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[NoisyLions]

I posted about this issue a couple of years ago - every year the problem re-occurs and never seem to be able to resolve it, so I'm throwing it out to you good people again in the hope that someone can help me track down the cause of the fault. Here's my original post from 2 years ago:

"A few weeks ago I was experiencing intermittent noise on my phone line which was causing intermittent Broadband line drops and consequent severe speed degradation (download speed eventually dropped to 15 kBp/s !

I noticed that the problem was worse when the weather was warm/very warm - however as the weather cooled down the noise diminished and the line speed improved. A BT engineer came out to look into the fault but due to the intermittent nature of the fault he couldn't find a problem - by then the weather was on the cool-down anyhow so the fault was easing off.

Naturally for test purposes I disconnected all my equipment, changed filters, used only the master socket, etc all to no avail. Also tried a different router.

Since then the weather has been relatively cool but over the past few days has started to warm up again and yes, you guessed it, the fault is starting to re-appear. Only two line drops so far (one 3 days ago, one a few minutes ago) but intermittent noise on the phone line (although the automated BT test declares that the line is okay - I must be using it at the wrong moment!). Broadband download speed has dropped back to 200 kBp/s (used to be over double that).

So what can I do?

The fault is obviously heat (or sunlight?) related, but how do I convince BT to get the problem sorted?"


Note: As of this year I haven't involved BT seeing as they couldn't resolve the issue last time (and the time before that (when looking into the same fault) they managed to disconnect my phone line and Broadband COMPLETELY for nearly two weeks before they were able to fix it, so I'm treading VERY carefully this time!).


Thanks

[waltergmw]

Hi NL and welcome back,

Have you tried in the test socket within the master socket ?

There will be more to follow in a minute !

Kind regards,
Walter

[waltergmw]

Hi again NL,

It would be well worthwhile installing Routerstats or routerstats lite and recording the sync speeds and noise margin graphs.

http://www.kitz.co.uk/routers/log_routerstats.htm

When you are experiencing the problem try doing a 17070 option 2 Quiet Line test and listening for any discernible noise, remembering to keep your hands still on the handset.
On the off-chance it's also worth doing the option 1 ring back test.

Kind regards,
Walter

[NoisyLions]

Hi NL and welcome back,

Have you tried in the test socket within the master socket ?

Yup, no difference I'm afraid.

BTW, the cabling from my property to the nearest BT 'junction box' is underground (as is the box or whatever it's called). The nearest small exchange is a mile or so away.

[NoisyLions]

Hi again NL,

It would be well worthwhile installing Routerstats or routerstats lite and recording the sync speeds and noise margin graphs.

http://www.kitz.co.uk/routers/log_routerstats.htm

Thanks, wwill try that.

When you are experiencing the problem try doing a 17070 option 2 Quiet Line test and listening for any discernible noise, remembering to keep your hands still on the handset.
On the off-chance it's also worth doing the option 1 ring back test.

I've tried the Quiet Line test and there is definite noise, albeit intermittent.

[waltergmw]

Try and record the line noise if you can.

Given that most of the equipment and line is underground it's unlikely that the line itself is faulty, unless there's some exposed cable.

For the best possible results I'd make sure all ring wires are disconnected, even though you can't observe any difference between the master and test sockets.

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/troubleshooting.htm

Can you see any temperature-operated equipment such as ventilation fans either in your house or anywhere towards the exchange?

Are there any HV lines drooping down in the heat on to trees etc. ?

Kind regards,
Walter

[Zoe]

Hi 

Is your router plunged into a phone socket that gets the majority of the daily sun?

Only reason I ask...
I've noticed  that the whole time the weather was cold my UP Attenuation was always 16.9
As soon as the weather turned warm... UP Attenuation 17.1
Reboot router on a hot day like Today... UP Attenuation 17.2 
However!
Could just be Coincidence 

The only reason I've noticed is because I've been having BB disconnections since getting a new 24mbps BB contract on April 21st.
So! .. I've spent a lot of time looking at my router stats 

My router is connected to the master phone socket at the front of the house - & - Only gets the morning light.
But from what I've seen...  Could well imagine that the sun could cause internet problems.

Zoe

[strontium90]

With some of the BTwholesale infrastructure, I'm surprised a flash from a distant quasar doesn't cripple their entire network

[jeffbb]

Hi
quote : Reboot router on a hot day like Today... UP Attenuation 17.2 .

small differences 0.1 /0.2  is quiet possible during large swings in temperature . As line resistance and impedance and attenuation  change slightly .
From what I have read Attenuation goes up with temperature  about 0.1% to 0.18% per degree centigrade . so your changes are well within the norm.

Underground cables will see much less of the affect.

Regards Jeff

[hake]

I put the blade of a shovel through the telephone cable in my front garden about 25 years ago.  BT made a waterproof join and the cable worked fine for voice purposes.  ADSL performance has always been a bit flaky, especially after the advent of MaxADSL.  In late February, the line began to be objectionably noisy.  It was then that PlusNet could justify getting BT to look hard for line faults.  About 6 weeks ago, BT replaced that cable with an armoured cable and my connection has for the first time behaved well and utterly consistently.  A few weeks previously, BT repaired a cable under the pavement about 600 yards down the road.  A brief improvement was had but it didn't last more than a few days and the audible noise returned.  Complete success was not achieved until the garden cable was replaced.

The moral is that if you have ADSL problems AND an noisy voice connection, then BT will look into the problem.  My ISP PlusNet is most helpful and very diligent on my behalf.

[Magpie3]

As you say that you have noise on the phone line ,I think that you should deal with BT on that point only.You would expect drops with a noisy line.Although I have an overhead supply ,some years ago I had frequent drops.An exchange line check showed the line to be ok. At my risk I asked for an engineer to call .He dialed the test number and said that the line was ok.I asked him to listen for longer and he heard the noise.After replacing the line to the pole the problem was solved.

[Weaver]

I think you have a good point about the sun. Living up here in North Western Scotland, from my own experience and frequent gathering of statistics, good sunny weather isn't automatically the best thing for DSL over a long line, and I wonder if AM radio stations' propagation is a factor.

I tell myself "If it's absolutely pouring heavy rain, then all that rain should fade the stations' signal" and poss quieten the noise environment.

Am I way off?

Thinking about a reverse argument too. The .1dB change in attenuation figures could I presume be an artifact of the way it's measured. Basically when the sun comes up the DSL modem decides to bit-swap (? SRA available, or resyncs?) and starts using some higher frequency tones. Then the calculation of attenuation comes up with different numbers as it's being based on an averaging of figures of new, altered spectrum of in-use frequences.