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Author Topic: Tried everything...  (Read 4080 times)

Bablefish

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Tried everything...
« on: January 07, 2007, 12:29:06 PM »

Hello Kitz

I found myself here via a raging comments thread at PCW (http://interactive.pcw.co.uk/2006/02/slow_broadband_.html), where you had posted up some excellent tips. It seems I am not alone in my experiences with BT's 8mb service, which I upgraded to a couple of months ago from a stable, trouble-free 2mb.

I have followed all the recommended checks, tests and settings; my Belkin 7633 router is plugged into the master socket, all non-DSL devices are on filters etc. When I run any speedtester it is always the same story - I am getting less than 2mb. I live about 200 metres from the exchange.

These are the results of the BT test;

Test1 comprises of Best Effort Test:  -provides background information.
    IP profile for your line is - 2000 kbps
    DSL connection rate: 448 kbps(UP-STREAM)  7616 kbps(DOWN-STREAM)
    Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 1833 kbps

Is this something I should now to go to BT with, or will they fob me off like they do every time?

With regards, to interleaving; I play online games such as Counterstrike and since upgrading to 8mb, my ping to the game servers has shot up by about x 2.5. From what I have read, interleaving could be the cause...should I ask BT to turn it off? Will this have an adverse effect elsewhere?

Thanks in advance for you help.

MJ
Nottingham


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roseway

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2007, 01:00:18 PM »

Hello MJ, welcome to the forum.
I'm not Kitz, but I'll try to help.

Your router is connecting at 7616 kbps, which is supposed to be the maximum possible with interleaving, so that's OK. Do you always connect at that speed (or close to it), or do you sometimes get a much lower sync speed? If it's always up in that region then you appear to have a stuck profile (2000 kbps) and that's what is limiting your speed. To get this unstuck you need to raise it with your ISP.

However, if your router sometimes connects at a much lower speed then this needs to be addressed first. Have a look at http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/lowSNR.htm for some suggestions.

Interleaving is automatically applied when an ADSL connection is deemed to be unstable, i.e. it suffers from rather frequent re-syncs. You can ask your ISP to get it disabled again, but it might make your line rather unstable. It could be that something in the past caused some instability, but it's now fixed, in which case getting interleaving removed would be worthwhile to get lower latency.

Eric
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Bablefish

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2007, 01:17:23 PM »

Hi Eric, thanks for the welcome and the quick reply.

As far as I know I have always sync'd around the 7616 mark, which is why it has been so frustrating talking to the off-shore BT call centre - as far as they're concerned, they can see me getting the maximum possible rate and therefore say that the poor speedtest results are not their problem.

BT is my ISP. Are you aware of a phone number for their technical support where they will actually understand and take seriously a request to look at my IP profile?

Many thanks

Marcus

Update: after the usual script-based nonsense of the call centre, I have been given 0845 604 4813 as the number for tech support. I have been on hold in a queue for the last 25 mins...

...and have now given up after almost 40mins :(
« Last Edit: January 07, 2007, 02:24:24 PM by Bablefish »
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roseway

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2007, 06:58:55 PM »

I'm afraid I have no experience of dealing with BT as an ISP, but I can believe that it's frustrating. Do they have a web-based help section where you could post a carefully composed message describing the problem? Otherwise I've heard people say that after repeatedly calling the call centre, they eventually got through to someone who understood the problem and fixed it.

Eric
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  Eric

kitz

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2007, 11:06:29 AM »

Hi and welcome

I'd agree with roseway - looks like a stuck bRAS profile to me.

>> I live about 200 metres from the exchange.
>> IP profile for your line is - 2000 kbps

I dont know why - but for some reason it does seem to be the better lines that seem to get the stuck 2Mb profiles when upgrading to max.  Its almost like because the line is so stable that the DLM doesnt pick up any changes.
I was caught in this myself and no matter what I did (rebooting router/ leaving it off overnight etc), couldnt seem to trigger a change.

I also think its perhaps best to try and explain it by mail. 
You can say the line has consistantly synced at 7616 for the past few months, yet it would appear your throughput speed is purely being affected by the fact that your IP profile from the BT performance tester is 2000 and therefore it would appear that you have a stuck bRAS profile.

As regards to Interleaving, I believe BT (the ISP) now enable it by default on all new maxdsl lines.  You should be able to get it turned off permanently.
Interleaving does benefit a lot of lines on max.. however, due to you being so close to the exchange I would imagine you have good line stats, but if you would like to post them in here..  then we will have a look and just make sure that they are good enough to recommend interleaving being turned off permanently.
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Bablefish

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2007, 04:33:59 PM »

Hi and thanks Kitz

I fired off an email to 'broadbandsupport@btinternet.com' complaining that their call centre didn't understand the problem and secondly that I couldn't get through the supplied number that allegedly did. I also mentioned I work in IT and had researched and troubleshooted (trouble-shot?!) the problem to clearly be the IP profile, as agreed here.

