The output Power does NOT generally change very much .

Regards Jeff

[Zoe]

Hi Jeff  

The strange thing is...
When I did manage to sync quite low once... My noise margin ended up with a bit extra 7.1db
It did still drop!
But once it got to 6.8db .. It seemed to stay there.
Mind You!
That could have just been a Fluke  
And it still didn't make any difference as to how close my Throughput came to my actual Sync Speed.
Guess what I'm thinking...
Lower Sync on a 6db profile - & - Noise Margin have a bit extra to play with.
Is Safer Than...
High Sync on a 6db profile - & - DLM think there's a problem and change my profile to 9db.

Trouble Is!
I've discovered that it's just as tricky to sync Low as it is to sync High  

Certain times of the day are said to be noisier than others so if you synch during a noisy period then you will get a lower synch rate

Yep!
Apart from sitting up all night... I've tried all different times of day.

The Noise margin will constantly very depending on how much noise there is on the line .

Noise Margin has just took another nose dive - See Picture Below!


Thanks!

Zoe



[attachment deleted by admin]

[GunJack]

Zoe - think the weather up our way the last few days is deffo affecting your sync/snrm. I checked my DMT trace when I got home, and snrm had nose-dived and CRCs shot up during the stormy stuff in the vicinity......a lot of it can't be helped 

[jeffbb]

Hi
quote : My noise margin ended up with a bit extra 7.1db

SNR margin is totally at the mercy of the line condition. It can go up or down. The only time it would not change is if the line was PERFECTLY quiet.Some changes are deemed to be normal . Almost any line will probably drop 2 to 3 db over a period of time (evenings ) as more noise is generated by users on line or even atmospheric conditions . Some less normal changes (I have this problem) is when some external equipment causes sudden drops ,in my case an instant drop of about 3db.

For the first situation there is nothing to be done ,it just happens . thesecond situation is to track the root cause of the problem ,I haven't managed it ,so I have to live with it.

Pure PPP disconnections(still synched to exchange ) are not really related to SNR margin problems . If the SNR margin gets too low then the connection is lost to the exchange .

quote Noise Margin has just took another nose dive - See Picture Below!

From a 6db target that is not really too bad . If the line is remaining in synch then no need to worry.

SNR margin is only one of the stat parameters .

In assessing a line's condition you have to look at the overall picture .

That includes Attenuation ,Target SNR margin ,errors being generated , synch rate appropriate to  Attenuation,
SNR margin changes ,are they gradual  ,sudden or constantly changing (spiky).Time of day will invariably affect the SNR margin.

Regards Jeff

Edit something I forgot :Output power is related to attenuation. As a general rule the power is determined by attenuation(distance from exchange ).As a rule of thumb it will NOT change for a given line .

[Zoe]

Hi GunJack 

Think it's inevitable there's going to be a storm here at some point tonight.
It's already had a really good try twice this afternoon.
Even thunder without rain 

Defo agree that it's effecting the broadband 

Thanks!

Zoe

[Zoe]

Hi Jeff  


Thankfully my noise margin always seems to move up and down quite gently.
It's common for me to see it move from say... 6.0db - to - 3.7db in one day.
But I've never seen it get there ( Drop ) all in one go.
Just little baby steps of... 0.1db at a time.

Pure PPP disconnections(still synched to exchange ) are not really related to SNR margin problems . If the SNR margin gets too low then the connection is lost to the exchange .

Haven't got the PPP disconnections any more Jeff  ... Thank God!  

From a 6db target that is not really too bad . If the line is remaining in synch then no need to worry.

Apart from when DLM changed my Profile from 12db - to - 9db - to - 6db.
Never Lost Sync 8)
Not even when I did have the PPP disconnection problem.
Not even when my noise margin went down to 2.8db.
So...
Think I'll just stop worrying about it now - & - Let the router take care of itself  


Thanks!

Zoe