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Author Topic: Same old upstream story for line 3  (Read 7771 times)

Alex Atkin UK

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #60 on: February 14, 2020, 07:34:16 PM »

Yes. The ballpark guesstimate figures mentioned to me were eye-watering.

Six digits?
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CarlT

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #61 on: February 14, 2020, 08:11:14 PM »

The guesstimator only went to £39k as I recall. It was a bit academic following up with excess construction charges on top once that was passed.

There are a lot of poles serving very few properties in need of work and/or new ones or duct work needing to be done.

This is probably a task best suited to LTE or LEO satellite for the shorter term. The R100 project had a value for money limit of £1,600-1,700 per premises passed that required individual review. These sites are right at the extreme of the hockey stick.
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Weaver

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #62 on: February 15, 2020, 12:55:39 AM »

If a business needed a serious feed for a new site then it would just be nothing for them?
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CarlT

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #63 on: February 15, 2020, 09:25:31 AM »

Given the costs involved in setting up a business of any size in that area a series of microwave relays would seem to be the way to go.

For a small business that can't afford such things stuffed until a wireless technology is provisioned.

Either way you see the theme of wireless technologies.
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aesmith

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #64 on: February 17, 2020, 02:22:24 PM »

If a business needed a serious feed for a new site then it would just be nothing for them?
We arranged a wireless point to point service for one of our customers who had workshop and stores in a business park outside the city.  It was a bit of a pain with maintenance as it had a relay on a commercial mast with all sorts of access restrictions.  For that site excess construction charges for a conventional private circuit were over a quarter of a million.  The stupid thing was that it was a development with multiple tenants, and the landlord owned a bunch of land all around the park and owned a plant hire operation.  Some cooperation from him might have made the connection cost effective and would have added a lot of value to his development.
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Weaver

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #65 on: April 25, 2020, 02:39:09 PM »

I am getting the usual cyclic upstream line 3 behaviour, 6dB high time, 1-1.5 dB low time and the upstream target is 6dB. Iíve just noticed something. The line dropped for some reason or other, but anyway, it dropped at such a point that the upstream SNRM vales were as stated, with a really low low. And that mean that the upstream rate was really good, at 499 kbps, which is about ~100k better than it usually is.

This time I did some speedtestests, with speedtest2.aa.net.uk and the ookla speed tester, because I wanted to find out what the combined upstream rate was like when all four lines were roughly the same rate upstream, all at or just over 500kbps u/s. To my surprise, I found that the upstream combined rate results were rubbish compared to what I have been getting recently. speedtest2.aa.net.uk was ~1.30Mbps with the 499k upstream line 3 rate and the expected rate was 1.5-1.6Mbps. So as an experiment, I reset the line 3 upstream  SNRM so that it was back at the target of 6dB and the upstream rate then went back down to 389k

Live sync rates:
  #1: down 2807 kbps, up 519 kbps
  #2: down 2700 kbps, up 544 kbps
  #3: down 2964 kbps, up 389 kbps 6db upstream SNRM, 6dB upstream target
  #4: down 2553 kbps, up 515 kbps

Now at this unequal upstream rate, when you would expect combined upstream to be bad, the result was the reverse: a combined upstream rate that was a big improvement - combined u/s rate =1.65Mbps at an u/s line 3 rate of 389k.

So in a nutshell: upstream equal speeds - bad upstream combined effective performance

Note: The line 3 downstream rate is about 30kbps lower, although I canít see how that could affect things too much, unless itís something to do with too many errors slowing things down?

So how can the upstream combined rate be 300k worse when the rates are equal ? All the other upstream rates are unchanged, btw, so that isnít it.
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burakkucat

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #66 on: April 25, 2020, 04:23:08 PM »

Higher synchronisation speed --> more errors --> more retransmssions --> lower throughput, perhaps?
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Weaver

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #67 on: April 25, 2020, 05:54:28 PM »

Oh, I see. The higher upstream speed was at a 6dB minimum SNRM and there donít seem to be any CRCs much at that SNRM. I canít see any CRC upstream errors before or after the change, but looking at the FEC count instead it is 500-1000 per unit time (whatever the unit is) showing on the FEC count graph before I forced a resync and put the SNRM up to the target of 6dB and put the upstream rate down from 499k to 389kbps, and after the change the u/s FEC count is 10-50 per unit time and as I said zero CRCs upstream after the change.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 06:03:51 PM by Weaver »
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Weaver

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Re: Same old upstream story for line 3
« Reply #68 on: November 10, 2020, 08:34:43 AM »

Now the upstream SNRM variations have disappeared.  :fingers:  :congrats: Unfortunately I didnít note what time it happened. In recent weeks, Iíve had a lightning near miss and then two engineer visits after that, so perhaps one of these three events fixed it, or perhaps it was fixed somehow earlier than that.

So hopefully the upstream line 3 nightmare is gone for good, settled at a solid 6dB target now. :)



On the other hand, the line 2 irregular variation is still there though, still at 2dB height, and the pattern is not the same every day. Some days multiple transitions within a 24 hour period, but always the same height. Itís not causing any noticeable problems though as the u/s SNRM drops from 6dB to 4dB. Zero CRC errors upstream for the last 24 hour period, and 5 u/s CRC errors + 5 ES for the 24 hrs before that. Engineers came out to line 2 as well as line 3, so the Ďfixed by engineerí argument is dubious; why isnít line 2 fixed by whatever fixed line 3?
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