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[supercooper]

Morning chaps 

I have just check the connection this morning and can see no dropouts over the weekend. I think im set on a RIEN issue here as again stated by ezzer.  The connection appears to remain stable over weekends and goes nuts when its used throughout a working day.

We did attend site to check for RIEN, but found only an electrical DP close to the router.  I know that RIEN is something very difficult to pin point indeed and i think i need a RIEN specialist to check this out.  Ezzer can you tell me what to request BT side to have someone look at this?

Now then the other thing i spotted this morning on the new linksys was a huge SNR.
DSL Status:   Up     
      DSL Modulation Mode:   GDMT     
      DSL Path Mode:   INTERLEAVED     
      Downstream Rate:   4416 Kbps     
      Upstream Rate:   448 Kbps     
      Downstream Margin:   2147483647 db     
      Upstream Margin:   24 db     
      Downstream Line Attenuation:   46     
      Upstream Line Attenuation:   29     
      Downstream Transmit Power:   0     
      Upstream Transmit Power:   0


The other problem i have with this site is the distance so it is hard to get someone to go   My bosses will tell me that we have done everything our side and prob wont re-attend.  I dont however want the customer to incur charges from BT.  I will call the customer and advise him on rotating devices to see if anything changes.

Thanks, Chris

[kitz]

>> on the new linksys was a huge SNR.

Thats when the router goes into negative SNRM figures - its fairly common with a lot of routers which dont know how to (or expect to) display negative figures.

>> I will call the customer and advise him on rotating devices to see if anything changes

If you cant attend then it does make things a bit more difficult..  Presumably you have told the customer what we suspect is causing his problems...  have you asked them if there is anything they can think of which may be causing it.   eg monitors etc

[Ezzer]

I'm not sure if you can request a REIN specialist to look at the fault, probably worth a try as I don't see the info between isp & bt wholesale.

Normaly if an engineer suspects REIN then they close the job with a clear code of 69.9 ext REIN, along with relavent notes (think I've got 2 such faults coming my way for what I hear today). Some broadband engineers do check for REIN, it's a subject we tend to fall into by accident as it's infrequent. I think I've just had enough with success I've been given the reins for this area (soz, not my pun).

Let us know what result you get from such a request, Curious to know

[supercooper]

I had a chat with the customer again today and he said the only thing that may cause problems is their welding equipment, this is located about 30-40 feet away.  Hmmm sounds possible that a Mig welder could cause such problems.

I have sent an essay to our provide explaining the ins and outs to this fault and requested a RIEN investigation be conducted.  Im hoping for a good response.

Thanks, Chris

[supercooper]

arrrgh a not so good reply from our provider:

Updated to Cust-Pend. Reason: Now that the intermittent connection appears to have been resolved the speed of this connection will begin to increase and over the course of the next few days should return to normal. Thank you.

Something i found out yesterday from the Engineer who attended is that the speed tests only came back at 170kbps-279kbps which is very low indeed for this connect at the current sync rate. 

Fair point to our provide that the connection indeed has not dropped, however clearly something is causing the connection to deteriate pushing the SNR right down and slowing speeds to a snails pace.  It is clear they have not listened to what i have stated in reagrds to the possibility of a RIEN issue here.

My question now is, do you think they are right that the connection will stablize and incease speed or have i indeed been fobbed off? 

Thanks in advance, Chris

[kitz]

>> "the speed of this connection will begin to increase and over the course of the next few days should return to normal".

>> the Engineer who attended is that the speed tests only came back at 170kbps-279kbps which is very low indeed for this connect at the current sync rate


Sounds like at some point the line must have had a very low sync.  The reply from your SP seems to be indicating this (they can often tell if theres been a low sync - depends on their system and how long they keep records for)... as they appear to be quoting the usual reply after a low sync event has lowered the IP profile.

It's also likely that the speed test performed by the engineer was much lower than the sync due to the IP profile having been reduced.

[supercooper]

Hi Kitz,

Is far as i am aware the profile has never changed from the above posted stats.

I should have posted the speed test picture as there are 2 ways of reading the speeds (always confused me a bit)

Please take a look at the attched to see how bad this is.

Thanks, Chris

[attachment deleted by admin]

[roseway]

>> Is far as i am aware the profile has never changed from the above posted stats.

Sorry if I'm teaching my granny, but the IP profile is set automatically by the BT equipment and doesn't show in your stats. You can find out your IP profile by using the BT speedtester or some ISP's provide that information in their customer portals. If you had a low speed re-sync recently then the IP profile would be lowered and can take several days to recover.

[supercooper]

Ah thank you for educating me on that Roseway 

In the mean time i have re-booted the Router remotely and set Routerstats running once more, this time i will leave it over night to see when this spike hits.

