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Author Topic: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(  (Read 2600 times)

kitz

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Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« on: December 18, 2019, 12:03:48 AM »

I have a problem with my beloved VMG8324 :'(
Things have been a bit strange over the past week or so and although I think I've found out why, I don't think there is a solution which means that I will have to look at getting another router:( :( :(

Although the 'oddness' which I couldn't quite put my finger on has likely been going on for a bit longer, I just thought perhaps it was me being silly or in respect of the porch light not always coming on it was because the rocker on the wall switch was a bit temperamental.

Things finally started to come to a head a couple of days ago when I got a Blink system.  I thought the camera was faulty and had spent ages on the Blink site seeing if I'd done something wrong..  or blaming the home system as being crappy.  A few times when the front door detected motion, my Zyxel rebooted itself, so I temp turned off motion detection until I had chance to look further.  I uninstalled the camera and then the Home system started playing up saying no internet connection.   Messed around updated the firmware, deleted the app and started again.   Yay it worked brilliantly inside.   Col fixed the cameras to the wall externally this morning and all was fine until I got a delivery this evening and I tried to view who was at the door and puff the whole system went down.   So there's me cursing the Blink but didn't have time to look at it as I had to nip out.

Came in this evening, walked through the door asking Alexa to turn on the porch light and she kindly told me "Porch Light isn't responding".  Pffft I got someone to replace that wonky switch for me at the weekend so can't blame that any more.   

Went into the study and my Show is displaying "No Internet" on the screen.   But my Echo and Dot are both up and working fine.   Checks the Show - goes into DHCP settings and no IP addresses allocated.   
Picks up my mobile and starts to double check my Amazon account settings and purely by chance noticed the little 4G notification flashing away merrily - Hang on a mo.. I should be on wifi. Penny drops - Damnit that may partially explain why for the first time ever I went over my data allowance 2 weeks ago and will be billed an extra £6.50 this month.

Virtual Mars bar to who can guess what the problem is.
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kitz

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2019, 12:41:41 AM »

I will have to sit down and actually count how many wifi devices I have, because at this moment I really don't have a clue.

Bearing in mind I have a Hive system which aside from the boiler and thermostat also controls a fair amount of lights.   For example although study lights is grouped it consists of 3 lightbulbs all using their own separate connection with their own MAC addresses
I also have the Echo devices, firesticks, kindle, 2 smart TVs and tablet and about 5 smart plugs.

The killer may have been the smart extension lead I bought on Cyber Monday.  I've just found out that has 5 connections - One for the extension lead as a group and 4 for each individual switch.  It may just be on one MAC address, but I can't check as the Zyxel GUI wont tell me and packs in displaying anything more than about 10 devices. 
 
On reflection and looking back now, it would have been at around the day I plugged that in when some of the other items started becoming unresponsive.  I'd not really thought about it earlier as I'd had another bad fall a few weeks ago but I was far too preoccupied to even ponder on anything technical - and hence why it took me until this week to get around to putting the Blink system into action.


...  and just in case anyone hasn't guessed,  the reason why I need a new router is this maximum limit of 32 connections.  :(

It won't let me change it to anything more than 32 and that will be why not all devices can be online at the same time.  The Zyxel just won't allocate IP addresses to them all.  The Blink cams are inactive until it detects motion  (unless I ask it to stream view) which is why it will always be back of the queue and wont work when I have the lights and xmas decos on as those have taken up all the IP addresses first.   

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ETA
According to my Alexa app she can control 29 devices. So by the time you add in the smart tvs, a tab and any other mobile devices then I am in excess of the 32 limit.     
« Last Edit: December 18, 2019, 01:13:59 AM by kitz »
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dee.jay

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2019, 08:06:17 AM »

So what exactly is the limit, number of devices? 32 is a pretty pathetic number!

