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Author Topic: MVNO 4G Data  (Read 4227 times)

cancunia

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MVNO 4G Data
« on: October 06, 2022, 08:54:24 AM »

I live in a rural area, near to Cadwell Park in Lincs, with long line ADSL broadband and have often wondered about 4G broadband as an  alternative for cost / speed. A friend gave me a CAT4 4G router to try and I got hold of some SIMs while the prices for Lyca & Lebara were at 1p / month. Due to problems with WiFi calling / VoWiFi on my Pixel 4 phone I also had to switch to ID Mobile so over the past month I've had 3 SIMS to try on 3 networks, the results are quite different between the networks and to some extent go against the results I've seen published elsewhere.
I used the Google (Measurement Labs) speed test as it's what I use on my ADSL.
So far as I know, my 4G signal comes from the masts at Cadwell Park as there are no others in the area. The router was placed near to an upstairs window where the signal is strongest.

Lebara (Vodafone) - Odd behaviour, starts at 6M then rapidly drops to 1M.
ID-Mobile (Three) - 5M - perhaps this was 3G?
Lyca (O2) - 28M

« Last Edit: October 06, 2022, 09:12:51 AM by cancunia »
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meritez

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2022, 11:25:17 AM »

What 4g router have you been given?
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cancunia

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2022, 02:10:59 PM »

What 4g router have you been given?

It's a Proroute GEM420 which is a rebadged AMIT 761
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meritez

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2022, 04:02:48 PM »

It's a Proroute GEM420 which is a rebadged AMIT 761

End of life since 2017:
https://proroute.co.uk/support/firmware/gem420-firmware/

Quote
Specifications:
Cellular:

LTE Bands : B3 (1800Mhz), B7 (2600Mhz), B8 (900Mhz), B20 (800Mhz).
WCDMA Bands : B1 (2100Mhz), B8 (900Mhz).
GPRS/EDGE : 850/900/1800/1900Mhz.
LTE Release 10 (without CA), UE category 4, 150Mbps for downlink and 50mbps for uplink.
WCDMA: Rel ’99 plus Rel 5 HSDPA, Rel 6 HSUPA, Rel 7 HSPA+, Rel 8 DC-HSPA+.
GSM/GPRS/EDGE : GSM Rel ’99, GPRS/EDGE Class 12.

Does not support the following UK LTE Bands:
B1
B28
B32
B40

There's also no Carrier Aggregation support.
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cancunia

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2022, 04:20:15 PM »

Yes, it's an old eol router and the firmware is not the factory original but everything else works.
Still odd that I could not get VoWiFi to work with the Lyca SIM in the router for either ID or VF, but could get it to work on VF with the ID-Moble SIM in the router.
If I had a more modern router, I'd try VoWiFi via the Lyca SIM again, maybe someone else on here already has?
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celso

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2022, 02:25:56 AM »

A few points:

That router can be a problem:

Meritez made a good point. Some of the missing bands are important in the UK:

- B1 is used by all 4 UK networks and provides fairly fast speeds (when compared to other slow bands).
- B28 is being used by O2 and Three for 4G. This is not a fast band, but it travels further and networks want to use it in rural areas.
- B32 is used by Vodafone and Three to help with download speeds, but I believe they use it more in urban areas.
- B40 is used by O2 and can be fast. I've seen it in cities, no idea about rural areas.

Not having B1 would be a big deal for me.

This page gives you an idea of what UK networks use: https://mobilespectrum.org/united_kingdom

Testing:

Your phone should have good 4G/LTE support. Assuming it's unlocked, you could use it to test speeds around the house with SIMs from all networks you can. Use the phone itself to run the tests so you don't have to worry about the problem being between your phone and your laptop or something like that. I find apps to be more reliable for speed tests than websites on mobile (I use Speedtest by Ookla, they also have a site speedtest.net), but pick anything that you trust.

