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Author Topic: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?  (Read 8040 times)

snadge

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Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« on: December 28, 2018, 04:33:33 PM »

I am looking to replace my NTE5 with a Filtered Faceplate and just wondering if there are some filters better than others? 

I recall someone saying (years ago) that the ADSLnation XTE designed filtered faceplate is an 'Active' type and these are not as good as 'Passive' types such as the Pressac VDSL Mk4 faceplate.. I dunno if this was true? I have read on Wikipedia that 'Active' types may be considered better?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DSL_filter#Components

can anyone shed some light on this?

thanks
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burakkucat

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2018, 04:54:12 PM »

The first question that you should answer is: Do you intend to use the circuit for telephony?

If your answer is "No", then do as Weaver and do not install a centralised splitter/filter. If your answer is "Yes", then use an Openreach branded NTE5/A and Mk 3 SSFP.

Don't use "historic" "ADSLnation" items. The company ceased to exist some years ago and old stock is still being sold-off. Those "XTE" devices were designed for ADSL2+ and not for the wider bandwidth of VDSL2.
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snadge

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2018, 06:10:35 PM »

The first question that you should answer is: Do you intend to use the circuit for telephony?

If your answer is "No", then do as Weaver and do not install a centralised splitter/filter. If your answer is "Yes", then use an Openreach branded NTE5/A and Mk 3 SSFP.

Don't use "historic" "ADSLnation" items. The company ceased to exist some years ago and old stock is still being sold-off. Those "XTE" devices were designed for ADSL2+ and not for the wider bandwidth of VDSL2.

run-it-direct sell ones that look the same as those XTE ones, call them VTE I think?

I do intend to use a phone, i dont use it but its nice to have in emergency
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j0hn

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2018, 07:51:10 PM »

I'd recommend an OpenReach MK3 SSFP if you have an NTE5A master socket.

If you have the newer rounded NTE5C them buy an OpenReach MK4 that fits the newer master sockets.

I don't recommend any of the other faceplates currently on run-it-direct.
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snadge

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2018, 08:53:49 PM »

I'd recommend an OpenReach MK3 SSFP if you have an NTE5A master socket.

If you have the newer rounded NTE5C them buy an OpenReach MK4 that fits the newer master sockets.

I don't recommend any of the other faceplates currently on run-it-direct.

he only sells the Mk4 with NTE5C or the XTE design, the rest are discontinued, i will just get one off ebay or that 5C at some point
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snadge

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2018, 10:14:21 PM »

I'd recommend an OpenReach MK3 SSFP if you have an NTE5A master socket.

If you have the newer rounded NTE5C them buy an OpenReach MK4 that fits the newer master sockets.

I don't recommend any of the other faceplates currently on run-it-direct.

if u dont use a filter.. does a modem have a high pass filter built in?
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burakkucat

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2018, 10:34:56 PM »

Every modem has a high-pass filter in its input stage.
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Edinburgh_lad

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2021, 11:13:42 PM »

The first question that you should answer is: Do you intend to use the circuit for telephony?

If your answer is "No", then do as Weaver and do not install a centralised splitter/filter. If your answer is "Yes", then use an Openreach branded NTE5/A and Mk 3 SSFP.

Don't use "historic" "ADSLnation" items. The company ceased to exist some years ago and old stock is still being sold-off. Those "XTE" devices were designed for ADSL2+ and not for the wider bandwidth of VDSL2.

I'm confused by your statement that ADSLNation is bad because VDSL2's wide bandwidth. Do you have any scientific evidence to back up your claims? I thought the role of a filter was to filter out telephony signal, rather than broadband signal. Really confused now.
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burakkucat

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2021, 12:00:43 AM »

The can be filters that either block or pass low frequencies, high frequencies or a band of frequencies. (In that one sentence I have covered six separate scenarios.)

A simple, rat's-tail, microfilter will just have a low-pass filter before the telephony port and nothing before the xDSL modem port. All modems (modem/routers) have a high-pass filter internally just before their analogue front-end.

Centralised filters (service specific face plates (SSFPs) in Openreach talk) will contain a combination of low-pass, high-pass and band-pass filters depending upon the service for which they have been optimised.

Those old ADSLnation centralised filters were designed for ADSL/ADSL2+ as that was only what existed "back then".
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2021, 01:20:17 AM »

Pretty sure mine was an ADSL Nation ADSL v1, was absolutely fine on VDSL until it eventually failed.
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Edinburgh_lad

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2021, 07:38:12 AM »

Pretty sure mine was an ADSL Nation ADSL v1, was absolutely fine on VDSL until it eventually failed.

Cheers. What were the 'symptoms' of your failedADSL nation filter? However, our line has intermittent interference and also a bad joint, which openreach are not fixing (I'm sorry to say but openreach are the worst company I've ever dealt with. There should be more competition on the market and should be allowed to go bust.).
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2021, 06:21:04 PM »

Cheers. What were the 'symptoms' of your failedADSL nation filter? However, our line has intermittent interference and also a bad joint, which openreach are not fixing (I'm sorry to say but openreach are the worst company I've ever dealt with. There should be more competition on the market and should be allowed to go bust.).

I can't remember exactly, I think it might have stopped getting sync at all.
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Edinburgh_lad

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2021, 01:26:03 PM »

The can be filters that either block or pass low frequencies, high frequencies or a band of frequencies. (In that one sentence I have covered six separate scenarios.)

A simple, rat's-tail, microfilter will just have a low-pass filter before the telephony port and nothing before the xDSL modem port. All modems (modem/routers) have a high-pass filter internally just before their analogue front-end.

Centralised filters (service specific face plates (SSFPs) in Openreach talk) will contain a combination of low-pass, high-pass and band-pass filters depending upon the service for which they have been optimised.

Those old ADSLnation centralised filters were designed for ADSL/ADSL2+ as that was only what existed "back then".

I'm confused about this. The consensus on this forum seems to be that a filter is there to separate voice to enable one to use voice services. As Weaver repeatedly said (and others repeated), there is no need for a filter if you're using broadband only. So, logically speaking, does it matter if it's MK3, 4 or ADSLNation? It shouldn't, unless you have some research to prove otherwise.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2021, 04:09:32 PM by Edinburgh_lad »
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tubaman

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #13 on: December 17, 2021, 08:17:34 PM »

The primary purpose of the filter is to block the xDSL frequencies from the voice side of the circuit. How efficiently this is done and how much loss there is to both the xDSL and voice signals depends on how well the filter is designed. Noting here that no filter is totally loss free.
As has been said there is no need for a filter if you are not using a voice service on the line and with no filter there will be no loss.
 :)
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RealAleMadrid

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Re: Best filters to use? (Active or Passive)..?
« Reply #14 on: December 17, 2021, 08:21:30 PM »

As I understand it there is no loss on the xDSL side as that is an unfiltered direct connection, it is only the phone side that is filtered.
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