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[Pwiggler]

hi all,

i'm pretty sick to my back teeth now with having to put up with BT using ellacoyas to QOS/shape my traffic so i was thinking of moving to a different isp, heres where my question starts:

when bt sell bandwidth to another isp (ie aol), do bts ellacoyas shape their traffic as well or do the purchasing isp apply their own method of traffic shaping?   (if that makes sense)

.... so therefore i could end up a much less shaped connection??

[roseway]

Ellacoyas are operated by ISPs, so if you change to a different ISP you will no longer be affected by BT Broadband's Ellacoyas.

[Pwiggler]

cheers Eric 

[kitz]

>> bts ellacoyas shape their traffic as well or do the purchasing isp apply their own method of traffic shaping?

Its BT Wholesale that sells the backhaul which is a completely different company to BT retail.
BTBroadband is part of the BT retail group.
Confused? 

Its up to the ISP to put their own ellacoyas on (although this can change with 21CN, where if the ISP wants they can use BT Wholesale to control traffic).
.. and on top of that there is some very low level QoS that goes on at the exchanges to give priority to certain traffic if the exchange is busy..  but its far from the ellacoya type stuff.

ATM its BTBroadbands ellecoyas that are controlling your traffic.

>> so therefore i could end up a much less shaped connection??

You could indeed..  but be careful because there are a few ISPs whose traffic shaping is much worse than BTs.
http://www.kitz.co.uk/isp/caps.htm


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Gosh that was quick with the replies
/must learn to type quicker

[oldfogy]

Just on the off-chance.

Don't sign up for one of their higher packages, but sign up on a lower package, then if satisfied you can always upgrade, at least this way you do not end up paying for something you either can't get or use.

[Pwiggler]

cheers all !

i'll have to look at whats available and what they can offer.

atm i pay £4 and unlimited telephone calls in the uk and the way mrs pwiggler  hammers it, i'll have to choose carefully.

my line is capable of 8 meg but i want the cheep calls as well??  any ideas??

[UncleUB]

There's always TalkTalk. 

[kitz]

You could leave the phone with BT for their Anytime package and use another ISP for adsl.

atm Im with BT for phone but on LLU adsl.

When I get my lazy ass in gear though.. Im thinking of going for this package which is cheaper than BT, and about the cheapest package out there (for my use anyhow)
http://www.plus.net/residential/phonecalls/home/index.shtml

Warning though you need to add on £1.50 for caller display, but its still cheaper than BT.

I was originally put off by
If you don't have PlusNet broadband, you'll need to get it so that you can have Home Phone
but Ive been told thats only because they cant do the automated signup online for phone only.. 
However if you contact any of the reps (theres a couple who frequent this forum) they can do the signup manually, even if you dont have Plusnet adsl.

[Pwiggler]

thanks for that, the plusnet package with anytime calls is £35 per month.  i had a look at orange's packages as well which works out at £25 pm, but thats only evening and w/e free calls.

hmmmmmmmm .... still thinking

just looked at plus.nets site and they give details of what traffic shaping to expect and on option 3 its down to .25mbs in the day time 

[guest]

So switching your phone from BT Retail (part of the BT Group) to Plusnet (part of the BT Group) saves money?

Priceless 

[kitz]

yeah seems silly doesnt it.
Mind you PN is cheaper than BT for adsl anyhow.

The one that always amazed me when they first started doing things like that was when the post-office started offering things cheaper than BT..  maybe I recall the term "GPO" too much.

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Mind you its not as stupid as when Br Gas started saying that they could supply electricity cheaper than the electric co.
And the Leccy co started saying that "their Gas" was cheaper than the Gas companies.   

[poppy]

I recently changed telephone from BT to Plusnet Anytime+ for one of my friends who was only on dialup with PN. As Kitz said, it has to be done manually and it is best to contact one of the reps.
I would imagine that you would have to sign up to a PAYG dialup account on the PN portal first.
I've used Anytime+ for quite a while and IMO it is good value for money. Also, they have a pretty good fault reporting system where if you press the correct number for telephone faults you are not queued and the call is answered immediately (also it's a geographical number). I had a fault a few months ago and it was sorted promptly and efficiently - no waiting for the call to be answered by somebody abroad.

[jid]

thanks for that, the plusnet package with anytime calls is £35 per month.  i had a look at orange's packages as well which works out at £25 pm, but thats only evening and w/e free calls.

hmmmmmmmm .... still thinking

just looked at plus.nets site and they give details of what traffic shaping to expect and on option 3 its down to .25mbs in the day time 

You could always go with Tiscali Anytime Talk with BBand Option 2 LLU  8)!!

Anytime Local and Int. Calls. 8meg Unlimited Broadband, Free Line Rental & Caller Display @ 48p a month  £20.48 p.m

http://www.tiscali.co.uk/products/talk/

Its a great package and their phone service is great, and when the broadband is set up and configured correctly it is a great service. I have been with them for 5years and only recently went on their Talk and BBand Package.

[kitz]

The vast majority of ISP phone packages use something called WLR (Wholesale Line Rental) which is basically the same BT service only rebadged by the ISP (and sometimes sold a bit cheaper).
Some ISPs have installed their own kit in the exchanges.


ISPs that use WLR for phone off the top of my head are


Plusnet
Sky
BT (obviously)
PostOffice
IDNet
Vodafone
Vispa
.. and lots more

ISPs that use MPF  :-

CPW Group (TalkTalk + AOL)
Orange
Tiscali Group (Tiscali + Pipex + Bulldog)

[Pwiggler]

finally got a MAC from BT after 5 emails requesting it.  in the end i had to resort to threatening to report them to ofcom.

had another look around and sky seem to be a good choice atm.  8meg bb and free anytime telephone call for £34.00.

thats £16.00 cheeper than bt!