Is it a limit on DHCP leases? I'd just get a Raspberry Pi and install dnsmasq or something on it..?
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d2d4j

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2019, 09:16:05 AM »

Hi

Sorry kitz, I am a little confused if you mean your dsl provider is restricting to 32 connections or your 8324

If 8324, it maybe the session limit as apposed to max connections

If you goto networking settings, nat, session and delete the session limit (take a note of the figure first) save and restart router

Does this resolve your issue

Apologies if I am wrong

Many thanks

John
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kitz

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2019, 09:45:43 AM »

I had a fairly quick play last night and I can't seem to get more than about 20 devices able to connect at the same time.   
The router just stops allocating IP addresses and IP allocation doesn't seem to go above  xx.19 when looking at the addresses in arp.     

By rebooting the router I was finally able to get an IP for my mobile phone and the Show.. and the camera worked again.   However once other devices started asking for an IP the blink cam stopped working.   The Blink designed deliberately to snooze and only wakes upon motion detection in range....  so it is going to struggle especially at night when I have the lights in use.    It worked fine until dusk last night, which is when some of the other devices are timed to come on.

According to the settings in wireless network the max limit is 32 but I think its not even allocating that many and some devices will only become available when another device is unplugged or switched off.   As you say 32 is in itself a pathetic number if you have smart home equipment and can soon easily be exceeded. 
I found a thread on the Plusnet forums about their hub zero which wont allow more than 12 devices to connect at the same time and they were having to send out hubones for people with smart home devices.  Bob said something about the router was hard coded to not allow more than 16 connections at the same time and it wasn't anything to do with DHCP lease. 

I shall have to do some more accurate testing before I can draw a definite figure but right now its looking like its actually less than 32.
I'm also wondering what would happen if I assigned static IPs to each device.
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kitz

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2019, 09:50:14 AM »

Quote
Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.

>>> I am a little confused if you mean your dsl provider is restricting to 32 connections or your 8324

Our posts crossed - its the VMG8324 which wont give out any more IP addresses.   
If I reboot the router to clear everything, the IPs are allocated on first come first served basis.   Highest I could see allocated was x.19 before it stopped issuing any more.
That 19 includes 2 ethernet connected devices and also bearing in mind it is using x.1


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« Last Edit: December 18, 2019, 09:53:46 AM by kitz »
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d2d4j

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2019, 10:03:59 AM »

Hi kitz

Many thanks and I understand now sorry

I would think then it is the router perhaps that cannot handle more connections due to hardware and of course, when the router was new, there will not have been the same demand for IoT

I would think static assigned ip addresses would not work but would be a good test

I know you prefer all in one due to space/tidiness but a quick resolution would be to use a WAP and have devices use the wap (turn off dhcp on router) and let the wap use just 1 IP address but you would have to put wap on different subnet to router and make sure wap was able to handle more connected devices

We use drayteks and do not have this issue sorry

Many thanks

John
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CarlT

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2019, 10:16:08 AM »

Is it a limit on DHCP leases? I'd just get a Raspberry Pi and install dnsmasq or something on it..?

Pi + Pi-Hole = win in this case I reckon. No need to set this all up manually, let someone else do the work.

https://pi-hole.net/
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tubaman

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2019, 11:18:14 AM »

Kitz,

As I know you really like the 8324 I'm wondering if an 8924, which is the same thing but with 5GHz wifi added, would alleviate the issue. They are available cheaply from that well known auction site. In theory it should double the number of available connections if you split the devices between the 2.4 and 5GHz bands.
I say 'in theory' as it seems another limit may be in play if you can't get your 8324 to issue more than 19 concurrent IP addresses. :no:

 :)
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kitz

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2019, 02:39:07 PM »

Quote
I'm wondering if an 8924,

Thanks for the suggestion  :flower: I do have an 8924 in my cupboard which I've not yet gotten around to removing the ISP f/w and installing the standard Zyxel fw   
My initial thought were that as both use the same f/w that I would come across the same issue.   I could see at least 3 devices showing wireless n.   The devices which likely could use the 5GHz band will be my mobile devices such as phone and tab which are those I tend to use in summer in the garden, so I'd prefer to leave both options open for those.

