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[sevenlayermuddle]

Just wondering, if anyone has expert knowledge..... when  BT/OR enhance an existing underground line with FTTP, are they generally able to use the existing underground cable ducts?   Or might they also have to get the shovels out, and start digging?

This is of interest to me as I have several hundred feet of underground BT cables through my property.   These cables serve not only my own premises, they progress onwards to three or four other properties, there’s a couple of underground boxes to join things up.   There is a wayleave in place that probably entitles them to dig it all up if they need to.

My lawn is no bowling green, far from it, it’s little more than a mossy field, but it would be hassle if they had to dig it up.   The cables also pass under a decent looking tarmac driveway, it’s be a shame if the tarmac was left with  ‘roadworks scars’.

[shambly]

BT's DSL checker will give you a clue.

Our line was buried without ducting so it was clear that a new duct was going to have to be dug.
Even if you have an existing duct, they will need to prove that the duct is clear before you know for sure that they won't need to dig....

Our line now says (from below the table in DSL checker results)

Code: [Select]

Our records show the following FTTP network service information for these premises:- Single Dwelling Unit Residential UG Proven Clear.

ONT exists with active service. No spare ports are available. A new ONT may be ordered.

UG = Underground, Proven Clear = they know the duct is clear

In our case Openreach employees (not contractors) dug across our lawn and even on the same day as they dug you would have been hard pressed to know they had ever dug a trench (true for neighbouring properties too). I was impressed (rare!).

Simon

[johnson]

The new build I mentioned in the other thread near me required several bouts of road works with the stated reason "clearing ducts". They dug holes roughly every hundred meters in the road running up to it and had water pumps and spooling dodads there for a few days. I guess these were fairly substantial ducts as the houses further on served by them are numerous.

[Ronski]

I don't have expert knowledge, but it's pretty clear from following the FTTPod thread on TBB forums and my extensive monitoring of the roadworks.org when they installed the FTTC cabs around here that where ever possible they used existing ducts.

Only time they will need to dig is if the ducts are blocked and they are unable to clear them, or they are full to capacity. When they were doing the FTTC cab installs around here I would often see roadworks listed to clear or replace blocked ducts.

[roseway]

When FTTC was installed here, the existing POTS cable was in ducts all the way (about 3 km), and they tried to pull the fibre cable through, but it was blocked in three places, so they had to dig several holes to clear the blockages (and then one more to repair the POTS cable which they had damaged in pulling the fibre cable through).

[sevenlayermuddle]

Sounds like ‘wait and see’, then.   Digging the odd hole here and there wouldn’t worry me, if that were as bad as it gets, but it would be nice to avoid major trench work, with heavy equipment.    Anyway, no point worrying about it, pretty sure they have every right to re-excavate the entire trench if needs be, and I must allow them and their vehicles to have access.   

There is certainly no sign that it is imminent, despite various vote-grabbing declarations of ‘FTTP for everybody, by Tuesday” or similar, from various MPs. 

[psychopomp1]

When I had FTTPoD installed a couple of years ago, Openreach used existing ducts everywhere to lay the fibre - I didn't see any digging at all. Having my front lawn dug up was my biggest worry but it didn't happen. Openreach will only bypass their existing ducts if they're totally full or they have major blockages which can't be cleared. The test rodding stage is where they check for duct blockages.

[sevenlayermuddle]

Sounds like it’s an interesting thing to witness. 

[niemand]

Just wondering, if anyone has expert knowledge..... when  BT/OR enhance an existing underground line with FTTP, are they generally able to use the existing underground cable ducts?   Or might they also have to get the shovels out, and start digging?

So - if you have a look at a Fibre First area - try Tingley, Wakefield on https://www.roadworks.org - you'll see various duct unblocking.

The do it where they can. They dig new duct or build poles to go around directly buried cable and/or ducts collapsed or full.

Rodding isn't that interesting. They shove a flexible rod into the duct from an inspection pit and keep screwing extensions on to it until they get to the next one or an obstacle.

[niemand]

Actually here's a couple of example roadworks.

Duct overlay.

Duct clearance.

These are for the Morley, Leeds Fibre First area.

[sevenlayermuddle]

Just to clarify, I wasn’t referring to roadworks, but to underground wires within my gardens.   These serve my own property, as well as neighbours.

I’m coming to the conclusion that if FTTP ever comes our way (I still seriously think it will not ever happen) there is every probability they will be able to simply reuse the existing ducts.   There sounds to be a small possibility they may need to dig a few holes, I can live with that.

I can even live with the much less likely risk that major excavations are needed though obviously, I’d hope to avoid that.    At the extreme of installing new poles around my garden to replace existing underground cables, I’d probably react badly.   But I’m not going to worry about it unless/until it is threatened.

 

[niemand]

Yes. If you look at the Morley area as a whole almost all the work is unblocking ducts. Very few overlays. You should be fine - worst case some small digs to repair blocked / collapsed duct.

[Black Sheep]

I think the answer has been provided by quite a few members above, in that existing ducts will be the first choice to provide sub-duct in which to place the fibre.

Just for info though, as Carl points out there is also 'overlay' when the ducts are full. However, there is also a technology used called 'overblow' that would be used before 'overlay'.
Basically, if there is another sub-duct in place within the original ducts containing a fibre cable, we will blow another fibre down it.

Something that came into being at the back end of 2012 due to spiralling costs for civils. 

[renluop]

Sorry in advance for a silly and a may be asked before question.
What will be procedure in D.I.G. locations?

[Black Sheep]

Something called 'Speed tubing' will be deployed .... ie: a multi-tube affair that will 'drop off' a tube outside each premises passed to a tobi box.