Here are the new current stats:
DSL Status:   Up     
      DSL Modulation Mode:   GDMT     
      DSL Path Mode:   INTERLEAVED     
      Downstream Rate:   5696 Kbps     
      Upstream Rate:   448 Kbps     
      Downstream Margin:   15 db     
      Upstream Margin:   24 db     
      Downstream Line Attenuation:   46     
      Upstream Line Attenuation:   29     
      Downstream Transmit Power:   0     
      Upstream Transmit Power:   0

Im going to call the help desk now to see if they can give me the IP profile.

Feel very silly know but hey i need to learn.

Thanks, Chris

[supercooper]

Ok, just had a lenthy chat with our provides help desk and explained to situation to one of the tech guys.

He told me that there is a roumour that has not yet been confirmed that BT maybe doing away with RIEN faults as they are not BT's fault. Very vaugue but that was the basic jist.  Worrying to say the least.

Anyway he gave me the line stats and did some tests for me.
3.5 Meg Line rate
MSR 288k
STR 288k
Errored seconds on downstream = 6
Copper line test: ok

He said that the MSR was very low indeed and suggested trying a "BT I-Plate" which can reduce the effects of RIEN.  Hmmm i had no idea these things exsisted, other wise i would have bought one in.

Chris

[kitz]

>> that BT maybe doing away with RIEN faults as they are not BT's fault

That would be very sad... but in a way I do have some sympathy with BT on this.. as they must be spending millions of man hours on faults that relate to next doors faulty TV, or a faulty heater, monitor etc etc etc

>> MSR 288k STR 288k

That MSR is very low indeed for a line which can sync at times between 3-5 Mbps.
Im presuming that was read out over the phone..  the "STR" is actually "FTR" - Fault Threshold rate

>> suggested trying a "BT I-Plate" which can reduce the effects of RIEN.

Before you do...  have a read of Improving your adsl connection.  Theres a section on there about the I-plate.  Pay attention to the note at the bottom of that particular section about the I-plate in conjunction with an adsl filtered NTE5 faceplate and removing the ring wire.

[supercooper]

Hi,

Interesteresting results from last nights routerstats.  The connection again has not dropped at all and also the SNR has not gone into minus figures as it has been doing.

The SNR seems to settle between 13-15db as an average which is the way it was untill 19:30 where it went a little funny on the chart.  I traced at from 10:30 yestderday - 09.30 This morning, at 05:30 it started settling down again 06:34 near flat lined at 13db. 

So from 19:30-06:34 the SNR did change a fair bit on the idle connection, maybe this is considered as normal im not total sure. Please can you guys take a look at tell me what your thoughts are.

The good news is that it has not gone into minus figures or dropped, but thats not helping me find the cause

BT side i requested BT check their exchange equipment once more and asked them to check why the MSR was indeed very low, here was the response from our provide.

Awaiting External Response to Cust-Pend. Reason: Hi Chris, The outcome of diagnostics on the line by BT have indicates the profile on the line is due to change within the next 20 hours from 14:35pm yesterday. BT have advised testing on the line does not indicate any issues with the exchange equipment or the line. Please advise the customer and let us know how you wish to proceed with the raised fault so we may action accordingly. Thank you

Things appear to be moving in the right direction on this  

Chris

[attachment deleted by admin]

[roseway]

There's obviously quite a lot of random noise during the night, and the way it starts at 19:30 and ends at 06:30 perhaps implies that it's due to street lights or something like that. But the level isn't particularly exceptional. If you really can link the times to the switching of street lights you might be able to get the council to take some action.

[Ezzer]

With those speeds I would have checked via my dsl helpdesk if a throttle back is applied to the service and is it a case of it being stuck and needing a manual intervention. Although if there are still noise issues then the throttle back would more than likely reappear until the noise is resolved.

I've been on the phone whilst reading this trying to sort a lift & shift (again  , 2nd one this am and both have been nightmares dispite the guys i was on the phone to trying desperately to get the problems sorted, bless 'em) and in conversation he's unaware of the dropping of REIN faults rumor and it's the 1st i've heard of it. although it does cost bt openreach and the division of offcom which covers interference issues do charge the owner of a source over £300 although they don't get involved with broadband REIN as far as I know

[supercooper]

This morning the connect fell to -2db.  Called the customer and they have no idea what may have caused this.  Asked about all electrical equipment and nothing is a mis   They started work at 06.30 this morning.

BT are going back tomorrow for yet another look and im still awaiting a response on "throttle back".

The connection took a nose dive bang on 08.30 this morning and is trailing along at -1 -2db.

Lets see what the BT guys has to say this time, i will keep you informed.

Thanks, Chris