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Author Topic: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.  (Read 1031 times)

cjlhessing

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Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« on: August 02, 2019, 10:15:56 PM »

HI guys, moved from BT to Sky (had them for 3 days, bad news I'm afraid even the openreach engineer said to change) and now going to GhostGB to try them out - having spoken to them on them on the phone i found them to be extremely knowledgeable, they even mentioned Kitz as a place to get info on lol.

So they do supply a TP Link vr400 modem/router but I'm looking at hopefully some better options.

I do like the idea of separate modem and router as there are no worries about messing up the line when a reboot is needed for a firmware update on the router side.

So - is the ZyXEL VMG8324-B10A still the best way to go or does the Vigor 130 still viable? (also saw a Technicolor DWA0120 aa possibility on broadbandbuyer)
It's a broadcom cabinet, he mentioned there are no ECI in the area and they're all on the way out regardless.

If anyone has any ideas, would appreciate the knowledge :)

Chris.
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burakkucat

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2019, 10:42:33 PM »

As you would prefer a two-box (at the minimum) solution and are connected via a Huawei equipped cabinet, thus line-card ports via a Broadcom chip-set, there is just one further variable to consider . . . Do you wish to have access to the line statistics? And make use of DSLstats?

If "yes, yes" is your reply, then I will confirm that a device from the ZyXEL stable would certainly be appropriate. (It might also be worthwhile obtaining a Huawei HG612, to keep as a reserve device.)

The Vigor 130 uses a Lantiq chip-set (and is not compatible with DSLstats). Some people do obtain good results with those DrayTek devices while others find that they are not as good as Broadcom chip-set based modems.
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cjlhessing

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2019, 10:55:25 PM »

Hello burakkucat, thanks for that reply! I do have a HG612 sitting spare in the cupboard for an emergency lol.
So with the Zyzel line, would the 8324-B10A still be the one to grab from ebay or is there a more recent and compatible one available?...if any come to mind i mean :)

Thanks again for the reply, glad to know I'm on the right path!
Chris.
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johnson

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2019, 11:03:33 PM »

So with the Zyzel line, would the 8324-B10A still be the one to grab from ebay or is there a more recent and compatible one available?...if any come to mind i mean :)

When scouring ebay an 8324-B10A or 8924-B10A or 1312-B10A are the ones to look for.

The latter can be strangely expensive, but if you watch the auction site long enough there are still cheap units to be had.
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RealAleMadrid

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2019, 11:04:04 PM »

I have used the HG612-3B modem for a number of years, with no problems. I also have Zyxel 8924 B-10A which is very similar to the 8324-B10A which will also work well. I don't believe any recent devices are significantly better.
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grahamb

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2019, 01:29:50 AM »

Currently, I'd recommend a ZyXEL VMG8924-B10A , a brand new one (was John Lewis branded but not any more) of which I purchased from that well-known auction site for 40 British pound notes. It's been up for 15 days straight without so much as a flicker. I've pasted stats below. The downstream FECs are particularly interesting (I think so anyway). Can anyone shed any light on why there should be that particular number? It seems weird to me, unless there's some sort of bug in the reporting.

Code: [Select]
xdslctl info --stats
xdslctl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 22783 Kbps, Downstream rate = 63041 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 63077 Kbps

Link Power State:       L0
Mode:                   VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile:          Profile 17a
TPS-TC:                 PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis:                U:ON /D:ON
Line Status:            No Defect
Training Status:        Showtime
                Down            Up
SNR (dB):        5.6             6.3
Attn(dB):        13.7            0.0
Pwr(dBm):        1.5             1.4

                        VDSL2 framing
                        Bearer 0
MSGc:           18              150
B:              239             236
M:              1               1
T:              21              5
R:              0               16
S:              0.1211          0.3771
L:              15856           5410
D:              1               1
I:              240             255
N:              240             255

                        Counters
                        Bearer 0
OHF:            688926730               1759909
OHFErr:         90436           4294
RS:             0               1896660
RSCorr:         0               55320
RSUnCorr:       0               0

