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[emjayh]

I am posting this on behalf of a neighbour.  In late September his Broadband connection ceased to work - he is with Orange and has a Livebox Router.  The telephone works for both incoming and outgoing calls but his Livebox will not connect to the Orange server.  There should be three steady lights on the Livebox but he only has one steady, the other two flashing.

Orange have sent him a simple Router to try on the system but that does not work either.  We have tried plugging both the Livebox and the Router into new Filters and also into the primary phone line socket instead of the normal extension socket but this makes no difference.

Orange don't seem to be able to work out what the problem is and are somewhat backward at getting the Broadband connection checked out locally.

Has anyone any idea what might be causing this problem and if so how it needs to be fixed?  Could it possibly be a problem at the local exchange as nothing was changed in the house?

Thanks, Mike

[waltergmw]

Hi Mike and welcome,

Start with a 17070 option 2 quiet line test and report back. Also tell us which ordinary router has been supplied.

Your description sounds as if the modem isn't managing to sync - i.e it's not even talking to the exchange let alone Orange.
If you have a modem with lights saying DSL (i.e. sync) and Internet you should at least get the first DSL light steady even without your modem log-on and password.

Kind regards,
Walter

(Edit to add the second para.)

[Oranged]

In late September his Broadband connection ceased to work

Several questions :-

I presume from this statement that it was working to his satisfaction prior to the malfunction ?

Is this LLU or IPStream connection ?

Did anything change at about this time eg an upgrade or change of package or a notification from Orange of an "improvement to our service" ?

Which are the lights that are lit/not lit ?

[emjayh]

Hello Walter & Oranged

Thank you both for responding. It might be neater if I post a single reply.

Walter - The ordinary router is a Siemens Gigaset SE572. I think you are correct in saying the modem is not talking to the exchange, that is the way I was understanding it but didn't explain correctly. With regard to a "17070 option 2 line test" I'm afraid you have completely lost me here - can you please explain in words of one syllable.

Oranged - My neighbours broadband has been working without any problem for about two years then one morning no connection from his desktop machine (hard wired with cable) but his laptop did manage a wireless connection for an hour or so before that gave up.

Our exchange does not have any LLU so I presume it is IPStream although I don't know what that is. As far as we are aware absolutely nothing was done at my neighbours end to set this off. The steady light is the power. There are four others but I can't get to the unit to check which is which today.  The other lights are: a double arrow for search (goes off when connected), an '@' symbol when broadband connected, a phone symbol (see para below) and an error state symbol (triangle with ! inside - should normally be off).

One point I forgot to mention originally - the Livebox provides a second phone line via the broadband - this also went down when the broadband ceased. The original BT land line is still working normally.

Mike

[waltergmw]

Hi Mike,

I think you have confirmed that the modem has lost sync so the ADSL signal is amost certainly no longer connected at the exchange.
This means contacting Orange and telling them just that.

If you look here:-

http://uk-tiscali.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/uk_tiscali.cfg/php/enduser/fattach_get.php?p_sid=PzB2P*3j&p_li=&p_accessibility=0&p_redirect=&p_tbl=9&p_id=707&p_created=1201711381&p_olh=0

which I extracted from Kitz's page here:-

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/frogstats.php#55

you will see on page 6 a description of the lights for the SE 587 which is probably similar and I think again confirms your statements.

The quiet line test is a means of listening on a "live" telephone call but without actually connecting to anything other than a recorded voice occasionally.
If the phone line crackles or the voice you hear is badly distorted you can ask BT to repair a phone line fault first.
To do the test just dial 17070 in the normal way and when requested select option 2.

To be absolutely sure nothing has happened to the internal house wiring you could connect the filter into the master socket (if one is fitted) as described here:-

http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/socket.htm
which isolates all internal house wiring. It would be good to remove the ring wire if it is still connected.

Kind regards,
Walter

[emjayh]

Hello Walter

Thank you very much for the lost sync information and the explanation of the 17070 test.  I can't do the test until Monday but will do it before we contact Orange again.

With many thanks.

Mike

[kitz]

It certainly sounds like theres no sync and therefore not connecting at the exchange.  Youve already done the right stuff by trying different filters, and from the master socket
You can also double check for sync and see if you can get any linestats from the router.

