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Author Topic: 4K question?  (Read 3516 times)

bob.gas

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4K question?
« on: January 07, 2020, 03:16:49 PM »

Sorry if posted in the wrong forum.  :blush:

What speed's are acceptable to stream 4K to TV's?
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dee.jay

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2020, 04:28:39 PM »

Where are you streaming the 4K from?
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Samad

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2020, 04:30:23 PM »

Sorry if posted in the wrong forum.  :blush:

What speed's are acceptable to stream 4K to TV's?

To stream in 4K Ultra HD with HDR, Netflix recommends you have a consistent minimum download speed of at least 25 megabits per second
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bob.gas

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2020, 05:33:41 PM »

Where are you streaming the 4K from?

I haven't yet.
I have Netflix, but have to upgrade the price for 4K I think. Which I haven't done yet.
I was just wondering  :)
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bob.gas

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2020, 05:36:48 PM »

To stream in 4K Ultra HD with HDR, Netflix recommends you have a consistent minimum download speed of at least 25 megabits per second

Thanks.
Yes, I have 75Mbs so OK there i guess.
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displaced

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2020, 12:46:33 AM »

Youíve actually got a fair bit more headway - Netflix say 25Mbit, but their streams actually top out at about 16Mbit/sec for 4K + HDR (or Dolby Vision + Atmos)

Amazon Prime is similar, perhaps peaking a little higher.

The highest bitrate service Iíve seen is Apple TV+.  That runs at about 30Mbit/sec (although Iíve seen it hit about 40Mbit/sec on high-action/detail scenes).  Again, thatís 4K with Dolby Vision and Dolby Atmos.

(source: bandwidth monitoring via my pfSense router whilst watching each service on an Apple TV 4K)
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2020, 04:33:20 AM »

I'm not entirely convinced you can measure peaks that way, although obviously peaks are kinda unimportant if its only for a few seconds then drops back down, as buffering will smooth it out anyway without any interruption.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2020, 08:53:22 AM »

I donít have 4k on my Apple TV but even at HD, subjectively, picture quality on Apple TV+ is noticeably very good indeed and Iíd say better than Netflix.  There does seem to be a lot of chatter on the web, supporting the assertion that they use better bitrates, and citing measurements similar to Displacedís observations.

https://bgr.com/2019/11/05/apple-tv-plus-streaming-video-quality/

My connection is only ~25Mbps  and holds up fine but who knows, Apple TV+ might be stretching it, even though I donít get 4K.   Picture I repeat does look noticeable better than other streams.  Unfortunately of course, thatís more than can be said about some of the acting. :D

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bob.gas

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2020, 10:50:46 AM »

Youíve actually got a fair bit more headway - Netflix say 25Mbit, but their streams actually top out at about 16Mbit/sec for 4K + HDR (or Dolby Vision + Atmos)

Amazon Prime is similar, perhaps peaking a little higher.

The highest bitrate service Iíve seen is Apple TV+.  That runs at about 30Mbit/sec (although Iíve seen it hit about 40Mbit/sec on high-action/detail scenes).  Again, thatís 4K with Dolby Vision and Dolby Atmos.

(source: bandwidth monitoring via my pfSense router whilst watching each service on an Apple TV 4K)

I have the LG OLED 55" B9,
Don't have Apple TV, but have Netflix and Prime. So far no problems with viewing any of them, including free Sat TV stations.
So yes, I guess my speed if up to the job. :fingers:

Thanks for the reply's guys
« Last Edit: January 09, 2020, 11:56:03 AM by roseway »
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bob.gas

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2020, 10:52:50 AM »

Erm, why is my post within the quoted blue square?
I think I did this before also. :blush:
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Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes

roseway

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2020, 11:58:00 AM »

I've corrected it for you. After hitting the Quote button you should add your reply after the final quote
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  Eric

bob.gas

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2020, 01:03:55 PM »

Thank you for that Eric.
unfortunately, you haven't corrected ALL of my post  ;)
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2020, 01:52:53 PM »

I donít have 4k on my Apple TV but even at HD, subjectively, picture quality on Apple TV+ is noticeably very good indeed and Iíd say better than Netflix.  There does seem to be a lot of chatter on the web, supporting the assertion that they use better bitrates, and citing measurements similar to Displacedís observations.

https://bgr.com/2019/11/05/apple-tv-plus-streaming-video-quality/

My connection is only ~25Mbps  and holds up fine but who knows, Apple TV+ might be stretching it, even though I donít get 4K.   Picture I repeat does look noticeable better than other streams.  Unfortunately of course, thatís more than can be said about some of the acting. :D

AFAIK Netflix always have about 4 or so bitrates for any given resolution, thus you can stream 4K below their recommendation but it will be even more heavily compressed.

Anothing thing about Netflix is no two shows/movies or even episodes will be identical.  They have a quality target but will happily use a lower bitrate if they can get away with it, its kinda sad really as they could do better quality but choose not to.  I guess it makes sense to try to keep quality consistent so people don't complain.
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bob.gas

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2020, 02:10:07 PM »

I read somewhere a while ago that sky reduced the quality of SD in order to make HD look better.
I guess they're all at it now. ::)
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: 4K question?
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2020, 05:41:37 AM »

I read somewhere a while ago that sky reduced the quality of SD in order to make HD look better.
I guess they're all at it now. ::)

That's a joke, as only a minority of channels were SD to begin with.  Same with HD, they often halve the width and let the box stretch it back out again, and that when I last checked probably 10 years ago now.  Seems this is the current way to check.

I'd be willing to bet some HD channels are closer to SD.  It does make streaming way more appealing though, as they actually use correct resolutions so look vastly superior to most Sky channels.  Plus there's the fact Sky use MPEG2 for SD, MPEG4 for HD vs streaming that can use far more efficient modern codecs and progressive scan, native frame-rates rather than interlaced PAL.

By far the biggest put off for me is I can't stand PAL speed up which is largely unavoidable on broadcast TV.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2020, 05:44:40 AM by Alex Atkin UK »
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