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[Alex Atkin UK]

Very interested to see how Openreach will react to this.

https://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/9251-cityfibre-to-upgrade-networks-to-10gbps-from-april-2023

[Black Sheep]

But who - other than large businesses, are going to even want that kind of speed ?? Never mind having to pay for it ??

[licquorice]

All the willy wavers that think they need 1Gbps now 

[Black Sheep]

All the willy wavers that think they need 1Gbps now 

  - with you on this Licq - 

[Alex Atkin UK]

I guess it depends what their backhaul is, but I certainly would feel better going forward on Gigabit knowing the PON is 10G/10G rather than 2.4G/1.2G.  I'd imagine it would also be a big pull for businesses.

All the willy wavers that think they need 1Gbps now 

I take it you are not a gamer then?  Because when I bought a new game a week back and could install and play it in a a few minutes vs a few hours, that was pretty game-changing (pun intended) to me.

I get I'm a niche case in that I know WHY I want it, how it works and my fibro fog means if I want to play a game I want to play it NOW, because in an hour my brain fog has probably come back.

But the PON less likely to get congested any time soon is a benefit for everyone.  Remember, CityFibre is symmetrical so their Gigabit service just ONE user could practically max the upload, rather less likely on 10Gbit even if that customer HAS the 10Gbit package.

[gt94sss2]

All the willy wavers that think they need 1Gbps now 

tbh, I am thinking of getting a 1Gbps connection. I know I don't need it - I would be happy with 100 Mbps+

The reason I am considering it? Community Fibre are currently charging £25/month - which is likely to be cheaper/the same price that BT would charge for switching my service from FTTC to FTTP.

I wonder how much difference in cost there is to the likes of Openreach between a 1 and 10G PON. If not much, it may make sense to install the 10G PONs for some FTTP builds.

[Alex Atkin UK]

I wonder how much difference in cost there is to the likes of Openreach between a 1 and 10G PON. If not much, it may make sense to install the 10G PONs for some FTTP builds.

Probably a lot, with so many alt-nets installing XGSPON the decreased demand for GPON likely means the hardware is a lot cheaper.

Also the ONTs, the Nokia ONT uses less power than a 10Gbit ethernet port alone.  Although to be fair, most XGS-PON ONTs only do Gigabit as its not about the end-user speed, its about having less contention on the PON.

[Ixel]

It's not all about package speeds as some here seem to believe. I'm happy with 1 gigabit and knowing there's a chance that I can download large amounts of data quickly (e.g. a major update to a large game on Steam).

What I feel is important to consider is that XGS-PON offers 10 gigabits down and up while GPON only offers 2.5 gigabits down and 1.25 gigabits up. Assuming a split ratio of 32:1 and assuming (although highly unlikely) all users were downloading at the same time then that would be the equivalent of around 310~ megabits per connection on XGS-PON and around 78~ megabits on GPON. Upload is obviously worse for GPON. Assuming all connections were 1 gigabit or even 500 megabits symmetrical, XGS-PON has much less chance of some noticeable congestion compared to GPON. I hope my numbers are correct.

Anyway... good for CityFibre! Had CityFibre been deploying XGS-PON already then I may have considered joining them instead of Lightning Fibre as CityFibre was available here a number of months before Lightning Fibre was.

[Weaver]

I think it’s really excellent news. Will keep BT on their toes and I’m very interested in the upstream.

[Alex Atkin UK]

As I'm contracted with Zen for 2 years which presumably means they are contracted with OR for 2 years also, for me I'm just interested in anything that might push OR to offer symmetrical so I don't end up having to get a second connection for CityFibre.

I really want some sort of remote backup solution and while 100Mbit might be enough for that, I don't want to effectively max out my upstream for days on end while doing it.

[Ixel]

As I'm contracted with Zen for 2 years which presumably means they are contracted with OR for 2 years also, for me I'm just interested in anything that might push OR to offer symmetrical so I don't end up having to get a second connection for CityFibre.

I really want some sort of remote backup solution and while 100Mbit might be enough for that, I don't want to effectively max out my upstream for days on end while doing it.

I might be wrong on this but I believe that Zen's contract with Openreach would likely be 1 year. I'm uncertain whether Openreach also offer CPs a two year contract for FTTP, at least I can't find mention of a 24 month term on Openreach's pricing page. It's possible that it's just your contract with Zen that's 2 years.

[Black Sheep]

It's not all about package speeds as some here seem to believe. I'm happy with 1 gigabit and knowing there's a chance that I can download large amounts of data quickly (e.g. a major update to a large game on Steam).

What I feel is important to consider is that XGS-PON offers 10 gigabits down and up while GPON only offers 2.5 gigabits down and 1.25 gigabits up. Assuming a split ratio of 32:1 and assuming (although highly unlikely) all users were downloading at the same time then that would be the equivalent of around 310~ megabits per connection on XGS-PON and around 78~ megabits on GPON. Upload is obviously worse for GPON. Assuming all connections were 1 gigabit or even 500 megabits symmetrical, XGS-PON has much less chance of some noticeable congestion compared to GPON. I hope my numbers are correct.

Anyway... good for CityFibre! Had CityFibre been deploying XGS-PON already then I may have considered joining them instead of Lightning Fibre as CityFibre was available here a number of months before Lightning Fibre was.

I'm only guessing  ... but I suspect there's an OR business model in place around the wants and needs of 'todays customer', but also with a view to ensuring any hardware upgrade is a straightforward card swap on the OCR/ODF racks in the Exchange ... as and when the time is right to do so ??

A few folk visiting these kinds of forum are always going to want more, just because it's out there - but realistically, the average punter won't have a clue if the whole PON is maxed out and they are only getting 310Mbps, not that that situation would ever happen anyway, or is unlikely in the extreme.

Try and see the bigger picture from a business perspective, affordability to the majority of customers, plus the actual need for such incredible bandwidths to the majority of customers.

This isn't an alt-net cherry picking where they want a presence, this is a nationwide roll-out. 

[Alex Atkin UK]

I think we all understand why, not least Ofcoms restrictions that makes it less practical for Openreach than an alt-net.

Its good in that way too, as if we get enough competition then Ofcom can allow everyone to drop their prices.

[meritez]

All the willy wavers that think they need 1Gbps now 

I have yet to see anyone on a symmetric FTTP service actually make use of the upload speed.

[Alex Atkin UK]

I have yet to see anyone on a symmetric FTTP service actually make use of the upload speed.

That's kinda the point.  With any network the ideal scenario is to have more bandwidth than you need so you never hit contention related issues.

My server has 10Gbit, I'll likely never hit that, but its good to have.  I do however sometimes move large video files around and having faster broadband means there may come a time where its more practical to move those files to the cloud rather than locally to, for example, do AI upscaling without cooking my house.

Its not necessarily for what you do today, its for what potential it opens up for tomorrow - which will only happen once the technology becomes more common.

Some people have cloud based CCTV, when I'm away from home I VPN into my home LAN.  You don't think it opens up a lot of potential to be able to be at a friend house and access your home LAN as if you are there?

How about a family with a Plex server they can share across the entire family in different locations, without transcoding the quality down?  It might not be a common use-case today, but it could very well be tomorrow.  You need the infrastructure first before you think of ways you can use it.