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Author Topic: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)  (Read 920 times)

Geekofbroadband

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FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« on: May 19, 2020, 08:32:17 AM »

I recently checker the BT DSL checker and it said FTTP is now available then checker the BT site and it confirmed it.
I have some questions about it.

1) Our line comes to the house on a telegraph pole, when they install it will they run it along side the copper line, or replace it fully with a fibre one?

2) Right now it seems like only BT are selling it, 500Mbs/73Mbs for £49.99 a month or 910Mbs/110Mbs for £59.99 a month, will Plusnet offer FTTP any time soon?

3) I currently have VDSL with Plusnet, and I'm on an ECI cabinet, I know all the issues everyone has had with ECI /G.INP but with FTTP does that no longer matter, for example the fibre modem they provide, it won't matter about the chipset (Broadcom or infineon) right? because its directly to the exchange, no cabinet involved.

4) If I were to use my own router and plug it into the fibre modem, what are the set up options I should pick. Now with VDSL I would pick PPPoE then put in my username and password. But im not sure for FTTP.

Thanks
« Last Edit: May 19, 2020, 08:37:04 AM by Geekofbroadband »
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sof006

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2020, 11:56:27 AM »

I recently checker the BT DSL checker and it said FTTP is now available then checker the BT site and it confirmed it.
I have some questions about it.

1) Our line comes to the house on a telegraph pole, when they install it will they run it along side the copper line, or replace it fully with a fibre one?

2) Right now it seems like only BT are selling it, 500Mbs/73Mbs for £49.99 a month or 910Mbs/110Mbs for £59.99 a month, will Plusnet offer FTTP any time soon?

3) I currently have VDSL with Plusnet, and I'm on an ECI cabinet, I know all the issues everyone has had with ECI /G.INP but with FTTP does that no longer matter, for example the fibre modem they provide, it won't matter about the chipset (Broadcom or infineon) right? because its directly to the exchange, no cabinet involved.

4) If I were to use my own router and plug it into the fibre modem, what are the set up options I should pick. Now with VDSL I would pick PPPoE then put in my username and password. But im not sure for FTTP.

Thanks

As far as i'm aware FTTP is different as they have to come and install a openreach modem with a fibre input which then gives you ethernet out to any device you plug in e.g. RT-AC68U.

Found a good example of what it may look like on Google Images


As for ISPs other than BT supplying fibre I am unsure, there are a handful of ISPs who do supply FTTP. Zen are one who do I believe.

And as for replacing the copper I am unsure, I don't think they replace it they just disconnect it in favour of fibre but I could be totally wrong in that regard.
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j0hn

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2020, 12:55:12 PM »

If FTTP were installed now they would replace your copper with a dual fibre/copper cable.

Plusnet don't sell FTTP. No plans to do so at present.

The manufacturer of your FTTC cabinet is irrelevant.

Authentication on a router is the same on FTTC and FTTP with BT.
Same username password, still PPPoE.
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Geekofbroadband

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2020, 04:04:29 PM »

Thanks  :D
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Geekofbroadband

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2020, 05:06:58 AM »

How comes its advertised as "910mbs" and not just "1000mbs" or "1gbs" like most fttp services do? I mean I'm not complaining about the speed but its normally 1gbs down and up. Can openreachs fttp only handle so much or could they sell 1000mbs down and up if they wanted
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2020, 05:35:27 AM »

How comes its advertised as "910mbs" and not just "1000mbs" or "1gbs" like most fttp services do? I mean I'm not complaining about the speed but its normally 1gbs down and up. Can openreachs fttp only handle so much or could they sell 1000mbs down and up if they wanted

Probably to accommodate overheads and so people with crap Realtek Gigabit NICs don't complain that they are only getting 940Mbit?

Its provisioned as Gigabit.
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j0hn

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2020, 01:02:04 PM »

How comes its advertised as "910mbs" and not just "1000mbs" or "1gbs" like most fttp services do?

OFCOM want average speeds advertised instead of selling a package as "up to".
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2020, 05:37:16 PM »

OFCOM want average speeds advertised instead of selling a package as "up to".

While I understand that, I'm not sure that counts as the average speed of Gigabit is going to be much much lower than 910Mbit because its so hard to actually test it and as FTTP is not an "up to" service provision, does that even apply anyway?
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j0hn

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2020, 06:43:27 PM »

FTTP is not an "up to" service provision, does that even apply anyway?

The advertising rules aren't just for DSL broadband that varies by distance.

Under the ASA's new rules, broadband providers must give an 'average' speed.
It must be based on the download speed available to at least 50% of customers at peak time (8pm-10pm for residential lines).

Quote from: ASA
Numerical speed claims

Advertisers making a numerical speed claims should be able to demonstrate that that speed is achievable for at least 50% of the consumer base at peak time (defined by Ofcom as between 8 and 10pm). The substantiation required for speed claims must be robust and representative of actual performance.