Ideally I need to make a list of all the devices and tie them up with their corresponding MAC addresses.    I've been slowly accumulating smart home devices over the past 3 years and just letting them plug and play so to speak and it is surprising how many of them I now have. 

Quote
Pi + Pi-Hole = win in this case I reckon. No need to set this all up manually, let someone else do the work.

Thank you..  I think it may be the way forward then.   Note I highlighted router in my post as opposed to modem as I'm aware I could still let the Zyxel manage the dslside.

However this will have to wait until at least after xmas for 2 reasons
1-  As you know I had yet another fall a few weeks ago which knocked me a bit out of action for a while and I'm now finding myself totally unprepared for xmas despite me supposedly hosting xmas day dinner for family.., so I have what seems like a million and one things to do..  and then from boxing day my bro is doing the hosting and we're going over there to stay for a few days to enjoy some time with the girls.  I think this year will be the last that the youngest still (half) believes in Santa.  Being out of action for a while has left me snowed under with site stuff and there's some coding I really need to do when I get a clear head day and I've still to read  580 site emails, 91 personal and bin those that are in the junk folder.  The past few weeks just seem to have been a blur of hospital/docs/physio/tests/clinics/more tests/pain -v-morphine haze..  and a growing suspicion as the symptoms progress & materialise that it may be something else*  I've got an appt which came through this week to see the consultant in Feb.
2- I don't have a Pi and I would be a total n00b.    It wont be until after the New Year that I could begin to think about buying new kit and setting it up.   I shall probably require heavily on advice in here from you guys who already have one.    Brain fog is a bitch.  I know things but struggle to communicate it or put it into action - add it with the fact my feet are constantly numb and my hands are either in pain or numb its no wonder I get frustrated at myself for how long it takes me to do things.



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kitz

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2019, 03:14:08 PM »

Grrrrr   :comp:

Just had a delivery...   and as the camera covering the drive and front door must have tried to activate I suddenly heard both the Show and one of my echo dots chime up with "This device is having difficulty connecting to the Internet".

Presumably this will be when the blinkcam detected movement on my drive and asked for an IP, then it must have knocked the other 2 out of action.
I can see that the Blink unit (the control hub) managed to get one of them.
Annoyingly, not even everything is even switched on yet.   eg the firesticks and smart tvs are off and I'm not using my Kindle or galaxy tab. 

I'd given 'plug 2' a static IP as the router is plugged into that and I sometimes access that remotely.
Look below there's hardly anything switched on atm...  yet still the Zyxel wont allocate an IP address to my Show.
Come 4pm and when it gets dark then more things will be wanting to be switched on.


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ETA

I've now only got 5 devices connected and it still wont allocate an IP to the Show despite me rebooting it.   Looks like I may have to reboot the router.   I've tried disabling and re-enabling wireless but that didn't work.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2019, 03:58:02 PM by kitz »
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2019, 05:36:35 PM »

Is it only wireless devices having this problem?

It would be odd to have DHCP limit how many addresses it will give out so low, but WiFi only allowing 20 clients is not at all unusual for consumer hardware from what I've read.  I've seen it explained a few times as being the reason why they upgraded to Ubiquiti APs over consumer hardware.

If you can split the clients between 5Ghz and 2.4Ghz manually, you might perhaps be able to get 20 clients on each.  I have my LIFX bulbs for example on a completely different AP.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2019, 06:14:40 PM »

Maybe completely irrelevant, as this thread’s not about Billion.   Nevertheless, I’ve been looking at how Billion (7800 dxl) configure these limits...

Each SSID seems to have a configurable limit of ‘Max Clients’, that can be set 1-32.

I have two SSIDs, one private and the other for guests.   Each SSID is configured to 32 so it does allow me to configure more clients by adding another SSID, 64 in total.    Unfortunately I don’t have that many WiFi devices, so don’t know how many would actually work.

More interestingly In Advanced settings there is another parameter, ‘Global Max Clients’, ranging 1-128.    Not sure what effect of that is, mine is currently set at 32 which I guess was the default.

