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[happy37]

Eric

Thanks for letting me know - will have a look in due course.....

Regards

happy37

[jazz]

@happy37

You also sent your reply to my posting on this site as a PM so I've replied to that by personal message too. 

The general guidance is not to mess about too much - the system will tend to find its own level and too much interference/help on your part may be counterproductive.  If you allow the system to settle down and then come back on here after the 10 day training period if you feel there are problems that people may be able to help you with that may be a better route in the long run.

[happy37]

@happy37

You also sent your reply to my posting on this site as a PM so I've replied to that by personal message too. 

The general guidance is not to mess about too much - the system will tend to find its own level and too much interference/help on your part may be counterproductive.  If you allow the system to settle down and then come back on here after the 10 day training period if you feel there are problems that people may be able to help you with that may be a better route in the long run.

jazz

Thanks for this reply - have also replied to your PM.....

I will now pop back on here after the 10 day period with my stats so that people will see what they're like and also to see if things can go better.....thanks once again, much appreciated.

Watch this space.....

Regards

[happy37]

kitz, jazz and all others that replied.....

Here's an update:-

I was told that everything would be up and running today between 8am and 8.30pm tonight, and hey presto, I checked earlier and it already was!!! 

Here are my current line stats (with another 2 questions, though...duh!!!)

ADSL Link                       Downstream       Upstream
Connection Speed       3200 kbps       448 kbps
Line Attenuation       55 db                       15.5 db
Noise Margin       6 db                       13 db

As you can all see, the downstream attenuation has gone up from 53db to 55db (is this a good or bad thing?), and the upstream attenuation has not changed from being 15.5db, yet the upstream noise margin has changed from 25db to 15db. Please can someone explain or interpret these stats for me in plain English?

I have also noticed that the downstream noise margin goes as low as 3db, 2db and even 1db? - can I get this any higher or improve it, or is the connection just in the testing phases at the moment?

Is this the max that my line can handle, or is there any room for further improvement?

Please correct me if I'm wrong, yet don't you all think that the connection/sync speed is strange for Max IP BRAS speed profiles?

The last thing that I would like to know and have a definite opinion on is this:-

I am connecting via an phone extension in my room to the phoneline...would you all say that it's worth my trying to run an extension cable with a modem connector and plug that into the “Master” (with a yellow ring capacitor) - not Master as such, socket downstairs near the front entrance of the property, and then plug the router into that? I will plug the other BT end into the BT phone socket with a microfilter?

If you all agree that I should try the above to see if I get better speeds/a better IP profile, what's the best way to do this without upsetting the connection so that it will register as a line fault at the exchange? Please can someone explain that for me in plain English?

Or, enough said, should I leave all alone to see how things go from here?

I really do appreciate all of the time and effort that everyone has taken to explain things to me as I am a complete newbie to moving to a Max package, and I would really like to know how to make the best of things with my phoneline and current stats.

Thanks once again for everything...I look forward to all of your responses in due course.

Regards

happy37


 

[waltergmw]

Hello happy37,

I'm not a frequent visitor here but I do a lot of similar work in the Surrey Hills Jungle.

Your line performance figures are certainly not brilliant and the very low varying noise margins are a significant concern.
Some "defensive engineering" seems important for you to be able to maintain a  stable, reasonable speed, conection.

1.   I would definirely get a filtered face plate on a standard master socket - either the old NTE5 + ADSL Nation filtered face plate or the newer BT Openreach faceplate - see the picture at the bottom of Step 3
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/tools/phone-socket-identification.html

2.   I would connect the broadband router directly to the master socket and use Homeplugs** to distribute the ethernet signal around the house on the mains wiring. That might also allow you to turn off wireless networking - I know this might be heresy to some, but any way to reduce RFI (Radio Frequency Interference) in your circumstances is a wise precaution.

** Herewith a link to a  homeplug supplier to explain the device but this is not a particular recommendation. There are many manufacturers of these devices including Netgear. Given that the broadband speed is comparitively low, there is little point in buying very expensive high speed home plugs which are more sensitive on long electrical cables.
http://www.solwise.co.uk/net-powerline-pl-85pe.htm

I hope this helps,
Walter

[happy37]

Walter

Thanks for letting me know...will bear these points in mind if and when the time comes to change things around.

However, are you or anyone else able to advise on my point:-

I am connecting via an phone extension in my room to the phoneline...would you all say that it's worth my trying to run an extension cable with a modem connector and plug that into the “Master” (with a yellow ring capacitor) - not Master as such, socket downstairs near the front entrance of the property, and then plug the router into that? I will plug the other BT end into the BT phone socket with a microfilter?

If you all agree that I should try the above to see if I get better speeds/a better IP profile, what's the best way to do this without upsetting the connection so that it will register as a line fault at the exchange? Please can someone explain that for me in plain English?

Thanks again.

Regards

happy37

[GunRunner]

Hello happy37,


2.   I would connect the broadband router directly to the master socket and use Homeplugs** to distribute the ethernet signal around the house on the mains wiring. That might also allow you to turn off wireless networking - I know this might be heresy to some, but any way to reduce RFI (Radio Frequency Interference) in your circumstances is a wise precaution.

