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[Weaver]

Just out of interest, has anyone tried a Draytek Vigor 130 on VDSL2? I would just like to know how they perform. When I briefly tried one of the Vigor models - probably a Vigor 130, but can't be exactly sure I’m afraid - it seemed to be a less aggressive performer on my ultra-long ADSL2 line, giving a slower downstream sync than the DLink DSL-320B-Z1, which I was usually using as a reference at the time.

[banger]

If I remember correctly the Vigor 130 has an Infinion chipset which is not as suitable as Broadcom modems such as the HG612, ZyXEL and Billion models. A lower sync on ADSL2+ and VDSL2 has been seen on various lines tested on the Kitz forum.

[Weaver]

Indeed, that is what I thought. At the time I tested one, my exchange had a 20CN TI DSLAM. Now it is 21CN and Broadcom kit.

I wonder how much of a deficit there might be compared to Broadcom devices.

Is there any synergy available to Lantau/Infineon CPE if you have a matching Infineon DSLAM ? (If there even is such a thing?)

[banger]

I think our leader Kitz is on an ECI/Infineon cab and has tested various modems when reviewing them for the Kitz site. I do remember her saying that even if it was an ECI cabinet the Broadcom chipsets performed the best on her cab.

[spring]

It can be better if it matches, but those 3 modems are the best so it doesn't apply to them. In comparison I think I've read Lantiq performs even worse on Huawei. The broadcom 63168 is a really good chip so no surprise if it performs as well as the top Lantiqs on ECI's.
Delay is a different story, Lantiq on ECI has 2 to 4 miliseconds less [don't know Huawei]. But obviously not worth it.

[Weaver]

Thanks for that, Spring. I remember now that you have an ECI DSLAM.

[Ixel]

One chipset won't necessarily fit for all lines. Some might find Broadcom works better on their line, while others might find Lantiq/Infineon works better on their line.

In my case, I'm on an ECI cabinet (sadly) but I've found that Lantiq/Infineon produce lower error rates and slightly less latency (1 to 2 milliseconds lower) compared to if I use Broadcom. I use a DrayTek Vigor 2860Vac and DrayTek Vigor 2862 for my two connections. I can't say I've noticed much difference in sync rate, but that could be one of many factors that vary between different lines. Lantiq/Infineon tend to have R:16 on downstream fastpath whereas Broadcom tend to have R:0, difference being that it's a small amount of error correction basically. I'm working on hopefully resolving an issue with the 2862's telnet/web interface freezing after a few days of my program fetching the DSL stats from the router, but other than that both devices work perfectly fine. I've tried a ZyXeL VMG1312-B10A on my line but sadly it's hit and miss with error rates. I've had occasions where I re-sync and suddenly downstream errored seconds go through the roof for no reason. Latency is also a bit higher.

[Weaver]

Did you ever try a Vigor 130, Ixel ?

[spring]

I've tried a ZyXeL VMG1312-B10A on my line but sadly it's hit and miss with error rates.

So you got R:0 with it?


Does this match what you said about R:16? Or doesn't count if on DS G.INP?

VMG1312-B10A / ECI

Code: [Select]

Stats recorded 17 Jun 2018 10:09:16

DSLAM type / SW version: IFTN:0xb206 (178.6) / v0xb206
Modem/router firmware:  AnnexA version - A2pv6F039v.d26a
DSL mode:                VDSL2 Profile 17a
Status:                  Showtime
Uptime:                  0 hour 9 min 51 sec
Resyncs:                0 (since 17 Jun 2018 10:09:11)

Downstream Upstream
Line attenuation (dB):  10.5 0.0
Signal attenuation (dB): Not available on VDSL2
Connection speed (kbps): 44880 3455
SNR margin (dB):        25.4 19.5
Power (dBm):            -15.1 -15.3
Interleave depth:        1 55
INP:                    44.00 2.00
G.INP:                  Enabled Not enabled
Vectoring status:        5 (VECT_UNCONFIGURED)

RSCorr/RS (%):          0.0000 0.0000
RSUnCorr/RS (%):        0.0000 0.0000
ES/hour:                0 0

adsl info --stats
adsl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 35060 Kbps, Downstream rate = 109838 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 3455 Kbps, Downstream rate = 44880 Kbps
Bearer: 1, Upstream rate = 0 Kbps, Downstream rate = 0 Kbps
Link Power State:       L0
Mode:                   VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile:          Profile 17a
TPS-TC:                 PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis:                U:ON /D:ON
Line Status:            No Defect
Training Status:        Showtime
                Down            Up
SNR (dB):        25.4            19.5
Attn(dB):        10.5            0.0
Pwr(dBm):       -15.1           -15.3

                        VDSL2 framing
                        Bearer 0
MSGc:           -6              432
B:              235             17
M:              1               1
T:              0               1
R:              14              16
S:              0.0000          0.1569
L:              11951           1734
D:              1               55
I:              250             34
N:              250             34
Q:              8               0
V:              1               0
RxQueue:                34              0
TxQueue:                17              0
G.INP Framing:          18              0
G.INP lookback:         17              0
RRC bits:               0               24
                        Bearer 1
MSGc:           90              -6
B:              0               0
M:              2               0
T:              2               0
R:              16              0
S:              10.6667         0.0000
L:              24              0
D:              1               0
I:              32              0
N:              32              0
Q:              0               0
V:              0               0
RxQueue:                0               0
TxQueue:                0               0
G.INP Framing:          0               0
G.INP lookback:         0               0
RRC bits:               0               0