After you know which places are the best for each network (you may be connecting to different cell towers), test the best options with the router you have. If it can't match the speeds, you know the router is not good enough. You can find "okay" 4G/LTE modems on Amazon or Ebay for less than £60. If not new, at least something used or refurbished... it will do the job.

Band support is important and some of the ones missing are needed for good speeds. Networks sometimes also power down some of the bands to save power (at night, for example) and that may result in slower speeds or force the router to use 2G or 3G. I don't know how important not having B1 or B28 is in your area though, it doesn't matter if all you can get is B20, for example...

By the way, you didn't mention EE. In case you're looking for something not long term just for testing, 1pmobile and plusnet mobile have 30 day plans. You won't find cheap EE plans with lots of data though.

Which bands do you use and where is the cell tower you're connected to?

I use Cell Mapper to find this info. Install it, give the permissions it asks for, and the main page shows the frequencies/bands your phone is using.

The app also has a "map" tab that tells you to which cell tower you're connected to based on their community data and the info from your phone's modem. I think you need to have a GPS/location lock for this to happen automatically, so it may not work indoors. For me it works well for known/older cell towers (newer ones take some time/data collection/moving around the area to guess where it is).

You can also use their website (cellmapper.net) to see the data collected by other users. We can't rely 100% on this data, but if someone got 4G on B1 somewhere, then you'll see that at some point someone was getting 4G in that place from a certain cell tower. Even if you don't use their app, the site can be useful.

(If you leave the app running in the background to collect data, it will drain your battery. You don't have to do it, just be aware.)

VoWiFi:

I've read that MVNOs on Vodafone's network sometimes take a long time to activate WiFi calling.

When I tested Smarty (Three) and 1p mobile (EE) it was available right away, but on Lebara (Vodafone) it only started working after a week or so. No idea why.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2022, 02:30:13 AM by celso »
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cancunia

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2022, 10:51:17 AM »

I did some more testing using my phone at home and also went on a quick trip in my car to a couple of local towers.
My phone with an ID Mobile (Three) SIM, reports that the 4G signal at home is only on Band 20.
With a full 4G signal on my phone, I still only get about 5-6M download speeds, much the same as with the 4G router.
I stopped at Cadwell Park where there are some mobile phone masts. No 4G signal on Three, but HSPA+ with very good download speeds of about 29M and uploads at about 6M.

Based on the above, and my original tests, the Three coverage in my part of the Wolds is less than stellar. I expect that it improves in some of the nearby towns on different masts but that's academic. Interesting that there appears to be no 4G from Three at Cadwell, but the planning applications that I looked at online did not show anything from Three so I'm guessing that they share a mast, and I'm guessing that my good Lyca (O2) signal comes from there too.

Unfortunately, it looks like my basic 4G router cannot be limited to 3G so I can't see if HSPA+ would be better.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2022, 10:55:36 AM by cancunia »
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cancunia

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2022, 03:33:32 PM »

A quick update on the above.
I tested the router again with the ID-Mobile SIM and found the info page that tells me if the connection is 3G or 4G. Today's Speed Test came out at 8M down & 1M up. This is over 3G HSDPA+ according to the router info page. That's way above my 3-4M ADSL.
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celso

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2022, 06:46:55 PM »

Assuming that's Cadwell Park in Lincolnshire, maybe EE would give you better speeds? Looking at CellMapper, they're the only ones with 4G on B3:



Three has 3G, but 4G comes from other cell towers further away and it's B20 only:

[Edit: while you can get B3 from Three, the signal seems to be very weak as its coming from the cell tower in Louth.]



Vodafone and O2 are B20 only, but closer. Vodafone:



O2:



Have a look at 1pMobile. 10GB = £10, 50GB = £15, 100GB = £20, 200GB = £30. If it works well, you can get one of those Scancom EE SIM cards (see Meritez posts in this sub forum) and save some money.