I received quite a quick response (from the off shore team) and they acknowledged I had performed all the right checks, but still asking me to nominate a time when they could discuss the problem over the phone as it was "more interactive". I have emailed them back asking for assurance I won't end up in another pointless debate with them about who is at fault, and for them to acknowledge the IP profile is the issue.

Still waiting to hear back. Can it really be this difficult for them to change this?
Thanks for the interleave tip, presumably it is the same people who can change this for me, or is there a quicker way?

Thanks

Marcus
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kitz

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2007, 08:04:08 PM »

Hi marcus

Sounds like you are going to have to stand firm on the IP profile issue, I have seen several other BT users fall subject to the same problem of getting through to the right person who understands what is going on.
Once you get through to someone who does understand then all is normally ok and it should be done pretty quickly.
Same with interleaving.. perhaps let them phone you as they want - then insist on speaking to second line support?

Both of these actions have to be submitted by your ISP to BTw and there isnt a quicker route Im afraid :/

Good luck.
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Bablefish

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2007, 10:20:47 PM »

Well I agreed to BT's second request for an arranged phone call to investigate the problem. I said 8pm this evening...it's now 10.17pm and have not had that call.

Where is the customer service?!

Lets see what happens tomorrow.

Marcus

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Bablefish

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2007, 02:08:19 PM »

 :no:

Incredible. I finally managed to track the UK based tech support, spoke to a guy called Lee who in turn spoke to their "product specialist". I'm not sure what product he specialises in, but it sure aint DSLMax. Neither had heard of IP profile or BRAS and simply trotted out the usual response about how they can see I am getting 7.6mb on the line, so the low throughput must be a problem with my wiring or equipment *sigh*

I offered to send them a screenshot of my speedtest results together with all the information I had researched on the problem, but they said there is nothing they can do. They have now given me the number for the line services team. This is clearly my last resort.

For those of you that had to contact BT to unstick the profile - who did you talk to? What did you say or ask them to do? All I can think is I am not describing this properly to them.

thanks

Marcus

UPDATE: The number for the Line Services team....takes you straight back to Indian customer services. You couldn't make this **** up!
Tried UK tech support again, lost the plot a bit, now they say they have logged a fault call for the exchange engineers to investigate.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2007, 04:16:24 PM by Bablefish »
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kitz

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2007, 02:47:55 PM »

Bahhhhh

sorry to hear you are still having problems getting your ISP to understand how the basics of adsl works.

This problem or similar is something I have seen a lot of with BT customers of late.. and its a case of perserverance in getting through to someone who understands.  You could perhaps ask them to perform a woosh test on your line which should show them what your bRAS profile is
http://www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/images/WOOSH.gif

You are going to have to stand your ground Im afraid and keep insisting it gets escalated to someone who knows what they are talking about..   the only other option would be insist for your MAC key by threatening them that you wish to migrate to an ISP whose support agents have a clue on how to fix your problem. :/
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Bablefish

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2007, 12:14:18 PM »

Thanks for keeping an eye on this topic Kitz. I called Line Services (in India of course) and got straight through to someone who said engineers were looking into it and that he would ask them to call me directly within 24 hours. That was 25 hours ago! I will chase it up again tomorrow, but as of now nothing has changed.

The telephone engineer will be here at 4pm today to check and tidy the wiring. I hoping to get a DSL face-plate, if he's got one with him.

In the meantime, the one thing I didn't do earlier in this thread was post my noise and attenuation numbers. If you get a minute, I would appreciate your comments;

Data rate: down 7616 up 448
Noise margin: down 10.4 up 28
Output power: down 19.7 up 11.9
Attenuation: down 24 up 23

Thanks

Marcus
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kitz

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Re: Tried everything...
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2007, 01:08:54 PM »

Hi

Those line stats look pretty good to me.

>> The telephone engineer will be here at 4pm today to check and tidy the wiring

Cool..   at last - someone who should have an idea of what is obviously going on with your line :)

Let him test your line etc and make sure that all is well...  offer him a brew, then casually slip into the conversation that you have noticed that your line stats seem pretty good and stable. (If he hasnt already spotted the obvious at this point).
Say youve done several checks yourself and for the past few weeks your stats are stable blah blah..  but you notice that your bRAS profile according to the BT performance test constantly sits at 2000.  Ask him if its possible to reset your IP profile.


Just do a another quick test before he comes to make sure this is still the case - you could even perhaps leave a test result open on your PC screen - although he should be able to spot this himself if he does his equivalent of the woosh test.

Good Luck and let us know how it goes.
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