** Herewith a link to a  homeplug supplier to explain the device but this is not a particular recommendation. There are many manufacturers of these devices including Netgear. Given that the broadband speed is comparitively low, there is little point in buying very expensive high speed home plugs which are more sensitive on long electrical cables.
http://www.solwise.co.uk/net-powerline-pl-85pe.htm

I hope this helps,
Walter

Hi

I would like to pass on my recent experience using home plugs.  I very recently fitted an ADSL Nation faceplate downstairs in the kitchen and plugged my router directly into the ADSL socket and used home plugs ( I have had them for several years so not a new purchase)  to send the signal to my PC upstairs in the spare bedroom.  I was very happy, because after fitting the faceplate and using this method I found I had increased my synchronisation by 3000mbps.   Several weeks later I changed my mind on the layout and hard wired from the faceplate (there is an outlet on it) to the router in the spare bedroom and found I synchronised at another 3000 to 4000mbps higher.  If I were you, if it is not too difficult, I would hard wire (using exactly the same specification wiring that BT uses but in white) from the the faceplate to the  router next to your PC.  Using this method, you will have eliminated all interference to your ADSL signal in your home and will with a bit of luck have the cleanest unfiltered ADSL signal that is possible for your line length.  In your case, it might be possible to obtain a better more stable SNR with a chance of higher synchronisation speeds.

For your information, I was with PIPEX one year ago and I was getting around 4 meg download.  Since moving to TalkTalk and carrying out the rewire plus going to ADSL2+ and and paying a little extra (£4) for the speed boost and changing my profile to 2FSNR6, I have now have a synchronisation of over 19000mbps with a consistent download of 16meg.

I can if you wish I can list the items I used to do this and the items are not to dear.  By the way, using phone line extensions are NOT the best way of sending ADSL signals around your house.  They are ok for voice, but nothing else.  It is not essential but in my opinion it is best to do this before the 10 day training period has finished.

I hope this helps.

[Oranged]

The general guidance is not to mess about too much - the system will tend to find its own level and too much interference/help on your part may be counterproductive.  If you allow the system to settle down and then come back on here after the 10 day training period if you feel there are problems that people may be able to help you with that may be a better route in the long run.

This is the best advice to follow until you've been connected for 10 days. What the stats are saying now won't necessarily be what they say in 11 days time  

[happy37]

GunRunner and Oranged

Thanks for sharing your thoughts - think that I will leave all things well alone to see what pans out at the end of 10 or 11 days time.....

Do you know whether I will be able to access certain stats like the amount of errors and so on from my Virgin supplied Netgear DG834GSP router version 3 please?

Thanks

Regards

happy37

[GunRunner]

GunRunner and Oranged

Thanks for sharing your thoughts - think that I will leave all things well alone to see what pans out at the end of 10 or 11 days time.....

Do you know whether I will be able to access certain stats like the amount of errors and so on from my Virgin supplied Netgear DG834GSP router version 3 please?

Thanks

Regards

happy37

I would say yes, I have a Netgear DG834G v4 and with the DGTeam firmware loaded and with this router firmware combination, you have a good chance at synchronising at lower  SNR margins  with a lower chance of drop outs and getting better results.  I would suggest getting everything up and running first then progressing in easy stages if everything is new to you.

[happy37]

GunRunner

I would suggest getting everything up and running first then progressing in easy stages if everything is new to you.

I think you're right - all of this is new to me (making the step from a fixed package to a Max one), so I think I will watch, wait and learn as the days tick on.

Please feel free to add anything else if you so widh - thanks for your advice...much appreciated.

Regards

happy37

[GunRunner]

happy37

Sent you a PM!

[waltergmw]

hello again Happy37,

Here's one I prepared earlier ! I thought you might like to see an example of line rate adjustments.
This connection was very bad until a BT Filtered Master socket was fitted on 19th December.
You'll see we were very happy up to early on 29th December but then something happend after that which caused a drop which sadly has remained ever since. However it's still a lot better that it was at the beginning.

Good luck !
Walter

[attachment deleted by admin]

[happy37]

walter

Thanks for this - all of this is new to me (making the step from a fixed package to a Max one), so I think I will watch, wait and learn as the days tick on.

I will come back and post my stats after the 10 days are over to see if they are any better in comparison to the first day ones.

Please feel free to add anything else if you so wish - thanks for your advice...much appreciated.

Regards

happy37

[sevenlayermuddle]

Hi there, Happy37,

Please don't anybody think I'm contradicting other advice (e.g. GunRuinner and Walter) here, as I know their experience reflects that of many others.  However, it's worth mentioning there are exceptions.  I have a similar line length to yours (55dB attenuation), so I have to struggle a bit to get about 4Mbps but, when I tried it,  I gained no measurable benefit from connecting to the master socket.  So my router is happily connected in a convenient distant extension.  It may be worth experimenting first if you can, before splashing out cash on extra hardware.

Unfortunately, each 'experiment' that you try carries a huge risk of having BT's DLM flag your line as 'unstable', which will cause it to assign you a punitive noise margin which will recude your speed.   This effect would probably be worse during the ten-day period, but the same risk still applies even after the 10 days are over and I don't think there's any way around it. If you do decide to experminent after the ten days then, at the very least, make sure you don't reconnect anywhere near ten times within an hour.   I experimented a little too much one day last August, and am still suffering the consequences.  

If you do upset BT's DLM, and get a punitive noise margin then, depending upon how Geeky you are (no offence to Geeks) , with some routers you can get around the punishment by subseuqently tweaking the noise margin - there's plenty of info elsewhere on the forum, and it worked well for me.   Alternatively you can try pleading with your ISP (who have to ask BT) to ease back the noise margin, but they (BT and/or the ISP) may not always choose to co-operate - mine (Demon) were hopeless.  It's best, really, if you can avoid it in the first place.

- SLM