Kitz ADSL Broadband Information
adsl spacer  
Support this site
Home Broadband ISPs Tech Routers Wiki Forum
 
     
   Compare ISP   Rate your ISP
   Glossary   Glossary
 
Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Author Topic: What next for my new VDSL line?  (Read 1927 times)

DaveC

  • Reg Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 197
What next for my new VDSL line?
« on: July 26, 2018, 12:05:59 AM »

As I think I've mentioned elsewhere, I've recently converted my second line from ADSL to VDSL (with AAISP using BT wholesale).

My first line is also VDSL (also with AAISP, but using TT wholesale), which has been reliably syncing at about 80.5/27 max attainable (SNRM 6.3/15.4) for the last couple of years.  I think I'm around 150-200m from the cabinet.

I've been monitoring the new line, and am a bit confused about what to expect next.

When it was first installed (26th June), it was syncing at about 77/25 (max attainable), with the line rate at 67/20.  About 48 hours later, the line resynced and the line rate jumped up to about 77/20.  SNRM was about 6.3 DS and 15.3 US.  CRC errors were 0 for the DS, but present on the US at the rate of about 5 or 6 an hour.

It then stayed pretty much the same until 21st July, when it resynced at about 79/25 (max attainable).  DS SNRM dropped to 5.3.

Then on the 23rd July, it jumped to 82/25 with DS SNRM about 4.6 (US SNRM still 15.3).

Most recently (this morning at about 6.20am), it resynced and changed to 79/27, with DS SNRM back up to 5.2 and US SNRM down to 10.6

Since this morning's change, the previously small number of US CRC errors has dropped to zero (and DS CRC has stayed at zero), so it looks like the US has been improved.

My question is whether the DLM is likely to try dropping the DS SNRM again?  It seemed stable at that setting.

Thanks
Logged

RealAleMadrid

  • Reg Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 305
Re: What next for my new VDSL line?
« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2018, 07:03:56 AM »

Max attainable speeds are not sync speeds so quoting them is pointless, they are theoretical values calculated by the modem. I tend to ignore them because they can vary considerably depending on various line conditions. What really matters are the actual sync speeds which on your fairly short line should be at or very close to 80Mbps down and 20Mbps up. DLM is obviously doing things to your line but without the sync speed data it is not possible to comment further.
Logged

Black Sheep

  • Helpful
  • Addicted Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 5722
Re: What next for my new VDSL line?
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2018, 07:40:04 AM »

Max attainable speeds are not sync speeds so quoting them is pointless, they are theoretical values calculated by the modem. I tend to ignore them because they can vary considerably depending on various line conditions. What really matters are the actual sync speeds which on your fairly short line should be at or very close to 80Mbps down and 20Mbps up. DLM is obviously doing things to your line but without the sync speed data it is not possible to comment further.

Totally agree.

Point in case, I very recently had the arduous task of spending a couple of hours with an EU, going through various graphs, websites (this being one, obviousy) etc ...  having to explain why the previous engineer had said he wasn't getting the DS speed his hand-held tester was reporting he could achieve !!

He was an installation engineer and had plugged his HHT to reveal a DS speed of circa 25Mbps and his MAR was showing 36Mbps. He then suggested the EU raise a broadband engineering visit ... a la moi.  :)

As mooted, the MAR is purely theoretical (thank you Burakucat who first revealed this super snippet of info), and did not take into account the 600mtrs of Ali cable that had 'excessive amounts of crosstalk' as reported via WHOOSH.

Alas, there's nothing that can be done about this short of vectoring or relaying of copper cable. Point being, a helluva lot of time could have been spent by 'others' trying to reach the reported MAR and never, ever achieving it.  :)
Logged

DaveC

  • Reg Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 197
Re: What next for my new VDSL line?
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2018, 08:39:03 AM »

Sorry I wasn't explicit.  Apart from the initial 48 hours (where I quote both the max achievable and line rate - because they were different), line rate has been the same as the max attainable, subject to the 80/20 cap.
Logged

j0hn

  • Kitizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 4098
Re: What next for my new VDSL line?
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2018, 12:52:50 PM »

The answer to your question is yes, DLM more than likely will try 4dB again.
For my line it was about 8 days for the line to try lowering the target SNRM after it raised it by 1dB.
Logged
Talktalk FTTP 550/75 - Speedtest - BQM

burakkucat

  • Respected
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 38300
  • Over the Rainbow Bridge
    • The ELRepo Project
Re: What next for my new VDSL line?
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2018, 03:23:44 PM »

. . . (thank you Burakucat who first revealed this super snippet of info), . . .

  :blush:
Logged
:cat:  100% Linux and, previously, Unix. Co-founder of the ELRepo Project.

Please consider making a donation to support the running of this site.

burakkucat

  • Respected
  • Senior Kitizen
  • *
  • Posts: 38300
  • Over the Rainbow Bridge
    • The ELRepo Project
Re: What next for my new VDSL line?
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2018, 03:27:02 PM »

The answer to your question is yes, DLM more than likely will try 4dB again.

I believe that there will be an ever greater degree of hysteresis as the DLM settles the circuit to its "sweet spot" with regards to both target SNRM and synchronisation speed.
Logged
:cat:  100% Linux and, previously, Unix. Co-founder of the ELRepo Project.

Please consider making a donation to support the running of this site.

ejs

  • Kitizen
  • ****
  • Posts: 2078
Re: What next for my new VDSL line?
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2018, 05:49:52 PM »

The max attainable rate, although "theoretical", does take into account the line characteristics and noise. I expect the large difference between actual and max attainable was due to the INP/interleaving level. The standard max attainable rate calculation does not need to take into account the minimum INP level specified, although the actual rate of course will have to.
Logged

DaveC

  • Reg Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 197
Re: What next for my new VDSL line?
« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2018, 01:42:17 PM »

My line resynced at about 10.13am this morning.

Prior to that, it had line rate 79333/20000, SNR 5.2/10.6 and max attainable 79160/27487.  It had been 100% stable at those settings, with zero CRC errors and errored seconds.

After the resync, line rate is 79582/19999, SNR 5.3/15.3 and max attainable 79344/24800.  I am now getting a small number of upstream CRC errors and errored seconds (about 4-5 an nour).


This seems odd - what would make the DLM think the new settings (with upstream errors) is better than the previous ? 

Here is my line before the resync: https://dslstats.dchapman.com/summary/55455
And here it is now: https://dslstats.dchapman.com/summary/55845
Logged