No idea what the exact methods used to test this are.

I'm not sure that counts as the average speed of Gigabit is going to be much much lower than 910Mbit because its so hard to actually test it

BT name the package full fibre 900 but they are advertising it as 910Mb average download.
They must be pretty confident they are meeting the ASA criteria.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2020, 06:46:30 PM by j0hn »
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j0hn

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2020, 06:50:59 PM »

How comes its advertised as "910mbs" and not just "1000mbs" or "1gbs" like most fttp services do?

Just to add to my earlier comment...

Other FTTP providers have to follow the same rules and don't sell their products as 1Gb or 1000Mb.

Although Vodafone name their full fibre as Gigafast, they sell their 1000Mb package as 900Mb.
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Bowdon

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #10 on: May 23, 2020, 10:34:26 PM »

I'd get upgraded asap! Especially being on a ECI cabinet like me.

I'm sure its going to be like night and day when you switch on the FTTP connection.

Let us know how you go on through the ordering, installing, and what you think about it.

I'm always interested reading peoples experiences of FTTP. It's like reading a scifi book  ;D
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Geekofbroadband

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #11 on: May 24, 2020, 01:16:52 PM »

I'll be sure to share details  ;)

Right now we're deciding what to do, currently we're paying Plusnet £27.99 a month with unlimited calls, with BT 910mbs and unlimited calls it comes to £75! and dropping £10 a month for 500mbs isn't worth the speed lose in my opinion, seems like the 500Mbs should have been at least £20 cheaper
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CarlT

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #12 on: May 24, 2020, 06:36:39 PM »

While I understand that, I'm not sure that counts as the average speed of Gigabit is going to be much much lower than 910Mbit because its so hard to actually test it and as FTTP is not an "up to" service provision, does that even apply anyway?

Not hard to test, can be done easily enough from the CPE.

FTTP is still prone to congestion just as everything else that isn't guaranteed is.
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #13 on: May 24, 2020, 09:10:44 PM »

Not hard to test, can be done easily enough from the CPE.

FTTP is still prone to congestion just as everything else that isn't guaranteed is.

But that's what's confusing, as these packages now have a minimum guarantee you'd think that would factor in more strongly.  But then we knew the OFCOM ruling was kinda flawed to begin with.

Depending on the uptake of the technology, the average will surely change?  I'd think the average today, based on actually being able to max it out, would pretty much be full speed.  Calling it 910Mbit just seems like a safety margin to me, not based on real-world testing.

Like I said, even your choice of NIC could drag that speed down as older Realtek Gigabit NICs would fall well short.

I'm already seeing plenty of complaints from people with Gigabit (or higher) on the Linus Tech Tips forum because they don't understand its not intended to be maxed from a single source.  I think Ofcom and ISPs worldwide are doing a great disservice to not have guaranteed and maximum speeds stated, as averages were most necessary due to limitations of DSL sync rates rather than the actual network capacity.
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j0hn

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Re: FTTP 910Mbs now available. (Questions)
« Reply #14 on: May 24, 2020, 10:01:05 PM »

Quote
But that's what's confusing, as these packages now have a minimum guarantee you'd think that would factor in more strongly. But then we knew the OFCOM ruling was kinda flawed to begin with.

The minimum guarantee is something additional BT have added themselves, which goes above and beyond even what OpenReach guarantee ISP's.
It's nothing to do with OFCOM.

Most other ISP's don't have such a minimum guarantee and for good reason.
It's considerably above what GPON can deliver if everyone on the PON took a 1Gb service.

The average is just that, an average. It isn't any kind of minimum guarantee.
It doesn't matter if some customers get less at times as long as the average is maintained.

Quote
Like I said, even your choice of NIC could drag that speed down as older Realtek Gigabit NICs would fall well short.

Customers hardware limitations (like poor NIC's) are irrelevant.
The ISP can test directly from the CPE.
They aren't guaranteeing any kind of throughput to devices.

Quote
I think Ofcom and ISPs worldwide are doing a great disservice to not have guaranteed and maximum speeds stated, as averages were most necessary due to limitations of DSL sync rates rather than the actual network capacity.

You can't expect high throughput guarantees on a residential service.
Look at the pricing of a 100Mb leased line with 1Gb burst.
It's considerably more than these 1Gb residential packages cost.

Some will always complain asking why the minimum guarantees are so low with the usual "I thought full fibre meant full speed all the time" complaints.
Others will complain that they can't ever reach the headline rate, usually due to wireless or hardware limitations.

The vast majority of the internet can't even fill a 1Gb line.
Even when an ISP has enough bandwidth available on their network there will always be someone there to complain about something.

There's no easy fix for advertising these residential packages that will satisfy everyone.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2020, 10:04:22 PM by j0hn »
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