Three is shutting down 3G in 2024 so they should upgrade their cell towers in that area to 4G... until then, EE seems to be the best option.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2022, 09:34:10 PM by celso »
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cancunia

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2022, 01:01:09 PM »

Thanks for the Cellmapper info, yes it's Cadwell Pk in Lincs.

EE looks like a good option but not tested so far as there's no cheap n easy way to do that. I did contact 1p mobile about it but will have to pay for the data used. O2 was also a good option.
Three still looks better than my ADSL both in terms of speed & cost, hopefully they'll upgrade the Cadwell infrastructure at some point soon.
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celso

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2022, 05:02:11 PM »

Thanks for the Cellmapper info, yes it's Cadwell Pk in Lincs.

EE looks like a good option but not tested so far as there's no cheap n easy way to do that. I did contact 1p mobile about it but will have to pay for the data used. O2 was also a good option.
Three still looks better than my ADSL both in terms of speed & cost, hopefully they'll upgrade the Cadwell infrastructure at some point soon.

You mean having to pay per MB used? That's pay-as-you-go. They have normal plans with data, see their site under "Products":

- 10GB: https://www.1pmobile.com/data-10GB-SIM.taf
- 50GB: https://www.1pmobile.com/data-SIM.taf
- 100GB: https://www.1pmobile.com/data-100GB-SIM.taf
- 200GB: https://www.1pmobile.com/data-200GB-SIM.taf

The 10GB plan costs £10 and you have a month to test the speeds.

It does get expensive if you use a lot of data. For example, the 200GB plan costs £30... and in that case it starts to make more sense to go directly with EE (they have a £28 plan with unlimited data, if that's what you need) and a long term contract. If you can pay upfront, Scancom is cheaper. My unlimited SIM works out at ~£15/month which is cheaper than my fixed and slower connection.

Anyway, you mentioned above that you could get 28Mbps with O2... if that's enough, maybe there's no need to use EE. Just thought I'd mention it as they seem to be the ones with the better/faster coverage in that area.
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2022, 07:17:35 PM »

In my experience mobile broadband can be good for speed but is vastly less reliable than a fixed line.
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cancunia

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2022, 11:57:34 AM »

In my experience mobile broadband can be good for speed but is vastly less reliable than a fixed line.

Yes, that's what I'm expecting too. As my mobile data will be coming from a racetrack, it will be interesting to see what happens to the service when there are big events. Once my ADSL contract ends, I'll get a monthly rolling data SIM, if it becomes unusable, I'll go back to ADSL.
There's also a local wireless broadband service from Quickline which is about the same cost as ADSL so that's a possibility too but I'll explore the Mobile BBand first.
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celso

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #13 on: December 05, 2022, 05:58:24 PM »

Right now I have FTTC and haven't switched to 5G because it's not as stable. I don't mind the speed fluctuations, but latency spikes are annoying. FTTC, while 3x slower, is more consistent. On the other hand, my experience with ADSL was bad and if I had 4G back then, I'd take it.

By the way, not every network is equal when it comes to stability. Here in London I see more latency spikes on Three than I do on EE, for example. Vodafone used to be between the two.

Something to keep in mind in your case cancunia, is that B20 is useful for base coverage and better indoor signal, not performance. If you get your signal from a B20-only far away site that gets busy from time to time, the experience won't be as good as the alternative near you with B3.
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: MVNO 4G Data
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2022, 07:27:52 PM »

One of the problems I'm seeing, possibly due to the router, as Three sometimes stops working entirely until I toggle data off and on again.  That's in addition to the latency spikes.

Vodafone 4G seemed a lot more stable (it should be, the mast is practically on my doorstep) but even that went through a period where it was unreliable.

EE is too expensive.  But of course this was comparing to VDSL not ADSL, although my ADSL was pretty stable last I had it, just not very fast.
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Broadband: Zen Full Fibre 900 + Three 5G Routers: pfSense (Intel N100) + Huawei CPE Pro 2 H122-373 WiFi: Zyxel NWA210AX
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