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Author Topic: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all  (Read 5875 times)

gt94sss2

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General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« on: November 14, 2019, 10:10:46 PM »

I moved this to Chit Chat because it's become a general political discussion - roseway


Quote
Labour has promised to give every home and business in the UK free full-fibre broadband by 2030, if it wins the general election.

The party would nationalise part of BT and introduce a tax on tech giants to cover the £20bn cost.

Broadband packages in the UK cost households an average of around £30, according to a report by broadband comparison site Cable - which people would no longer have to pay under Labour's scheme.

The plan includes nationalising parts of BT - namely its digital network arm Openreach - to create a UK-wide network owned by the government.

A Labour government would compensate shareholders by issuing government bonds.

A new entity called British Broadband would then run the network, with maintenance - estimated to cost £230m a year - to be covered by the new tax on companies such as Apple and Google.
"We think they should pay their way and other countries are following suit," said Mr McDonnell.
Labour has not yet completed the final details of how the internet giant tax would work saying it would be based 'percentage wise'' on the global profits and UK sales, raising potentially as much as £6bn.
Mr McDonnell said that if other broadband providers did not want to give access to the new entity, British Broadband, then they would also be taken into public ownership.

"Making sure [fibre broadband] free to people [means] they can participate in the way that they haven't in the past both economically and socially," he added.

Full article/ video at https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50427369

Desperately trying not to make any comment that might be seen as political... !

« Last Edit: November 15, 2019, 06:24:49 PM by roseway »
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2019, 10:17:47 PM »

 :lol:
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licquorice

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2019, 10:31:02 PM »

I guess they will be offering free electricity, gas and water next!!!
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2019, 03:48:02 AM »

This is not as crazy as it sounds.  In our modern online world, fibre is awfully similar to roads or pavements and could very well be paid for differently if re-nationalised.

I am of course dubious of how it would work, as surely they wouldn't just give everyone Gigabit and call it a day.  But to give everyone say a basic 20Mbit fibre connection and let you pay for a higher bandwidth tier package, would seem sensible.
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Chrysalis

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2019, 05:00:31 AM »

Corbyn had good idea's early in his reign but he is slowly losing the plot.

There is things that are for the good of the people but this idea isn't it.

People cannot afford food is common, cannot afford rent is common, cannot afford broadband? not such a big deal.  If you cannot afford fixed price broadband you can still probably order food shopping online, do internet banking, those type of things on PAYG broadband services.  Not to mention nationalising BT is not going to be a vote winner, all this policy does is put ammo into those who claim he is a left wing loony who wants to go hard core.

Alex, I am not against government funded rollout, but they don't need to nationalise BT to do that, and I think the idea of giving everyone free broadband is completely stupid.   A clear election bribe as can be.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2019, 05:08:11 AM by Chrysalis »
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Ronski

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2019, 06:17:39 AM »

It's ludicrous, and just takes in the gullible.

If labour win our country won't be able to afford anything because we would have borrowed too much for stuff we simply can't afford and shouldn't be spending money on, and therefore all the country's income is used to service the debt.

My brother does this, and then wonders why he's broke every month.
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dee.jay

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2019, 06:39:08 AM »

At the risk of bringing more politics to this forum (there's not a lot of it) - how anyone can vote Labour is honestly beyond me. They are promising all the freebies in the world. People don't realise they are going to be taxed on it, and they'll be borrowing left right and centre to pay for it all. National debt will sky rocket.
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Ronski

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2019, 07:45:59 AM »

How much tax does BT and the other ISPs that will close pay, how many jobs will be lost?

What about all the pension funds and peoples investments in companies that are nationalised, who's going to get compensated and wheres the money going to come from?

It will get to the point where it's not worth me doing my job, slowly the gap between the minimum wage and what I'm paid is being eroded, therefore I might as well do an easier less stressful job, or not work at all and live the dream on all the freebies to come.
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re0

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2019, 08:08:06 AM »

I am not the most knowledgeable on government finances, but I can see wrong with this. The money must come from somewhere, and connectivity is actually quite competitive and affordable as it is. The idea of free for everyone is just madness.