                        Bearer 0
HEC:            162010          0
OCD:            17              0
LCD:            17              0
Total Cells:    1086621707              0
Data Cells:     610749753               0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

ES:             26504           3839
SES:            18              0
UAS:            995             995
AS:             1319403

                        Bearer 0
INP:            0.00            0.00
INPRein:        0.00            0.00
delay:          0               0
PER:            1.91            6.15
OR:             100.28          202.87
AgR:            63177.21        20203.27

Bitswap:        38152/38152             1936/1941

Total time = 15 days 6 hours 46 min 38 sec
FEC:            0               55320
CRC:            90436           4294
ES:             26504           3839
SES:            18              0
UAS:            995             995
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 15 minutes time = 1 min 38 sec
FEC:            0               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC:            0               24
CRC:            3               4
ES:             3               4
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 1 day time = 6 hours 46 min 38 sec
FEC:            0               3120
CRC:            387             44
ES:             220             42
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC:            0               3922
CRC:            1325            199
ES:             847             179
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Since Link time = 15 days 6 hours 30 min 2 sec
FEC:            0               55320
CRC:            90436           4294
ES:             26504           3839
SES:            18              0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
NTR: mipsCntAtNtr=0 ncoCntAtNtr=0
 >

PS I have no wish to hijack the thread - it might help the OP to make his mind up.  :)
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tubaman

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2019, 08:54:21 AM »

I can certainly recommend the Zyxel 8924 as a good stable device. Note that the 8924 has 5Ghz WiFi, which is not present on the 8324 or 1312.  There are usually plenty on eBay at sensible prices - I believe my one was 20.
You say that you ISP will be providing a TP-Link VR400 and that should be reasonable too as it is Broadcom based.  If I were you I'd give it a try before splashing-out on anything else.
 :)
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BT FTTC 80/20 Huawei Cab - Zyxel VMG8924-B10A

cjlhessing

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2019, 09:00:27 AM »

Currently, I'd recommend a ZyXEL VMG8924-B10A , a brand new one (was John Lewis branded but not any more) of which I purchased from that well-known auction site for 40 British pound notes. It's been up for 15 days straight without so much as a flicker. I've pasted stats below. The downstream FECs are particularly interesting (I think so anyway). Can anyone shed any light on why there should be that particular number? It seems weird to me, unless there's some sort of bug in the reporting.

Code: [Select]
xdslctl info --stats
xdslctl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 22783 Kbps, Downstream rate = 63041 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 63077 Kbps

Link Power State:       L0
Mode:                   VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile:          Profile 17a
TPS-TC:                 PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis:                U:ON /D:ON
Line Status:            No Defect
Training Status:        Showtime
                Down            Up
SNR (dB):        5.6             6.3
Attn(dB):        13.7            0.0
Pwr(dBm):        1.5             1.4

                        VDSL2 framing
                        Bearer 0
MSGc:           18              150
B:              239             236
M:              1               1
T:              21              5
R:              0               16
S:              0.1211          0.3771
L:              15856           5410
D:              1               1
I:              240             255
N:              240             255

                        Counters
                        Bearer 0
OHF:            688926730               1759909
OHFErr:         90436           4294
RS:             0               1896660
RSCorr:         0               55320
RSUnCorr:       0               0

                        Bearer 0
HEC:            162010          0
OCD:            17              0
LCD:            17              0
Total Cells:    1086621707              0
Data Cells:     610749753               0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

ES:             26504           3839
SES:            18              0
UAS:            995             995
AS:             1319403

                        Bearer 0
INP:            0.00            0.00
INPRein:        0.00            0.00
delay:          0               0
PER:            1.91            6.15
OR:             100.28          202.87
AgR:            63177.21        20203.27