A "No sync fault"  should be reported to the ISP as adsl connection unable to synchronise to the exchange despite trying directly from the master socket.

This type of fault can occur if Orange are in the process of LLUing your exchange and hence why oranged mentioned about the "improvements to your broadband" type of letter.
However it can also be caused by several other things such as a problem on the line, jumpering or linecard.

[coolsnakeman]

Yep gotta say this is def a no sync issue alrite. You have also tried with another modem which would suggest it couldn't be anything at your premises unless you gain sync at the test point which would indicate internal wiring. Once you have tried out the quiet line test and it passes then plug your router into the test point as walter has gave a link for that is if you have one and see if you gain sync in there. If you don't gain sync at the test point then get straight onto orange and advise they need to dispatch an engineer to the exchange to check the jumpering may only be a frames engineer to start off with but the line card will need checked aswell and may possible need reset. Its all a point of elimination to ensure you don't get a charge of openreach cause they have found faulty internal wiring or a faulty router/filter. Good luck with that mike:)

[emjayh]

Hello Kitz and Coolsnakeman

Thank you both for your replies.  I did a 17070 test on the line which was OK.  I have since checked my neighbours Livebox on my line and again it was OK.  Having cycled round the village numerous times I eventually found a B T engineer and his opinion was also that the fault was in the exchange, possibly jumpering as per one of your suggestions.  We have reported all this, including your comments, to Orange but it is difficult to know if they really take it on board and will create a job sheet for the exchange to be checked - they just don't want to pay B T to do the work. Orange have now been told that it needs fixing before the end of the month otherwise it will be MAC codes and move to B T.

I like your suggestion that this could be caused by LLUing our exchange, that could possibly be the good news if that is happening, we can only hope because it should reduce the monthly cost.

Thanks so much for all your help.  I will post the outcome.

Mike

[coolsnakeman]

If you have reported a fault to orange with all the information you have given us then they have to take it on board mike and get it fixed for you.  The problem with getting your issue fixed ASAP though won't lie with orange if you are not LLU it will be down to BT's quick response as they will need to create a fault report up to BT to get this resolved for you. Word of advise would be to call back a few hours after reporting the fault because BT will have gotten back to orange by then. In my experience with working along side BT i have found that once a fault report is created (depending on the issue) BT do tend to get back to you within 2-3 hours time so your best to keep ringing orange so if BT have not fixed it they can reject the clear back to BT to get an engineer arranged to your premises ASAP for a health check (diagnostics run from exchange to your test point). Keep us informed of the outcome but keep pushing orange to get quick results cause they may be busy with other complications and there response may not be as quick as you would like it (this causes distress to customers and thinking nothing is being done).  8)

[emjayh]

Success at last.  Following a conversation with Orange near the end of October when I told them that the problem had to be fixed by the end of the month otherwise my neighbour intended to take his business elsewhere there was then a flurry of text messages followed by a visit from the BT engineer earlier this week.  He then found a problem with the 'Orange card at the exchange' (if that makes sense) which was fixed and he returned to the house to do a line check which showed the broadband was then working so BT had done their part of the repair.

Having got that far we then found that the Livebox router would not connect with the exchange for reasons unknown but Orange tech rang to check the status of the repair (their call) and were on the phone for one and a half hours checking anything and everything until suddenly the whole thing sprung into life on the desk top machine but then the laptop wouldn't connect.  Whilst that was given some thought a simple reboot solved the problem, so that everything is now working.

Today Orange customer services have been contacted and agreed an adjustment of the rental for the next couple of months which goes most of the way to satisfy my neighbour.  We were told by a local source that Orange tend to save these jobs up until there are enough to get BT involved - we don't know if this is correct but could explain their initial poor response.  Having said that, once they did get on with dealing with the problem it moved quite quickly.

Thank you all for your help with this problem, it has been most useful and we are very grateful for your time.

Mike

[UncleUB]

Glad you are sorted Mike. 

[roseway]

Excellent news.

[coolsnakeman]

Good to hear you got it sorted mike. Just on the "orange card" they where talking about they are probably referring to the line card engineers tend to have funny names for everything lol

[emjayh]

Thank you for the explanation.  It has been an interesting, if frustrating at times, learning curve over the last month.

Mike