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Author Topic: PON rationale and business optical users  (Read 436 times)

Weaver

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PON rationale and business optical users
« on: August 21, 2020, 10:32:22 AM »

I would simply like to ask a couple of very basic questions about optical internet access technology

1. Is the motivation behind PON simply cost-saving, because getting power to intermediate nodes is expensive ? (But why can’t they steal power from the end-users? Yes I know this would mean having to lay some copper too and the power supply tech would be tricky.)

2. Are business optical users on the same type of PON as home users? Slow upstream might be a deal-breaker surely?
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PhilipD

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Re: PON rationale and business optical users
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2020, 11:27:35 AM »

1) Yes, or reducing maintenance costs and installation costs, every business it is always about money and reduced costs and increased profits. A network as large as Openreach if you can reduce the complexity it makes a huge difference.  Also because Openreach deal with a vast range of customer types, the vast majority happy with slower speeds or simply don't ever max out their connections, it makes sense to split single fibres amongst more customers.

2) Yes, if using FTTP rather than a leased line.  If it is a deal breaker then the company will need another product, that happens a lot and many industrial estates and commercial buildings will have a choice of supplier.  You get what you pay for.

Don't forget that PON is always improving with new versions out now and in the works that can provide big speed increases, once the fibre is in place, unlike old telephone cable, that fibre is pretty much future proof and isn't the bottleneck.
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Weaver

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Re: PON rationale and business optical users
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2020, 11:47:43 AM »

What then is a ‘leased line’ in the context of optical?

Are there different grades of PON service orderable from a given supplier ? (I don’t mean a comparison from the kit fitted by eg BT [or is it ‘Openreach’] vs some other supplier)
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j0hn

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Re: PON rationale and business optical users
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2020, 12:30:30 PM »

Are there different grades of PON service orderable from a given supplier ? (I don’t mean a comparison from the kit fitted by eg BT [or is it ‘Openreach’] vs some other supplier)

Yes.
OpenReach use GPON for their FTTP.
That's 2.4Gb/s down and 1.2Gb/s up split between up to 32 users.

They can also run XGS-PON on top of GPON which gives 10Gb/s down and 10Gb/s up.

So really they can share up to 12.4Gb/s down and 11.2Gb/s up between those 32 homes.

Eventually some other PON technology will likely come along increasing that available bandwidth further.

What then is a ‘leased line’ in the context of optical?

Point to point fibre.
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tickmike

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Re: PON rationale and business optical users
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2020, 12:33:12 PM »

Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.

I would simply like to ask a couple of very basic questions about optical internet access technology

1. But why can’t they steal power from the end-users?
Because it is 'passive optical network' it does not need any power.
Quote

2. Are business optical users on the same type of PON as home users? Slow upstream might be a deal-breaker surely?

Yes.
I am on 'Business' ADSL2 and hope soon to be on 'GPON'

I ask my CP 'Eclipse Kcom' that question and there reply.

I have had a reply from our core networking team, and they have advised that business users are not prioritised over consumer traffic, and traffic on an FTTP
circuit should be the same.


Ethernet Passive Optical Network (EPON)  .
I think these are just for One user but very expensive.
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Weaver

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Re: PON rationale and business optical users
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2020, 01:15:48 PM »

@tickmike  - Yes, I understand the term passive; I wondered why it is felt to be an advantage having passive kitz when there is power available - at the end-users’ premises.

In contrast in some situations there is no practical local source of power at all, not close by; one example is the undersea BT network in the Hebrides in the Clyde Estuary and from Caithness to Orkney, which was put in place about, what, five years ago, where the network could be achieved repeaterless and so no need for dangerous and expensive power cables to seabed repeaters; dangerous because of the risk of fishing vessels hooking up power cables by mistake.

Coming back to FTTP with power; there would be of course the hassle of having to run copper power condition cabling alongside the fibre, although the cable can be rubbish quality, but at low voltage the losses could be substantial, so some design choices there, and there’s also the problem of some end-users turning off their power supply, either stupidly or for other reasons, but anyway, intermediate nodes would need to be able to run on some reduced subset of the available power lines
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Ronski

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Re: PON rationale and business optical users
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2020, 01:26:16 PM »

Reverse power from the customer equipment was looked at for G.fast, but the idea was dropped, probably due to the complexity of it Also it would mean keeping a section of copper between the end user and the equipment.
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Weaver

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Re: PON rationale and business optical users
« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2020, 01:40:03 PM »

@Ronski Agreed - since you obviously can avoid the need for power (because they did, successfully) then you might as well avoid the nuisance of the copper cables and the potential problems with end-users’ supplies getting turned off. I seem to remember very vaguely reading an article about some outfit demonstrating such power-stealing tech at an industry show many years ago. Obviously the benefits, costs and cost savings just weren’t there, weren’t enough.
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j0hn

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Re: PON rationale and business optical users
« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2020, 02:17:16 PM »

Ethernet Passive Optical Network (EPON)  .
I think these are just for One user but very expensive.

EPON is a shared PON system the same as GPON is.
It would likely never be deployed to a single user.
Usually a minimum 32:1 split but supports up to 128:1 split.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2020, 02:20:11 PM by j0hn »
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