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Author Topic: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters  (Read 8206 times)

Lou

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New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« on: May 18, 2010, 01:45:25 PM »

Hi,

After many months of intermittent problems with my broadband connection I habe finally had an adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate fitted (adsl V10). According to what I have read as long as you plug your router in to the adsl side you can get rid of your inline filters. Well I tried this and even though it does not appear to cause any problems (though the socket has only just been fitted) one thing I did notice is that if I remove the filters and attempt to make a phone call then my router registers a HEC error, if the filter is in place then it does not. Any body ever come across this and does it matter?

Thanks

Lou
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waltergmw

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2010, 02:08:13 PM »

Hi Lou and welcome,

Reducing errors is nearly always a good thing so I would leave everything double-filtered.
It's always possible that the new ADSL 10 plate is faulty or extension wiring is causing problems.

If you'd like to post your Router Statistics and see how Routerstats Lite performs for a few days we should be able to comment some more.

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/frogstats.php

http://www.kitz.co.uk/routers/log_routerstats.htm

Kind regards,
Walter
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Lou

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2010, 03:22:41 PM »

Hi Walter thanks for the reply.

First thought is that I assumed that the adsl socket and the extensions were separate so any possible faulty wiring would not be an issue. Having said that I have just noticed that if an incoming call comes in then the up section of the hec errors jumps to about 23 errors but during the conversation they clear to 0. I am using a test router from my isp (a Thompson TG585 v7 firmware 8.2.23.0) as my one was having all sorts of problems and I will not reconnect it until I get good results on this one. Currently my router has been up for just over 1 hour with the following stats.

Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,159 / 17,066

Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 8.0 / 17.0
 
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.5 / 6.5
 
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 11 / 0
 
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 1 / 0
 
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
 
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
 
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 1 / 0
 
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0
 
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 29
 
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 22


Thanks

Lou
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waltergmw

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2010, 05:16:41 PM »

Hi Lou,

Just to make sure, have you put a filter dongle in every socket?

If so then have a look at:-

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/socket.htm

Kind regards,
Walter
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Lou

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2010, 05:47:57 PM »

Every socket that has something in it apart from the adsl port on the master socket. I have had a look at the guide it does seem to suggest that the two connections on the v10 are separate and should not interfere. At the moment the router has been up for 3.5 hours and the only difference is that the hec errors have gone up to 39 and the snr margin is on 6.0. I'm not worried about the noise margin at the moment b ut I don't know too much about the hec errors. Should these increase over time and what is a bad figure?

Thanks

Lou
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waltergmw

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2010, 07:26:51 PM »

Hi again Lou,

In order to eliminate your house wiring the next thing to try is, firstly turn the modem off by switching off the modem power supply, then remove the faceplate of the v10, plug a filter, modem and a telephone into the test socket inside. Now power the modem up and check the line stats again. Now try a quiet line test by dialing 17070 and selecting option 2 and check for total silence. Check the line stats again. Now do a ring-back test 17070 option 1 and yet again record the modem stats.

Report back here with all the results and observations.

Kind regards,
Walter
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Lou

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2010, 10:18:28 PM »

Hi Walter,

Thanks for that. It is possible that it is still finding it's optimum speed as the snrs went down to 3 earlier and the modem disconnected and now it is synching at 15066 which is what I used to get before all my problems started. I will try as you suggested but I will wait a few days as I don't want to risk having my profile banded down to 6600 again. They have done it to me three times already and most of the time it has been done because I have been bouncing my router as opposed to the line being unstable.

Thanks for your help.

Lou
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Lou

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2010, 09:18:09 PM »

Hi,

Here is the latest on the issues I have been having. I decided to eliminate my internal wiring and connect straight into the test socket. So all I had connected was my router and my dect/ip station. All landline calls in or out worked with no hec errors showing but the problems that I have been having all along were still there. Over the next few days the sync speed started to drop from 17100 right down to 9727 (I had been banded again and I was not aware of it). It then dropped to 7184, I was still getting the odd authentication drop and sometimes a complete dsl line drop. I was running routerstats and with the synch speed down to 7184 I had a downstream snr of between 20.0 to 23.0 which suggested to me something was wrong. I then rebooted my router and it re-synchronised to 9727. Here it remained but still with drop outs occurring usually early in the morning. The snr figure was now on 18.5. After some more discussions with my isp they decided to get BT to turn interleaving on for the downstream, apparently it had already been turned on for the upstream. This did appear to stabilise the line and after some days the banding was removed but with an snr target of 9db applied with a view to removing this later. My synch speeds were now 15596 and 888, the upstream did eventually go to 1179. What I'm not sure about is how the snr target works as soon after the target was applied the snr did go down to 6.0 though it has not gone below this and on the whole the line does appear more stable and it tends to sit on an snr of 9.0 db, there have been some drops but these seem to coincide with the synch speed changing slightly and with the speed profile at my isp changing. So this may be some kind of line training or whatever you call it.