As stated, I know the VMG’s not a Billion, above just thrown in for sake of inspiration... :)
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broadstairs

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2019, 09:41:28 PM »

Kitz I've just been looking at my VMG3925 which I just put back on and it shows max wifi clients as 32 for each 2.4 and 5 ghz, in theory 64 split across both. Now I've looked at the manual for the 8924 (which I also have) and it shows max wifi clients as 16 for each. Now I have no idea whether you can increase this figure on the 8924 and I suspect the 8324 has the same as default. Now I am unable to test whether it makes a difference because I only use the 3925 for connecting my lan devices and I have BT Whole Home WiFi for the wireless stuff and it does not have any max client parameter, plus I probably dont have more than 16 wireless devices in total  ;) Should have mentioned the manuals dont say there is a range you can use or what happens if you go over the 16 or 32 values.

Stuart
« Last Edit: December 18, 2019, 09:43:48 PM by broadstairs »
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kitz

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Re: Looking at having to replace my VMG8324 :(
« Reply #14 on: December 19, 2019, 01:58:35 AM »

Well what a pile of p00.   I've spent the past few hours trying to assign static IPs to MAC addresses and once I got to 12 then the Zyxel refused to dish out any more IPs or reconnect any IPs if 12 devices were simultaneously using the network.    That included 3x ethernet connections  (PC, Hive and the NAS)

Even using dynamic it seems to remember the lease time and is loathe to let any new devices join the network until the lease has expired or the router is rebooted.
I have a heck of a lot more wifi devices than I originally thought.   I'd got to 12 and not even started on the echos/kindle/tab/printer nor any of smart plugs or switches except the one feeding the router itself.    Still not got a final total as I keep finding more things I've forgotten about which use wifi. 

I'd probably not noticed it too much before as I may not have been concurrently using more than 12 at the same time but the blink system needs at least 3 IPs simultaneously (The cam, the hub and the viewing device).     When it comes to the plugs and switches they only need a connection whilst the command is issued and don't constantly hog the IP address...  but that may explain why sometimes if I ask it to turn on a group, on the odd occasion then all the grouped devices may not come on.

@broadstairs and 7LM

Thanks - that 32 limit in the wifi settings is totally pointless being there.   That was the first thing I tried to change.   
The max of 16 is possibly more like it, but 12 is as far as it will go when I add them one by one.   I seem to recall reading something on the plusnet forum last night that the max for the hub zero was supposedly 16 but people were also reporting a max of 12.     Bob came back and said something about a hard coded limit and not anything actually to do with DHCP.   Found the thread again here.


This shows the current address resolution.   Even though some of the earlier IPs have dropped out of the arp table, the router is still refusing to connect anything on x.13
The GUI will allow me to assign more IPs past .13 but 'something' just refuses to allow them to connect.

Code: [Select]
C:\Users\kitz>arp -a

Interface: 192.168.1.2 --- 0x4
  Internet Address      Physical Address      Type
  192.168.1.1           10-7b-ef-6e-8a-ee     dynamic
  192.168.1.8           48-6d-bb-b6-eb-0f     dynamic
  192.168.1.9           a8-54-b2-30-57-76     dynamic
  192.168.1.10          c8-02-10-c4-8d-44     dynamic
  192.168.1.11          78-e1-03-0f-f4-24     dynamic
  192.168.1.12          fc-a6-67-5c-27-92     dynamic
  192.168.1.255         ff-ff-ff-ff-ff-ff     static
  224.0.0.22            01-00-5e-00-00-16     static
  224.0.0.251           01-00-5e-00-00-fb     static
  224.0.0.252           01-00-5e-00-00-fc     static
  226.178.217.5         01-00-5e-32-d9-05     static
  239.255.255.250       01-00-5e-7f-ff-fa     static
  255.255.255.255       ff-ff-ff-ff-ff-ff     static
« Last Edit: December 19, 2019, 02:36:27 AM by kitz »
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