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Author Topic: UPS (again, groan :-( )  (Read 647 times)

Weaver

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UPS (again, groan :-( )
« on: April 24, 2019, 09:07:39 PM »

 ??? :-[  Yes, UPS again. [ I have posted too many times about UPSs in the past. Poor health, poverty and plain indecision has meant that I have never actually got around to the business of marking a decision and purchasing one, especially not a big fat one ]

Itís my birthday in a few days, and my beloved asked me what I wanted. Iím thinking that I really need to get on with it and buy a chunky very cheap UPS.

* So, recommendations - Whatís the best value for money ultra-cheap UPS that can be had just now?

Itís to power four DSL modems, a router (FB2700 ultra low power) and an HP 24-port switch. WAPs now have their own UPSs, those DC Li-Ion wall-brick UPS units mentioned in earlier threads. The UPSís output needs to be an IEC 60320/IEC 320 interconnection socket type F iirc and I have a type E (again, iirc) interconnector plug to go into it from a 4-way. Existing oneís output socket looks like that in the image of the back of a UPS shown in the Wikipedia article anyway.
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Weaver

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2019, 05:06:15 PM »

What UPS are you using?
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chenks

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2019, 03:01:13 PM »

ummm , are you repling to yourself?
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Weaver

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2019, 06:13:23 PM »

@chenks no. I should perhaps have clarified by saying Ďall of youí rather than just Ďyouí as modern English no longer has distinctive forms for these pronouns or the person marking on the verb in this situation.
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Weaver

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2019, 06:26:03 PM »

I am looking at this model because it is cheap as chips, any opinions? Any good?

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/CyberPower-UT650EI-650VA-Interactive-Connections/dp/B073YKWZS7
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burakkucat

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2019, 07:24:06 PM »

I really don't know.  :no:

The question I would ask is whether it would support the required load for the required mains outage time. Have you quantified those two requirements, load and runtime?
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displaced

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2019, 09:00:42 PM »

Been very happy with my APC Back-UPS CS-650, which is available for ~£100.

It has a couple of battery-backed AC outputs and one non-protected output. All are female IEC Ďkettleí sockets (type F, as you mention).

Itís sat in the cupboard under the stairs where it gets some good ventilation from a nearby air-brick.  Iíve got a 10-way 13A socket extension running from the un-protected socket for non-critical stuff like battery chargers, document scanner, shredder and cordless hoover.

On the protected side, I have an HP Microserver, HG612, hard-drive box (8x WD RED drives), a pfSense router (Intel NUC thing), Raspberry Pi and a Netgear 8-port switch.  Thatís via a 6-way extension wired with a trailing IEC type E plug.

All that shows as 30% load and itís reporting ~25 mins runtime at that load.  Plenty of time for the usual kind of cuts we get.

Iíve got it connected via USB to my pfSense box which is running the apcaccess daemon. My serverís apcaccess client connects to that over the LAN so the server can be cleanly shut down on battery-low events.

Works really well and has been tested several times lately as we had an underground cable develop a fault that blew fuses at the substation several times.

Plus, we have a borderline out-of-spec supply here. Our line voltage is usually in the region of 258V, often going above 260V.  Itís very reassuring to have all the protected stuff being fed a stable 230V!
« Last Edit: May 04, 2019, 09:04:29 PM by displaced »
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Vodafone Landline+FTTC: Huawei DSLAM, HG612 modem, pfSense router, Ubiquiti access points. GigE home LAN with Netgear ProSafe switches. Mac, FreeBSD and Win10.

Weaver

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2019, 01:38:45 AM »

@displaced many thanks for that that is extremely valuable.

I have two APC UPSs one is a back ups CS 550 or something but itís incredibly ancient, something like 2004 maybe. The other one is a flat type canít remember the model, lying on its back with 3 pin mains sockets, again an APC model.

But your runtimes are really valuable. That gives me a good idea of the order of magnitude of runtime I should be getting but donít. I only get a few minutes so I am assuming this is because the batteries are absolutely knackered because they are ancient. Is that reasonable?

Displacedís power consumption is roughly comparable to mine. I have a Firebrick router (extremely low), an HP switch, a ZyXEL small switch and four ZyXEL modems so not a million miles away.

Does anyone know how much energy a modem uses, even better a B10A?

I am not able to measure the current drain of my kit. Sorry folks.

One question, where do I see the storage in C (or Ah in non-strict-SI units)? I keep seeing figures of so many VA which I donít really care about as I am not interested in max current as the load will not be heavy.

The only reason I looked at that model is price. Am absolutely broke at the moment so my financial director will not approve it unless I get a very good deal.

The runtime is determined by how long it takes us, arthritic and poorly, to get the generator started and switch over. Assuming that everything is in readiness. But I shall have to replace the generator anyway because Janet cannot start it as she isnít strong enough to do the stupid stupid pull cord to start it. - why oh why didnít I get a pushbutton one (well itís because it was an emergency, after the 2005 hurricane.)
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displaced

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2019, 10:31:29 AM »

Glad the info helped!

From the sound of it, that BackUPS 550 of yours should be able to handle your described usage for a decent amount of time, if itís battery were healthy.

Looking at my apcaccess data again, I see it also tells me the unit has a max power output of 400W. So my current LOADPCT of 30% means my gearís using 120 watts.

If possible, can you get data from your existing UPSes? Thatíd be a good way of sizing a replacement.

Also, it might be worth investigating whether or not your BackUPS unit has a replaceable battery (I think most, of not all of the Ďtowerí APC units have replaceable batteries).  That may well be the most cost-effective route.

(all this UPS chat prompted me to get my Cacti monitoring system back up and running.  I was graphing the UPS stats so I could show UK Power Networks that our supply was consistently high and often > 230V+10%.  I think they mightíve sorted it recently since itís not gone above 250V overnight)
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Vodafone Landline+FTTC: Huawei DSLAM, HG612 modem, pfSense router, Ubiquiti access points. GigE home LAN with Netgear ProSafe switches. Mac, FreeBSD and Win10.

jelv

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2019, 12:31:56 PM »

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Weaver

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Re: UPS (again, groan :-( )
« Reply #10 on: May 05, 2019, 05:28:19 PM »

@jelv wow, that would be a lot cheaper alternative because one of those replacement batteries is only £18 (VAT), mind you hate to think what the postage is

<rant>Since it is one of these racist [what-ist? anti-Gaidheal] companies that has a surcharge on posting to IV* as if this were the 1950s, and in any case just use Royal Mail. (I seriously think we need legislation to make this discrimination illegal. Itís a constant nightmare hassle. No one surcharges for crossing the Humber Bridge, posting to Kent or to Cornwall.) anyway, I wouldnít be using them ever, on principle as well as practicalities of the cost. They just need to kick their racist delivery company into touch and have Royal Mail or anyone else as an alternative. The govt needs to put on a freight train to Kyle Station and to Mallaig station. Could do an extra car even, with extra engine if needed, and they could tack it on to the sleeper trains as well. Or have an extra train in the day, since there are so few. They could take tons of parcels for free that way and get lorries off the roads.<rant>

But I have no one to do the work of replacing it, so I am stuck wasting money. That one I linked to might be a larger capacity (runtime) than my old one, canít tell and canít remember the specs.
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