Today I decided to recheck my internal wiring and to reconnect the faceplate to the master socket. On reconnecting the synch speed was about the same if anything a tiny fraction up and the snr speeds were the same 9.0/6.5 down 6.0 up. I then tried making an incoming call to my bt landline and sure enough hec errors appeared though they disappeared after a short while. This does not happen if it is an hec error that has appeared for another reason, it stays there. I decided to disconnect all the wiring right down to the first socket and changed that socket to a different one and it still happens whether the landline is connected to this first socket or to the master socket faceplate. So either this is normal (though I don't remember seeing it before the master socket was changed) or it is the cable that runs from the master socket to the first socket which has a problem. Then again it could be something to do with the new master socket. I am going to leave it as even though these hec errors appear they do not seem to affect the dsl lline. I will keep you posted.

Lou
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waltergmw

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2010, 11:17:10 PM »

Hi again Lou,

Just to be absolutely sure, is the second socket fitted with master socket components or is it unpopulated ?
It is best if it is an unpopulated slave socket. It would also be useful to check if the wires are crossed between the master socket faceplate and the (hopefully) slave socket.
I.e. is the same colour wire connected to the same terminal numbers 2 & 5 and are all other terminals empty?

Kind regards,
Walter
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Lou

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2010, 11:45:44 PM »

Hi Walter,

All the extension sockets are unpopulated. The wires are correctly connected though no 3 is also connected. I only left this because the BT engineer connected the ring wire on the extension part of the master socket when he fitted the new master socket. I am assuming he has connected the ring wire at the back of the master socket as well. I have not taken the whole socket apart to check this. Being that the new sockets can deal with the ring wire I did not think it mattered. The synch speed is what it was before the new socket was fitted and I had removed the ring wire from the the old master socket to achieve this speed. At the moment everything seems stable I have just one hec error on the downstream. I will check tomorrow morning as 'authentication drops' often happen between 0500 and 0900.

Regards

Lou
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waltergmw

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #10 on: May 31, 2010, 12:13:44 AM »

Hi Lou,

The ring signal is only generated within the Master Socket so there will only be the two drop wires connected to the back of the NTE.
Given that you are experiencing noise problems I would play safe and remove the terminal 3 wire, but let's see what others might say here.

Kind regards,
Walter
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roseway

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #11 on: May 31, 2010, 07:07:54 AM »

I agree with Walter. I would remove the wire connected to terminal 3 in the faceplate.
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Lou

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Re: New BT adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and inline filters
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2010, 12:36:09 AM »

Hi everybody,

Before I go about removing the ring wire I have another question. Since reconnecting my extensions the line has been stable It had been up for 3 days and 1 hour before it disconnected for less then a minute and reconnected at a slightly higher synch rate (15703). As the line had dropped I decided to reconnect my original router to the system. This has FXO and FXS port capability and I was using the FXO port to control by BT line so that I could forward unanswered calls onto my Voip server. The way this worked was that I had a 'Y' cable which you plugged the adsl cable from the router into one end and the other two ends, one rj11 and one bt plug into a filter. Now because I have a new faceplate I don't need the filter so I plugged the two ends of the 'Y' cable straight into the relevant parts of the faceplate. When I did this the router would not connect to the line. If I took the 'Y' cable out of the equation the router connected. I even tried connecting the rj11 from the 'Y' cable straight to the faceplate and the bt plug into a filter which I then plugged into the already filtered side of the faceplate. This did connect once but for less then a minute and then refused to connect again. So after rambling on my question is, can I change the bottom faceplate to the single socket type which the engineer kindly left behind which would basically allow me to connect my router back into an extension socket elsewhere in the house (in other words the same as I had before my master socket was changed) or is this single faceplate incompatible with the back box. I know it fits but as the double faceplate is advertised as splitting the broadband signal is this done in the double faceplate or further inside the back box? I hope I've explained myself.

Regards

Lou
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