Bitswap:        38152/38152             1936/1941

Total time = 15 days 6 hours 46 min 38 sec
FEC:            0               55320
CRC:            90436           4294
ES:             26504           3839
SES:            18              0
UAS:            995             995
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 15 minutes time = 1 min 38 sec
FEC:            0               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC:            0               24
CRC:            3               4
ES:             3               4
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 1 day time = 6 hours 46 min 38 sec
FEC:            0               3120
CRC:            387             44
ES:             220             42
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC:            0               3922
CRC:            1325            199
ES:             847             179
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Since Link time = 15 days 6 hours 30 min 2 sec
FEC:            0               55320
CRC:            90436           4294
ES:             26504           3839
SES:            18              0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
NTR: mipsCntAtNtr=0 ncoCntAtNtr=0
 >

PS I have no wish to hijack the thread - it might help the OP to make his mind up.  :)

Hey pal, thanks for letting me know the item is still stable here and now :) looks like mine will cost me an extra 10 notes but well worth it i think!

re the FEC - Forward Error Correction -  it's not an issue as such. CRC is the one you need to worry about if any (Cyclic Redundancy Check errors are errors that can't be corrected using FEC, so you end up needing to ask for the same data again so it can pi** BT off and affect down speed a bit) but FEC is just corrected errors so all good - but I understand it can be caused by all sorts of local things, downlighters and led lights are particularity prone to creating this. Overall, don't worry about it as it shows the router is doing what it should to correct that.
That's my understanding anyway!

Feel free to flame me guys, I'm braced for it lol.

* Please take what I said with several pinches of salt, that's just my understanding and who knows how misguided it is.
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cjlhessing

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2019, 10:13:38 AM »

I can certainly recommend the Zyxel 8924 as a good stable device. Note that the 8924 has 5Ghz WiFi, which is not present on the 8324 or 1312.  There are usually plenty on eBay at sensible prices - I believe my one was 20.
You say that you ISP will be providing a TP-Link VR400 and that should be reasonable too as it is Broadcom based.  If I were you I'd give it a try before splashing-out on anything else.
 :)

Hello! I'm glad to hear someone thinks the vr400 will be ok for the job, I was relieved they weren't offering another take on the bt hub lol. Never owned a TP Link before so its new territory.
I will certainly give it a go, also want to look at the configuration on it and what they setup on it before looking further out there. Might grab the 8924 though...never know when it will become so hard to find that prices will go crazy lol.

Eventually i'll be going Ubiquiti USG, switch, cloud key and AP for the setup but that wont be until October or later so this is just me, fiddling with things I have no business fiddling with lol.
I think it's the freedom getting to me: hearing a tech support guy at an ISP saying, sure use your own equipment, sure whatever brand it is just call us and we will try to help you set it up even if it isn't ours, and no, if you have problems we wont be asking you to put back the original *optional* router supplied to you.
Sky by contrast needed me to send them a photo showing I had their own bundled modem cable plugged in before they would send Openreach lol.

thanks again pal, really do appreciate all the support you guys on here give out!
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Weaver

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2019, 10:36:42 AM »

As Johnson said, regarding the 1312-B10A on eBay. There are some stupid prices to be seen; probably my fault as I have bought a dozen units nearly, lost count. But wait around for a while - and especially look for units on the continent of europe not just the UK - and some sane prices will be seen. I have even managed to get hold of brand new boxed, unopened ones from France, Germany and the UK.
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ejs

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2019, 12:42:15 PM »

The downstream FECs are particularly interesting (I think so anyway). Can anyone shed any light on why there should be that particular number?

Your downstream FEC counts are zero because you don't have any Forward Error Correction on the downstream (which you can tell from R=0 on the downstream).
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grahamb

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2019, 09:30:06 PM »

The reason I thought it interesting is that the other routers in my "collection" have always reported far greater-than-zero downstream FECs. My line can't have improved that instantly just because I've swapped routers (again) can it?  :shrug2:

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ejs

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2019, 10:11:57 PM »

Some modems may choose to apply some FEC on a non-interleaved / no INP downstream, others may choose not to.
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grahamb

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Re: Moving ISP, time to get new hardware.
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2019, 10:52:23 PM »

Ah, I see.
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