I know this is not the "free" paradise that Labour would want it to be, but BT - a private company - already offers reduced cost broadband and telephone service known as "BT Basic" (average 10 Mbps) for £9.95 a month with free install for people on certain low income Government benefits; only thing one must pay upfront is postage fees for the router. Granted, it's only 15GB monthly usage, but that is cheap enough to tie someone over until they have earnings while allowing them to keep in touch with people and do the little everyday thing.

Anyway, I wonder if Diane Abbott is responsible for the maths here.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2019, 08:37:34 AM »

How long before somebody promises that everybody will be able to get above average download speeds?
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re0

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2019, 08:46:51 AM »

How long before somebody promises that everybody will be able to get above average download speeds?
:graduate:
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Ronski

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2019, 08:54:52 AM »

The ISP Review article says it all, if you read it properly and between the lines.

Quote
Meanwhile the idea of nationalising Openreach (BT) under public ownership is a much more complicated issue (i.e. its impact upon pensions, the question of who takes on BT’s massive debt pile (the public?), shareholders, competition etc.) and one that is likely to result in plenty of legal challenges (this could hamper the fibre rollout until settled). Not to mention a lengthy debate over whether that by itself would result in a better market.

Quote
.   At this stage there isn’t a lot of detail but the logical conclusion of this would be the near total destruction of the current competitive market, including all ISPs on Openreach’s network and alternative networks – both large and small alike. Since after all, what operator could reasonably ever be expected to compete against a completely free full fibre rival. Not to mention the huge on-going costs of upkeep, support, capacity supplies and maintenance.

Bottom line is it's just another bribe by the Corbyn machine to gain votes, and they'll worry about the consequences later.
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dee.jay

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2019, 08:59:26 AM »

Quote from: Ronski
Bottom line is it's just another bribe by the Corbyn machine to gain votes, and they'll worry about the consequences later.

Absolutely - praying that everyone simply doesn't fall for it.
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Chrysalis

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2019, 09:21:38 AM »

Its shocking how far he's fallen.

In January he probably would have got in power from an election, and the policies in place were less extreme and things the country needed.

Now he has a strange EU stance, and coming out with nonsense like this. :(

Given labour's current polling there isnt a chance this will be enacted as they miles away from the tories polling right now.
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gt94sss2

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Re: General election 2019: Labour pledges free broadband for all
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2019, 09:50:06 AM »

From the Guardian

Quote
Rival TalkTalk stalls sale of fibre arm after Labour announces BT plans
BT rival TalkTalk is holding off on a decision to sell its own infrastructure arm to see how this whole Labour plan pans out.

TalkTalk chief executive Tristia Harrison told Reuters:

Our discussions are very advanced, and yes, the news overnight of course is making everybody in the sector pause and consider.

We were really close, really close, but I think something of this sort that is in the news, obviously everybody is pausing, considering, digesting and working out what it means.

Sky News, which first reported the strategic delay, said CityFibre Holdings nearly signed a deal to acquire TalkTalk’s FibreNation on Thursday before Labour’s pledge was announced.



Quote
Matthew Howett, Founder & Principal Analyst at Assembly comments:

This is a spectacularly bad take by the Labour Party. The almost cut throat competition between broadband rivals has meant faster speeds, improved coverage and lower prices for consumers up and down the country.

The current government, and independent regulator Ofcom, have spent the last three years incentivising alternative operators to BT to deploy faster fibre technologies. Companies such as Virgin, CityFibre and others have committed billions to rival Openreach. Those plans risk being shelved overnight.

Only one other country in the world to come close to going down this route, and for a good reason – it’s hard, expensive and fraught with difficulty. Australia’s NBN is years late, massively over budget and offering speeds and technology a fraction of the original political intention.
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