                        Counters
                        Bearer 0
OHF:            0               34293
OHFErr:         0               0
RS:             14023496                2134904
RSCorr:         5               0
RSUnCorr:       0               0
                        Bearer 1
OHF:            36731           0
OHFErr:         0               0
RS:             220016          0
RSCorr:         0               0
RSUnCorr:       0               0

                        Retransmit Counters
rtx_tx:         725033          0
rtx_c:          0               0
rtx_uc:         0               0

                        G.INP Counters
LEFTRS:         0               0
minEFTR:        44874           0
errFreeBits:    403698          0

                        Bearer 0
HEC:            0               0
OCD:            0               0
LCD:            0               0
Total Cells:    50921341                0
Data Cells:     1330            0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

                        Bearer 1
HEC:            0               0
OCD:            0               0
LCD:            0               0
Total Cells:    0               0
Data Cells:     0               0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            26              26
AS:             591

                        Bearer 0
INP:            44.00           2.00
INPRein:        0.00            0.00
delay:          0               2
PER:            0.00            17.24
OR:             0.01            203.20
AgR:            44951.38        3657.71

                        Bearer 1
INP:            2.50            0.00
INPRein:        2.50            0.00
delay:          0               0
PER:            16.06           0.01
OR:             47.81           0.01
AgR:            47.81   0.01

Bitswap:        5/5             0/0

Total time = 10 min 17 sec
FEC:            5               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            26              26
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 15 minutes time = 10 min 17 sec
FEC:            5               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            26              26
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 15 minutes time = 0 sec
FEC:            0               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Latest 1 day time = 10 min 17 sec
FEC:            5               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            26              26
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 1 day time = 0 sec
FEC:            0               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Since Link time = 9 min 49 sec
FEC:            5               0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
NTR: mipsCntAtNtr=0 ncoCntAtNtr=0
 >

adsl info --pbParams
adsl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    0
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 35060 Kbps, Downstream rate = 109838 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 3455 Kbps, Downstream rate = 44880 Kbps
Bearer: 1, Upstream rate = 0 Kbps, Downstream rate = 0 Kbps
Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (6,31) (882,1193) (1984,2770)
DS: (33,857) (1218,1959) (2795,4083)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (6,31) (882,1193) (1984,2770)
DS: (41,857) (1218,1959) (2795,4083)
                  VDSL Port Details               Upstream                Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate:           35060 kbps             109838 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power:         -  15.3 dBm            -  15.1 dBm
====================================================================================
  VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 U4 D1 D2 D3
  Line Attenuation(dB): 0.1 10.2 15.2 N/A N/A 6.1 12.8 20.7
Signal Attenuation(dB): 0.1 10.1 15.0 N/A N/A 6.0 12.6 20.7
        SNR Margin(dB): 23.8 20.1 19.1 N/A N/A 25.4 25.4 25.4
         TX Power(dBm): -17.9 -19.3 -28.3 N/A N/A 12.3 8.0 6.9
 >

[Ixel]

So you got R:0 with it?


Does this match what you said about R:16? Or doesn't count if on DS G.INP?

VMG1312-B10A / ECI

If you're on G.INP, not fastpath, then it doesn't count. Traditional interleaving, not G.INP, on FTTC in this country usually applies something like R:10 on Broadcom devices too, but when it's fastpath on the downstream, again not G.INP, it will usually be R:0.

[Zico]

Just fitted a Draytek Vigor 130 onto my line in place of a Billion 8800NL R2 that I had for a year. The cabinet is ECI and using the Billion I only ever really had a sync of ~56 down and ~12 up  through to ~53 down ~11 up much more recently (SNR being ~6 down and ~8 up).

Fitting the Draytek bumped the sync to ~57 down and ~19 up which matched a recent Openreach visit whereby his handheld device was getting similar sync (especially on the up side). Using the SNR Margin -25 I've now got it at ~66 down and ~19 up which I'm hoping will be stable (connection stats attached).

On a side note, the Draytek quick setup guide only mentions about connecting the modem to your pc if you wish to enter the setup otherwise just connecting the device to the DSL line and then to the router (still using the 8800NL R2). Seeing as the Draytek is still using the factory setting (admin etc.), is it advisable to change the password to get into the modem? I would have thought that this would have been part of the quick setup guide to change this regardless of connecting straight to the DSL line and router or not.

[Weaver]

The password for admin access to the modem? I would definitely change it. It may or may not be the case that the modem’s admin web UI is accessible from your main LAN _through_ your router, so for example PCs on the LAN could get at the modem and users could fiddle with it. Ditto with telnet access to your modems from the main LAN. With my Firebrick router, the modems were isolated from the main LAN, the router provided no access through to the modems’ admin interfaces, neither by telnet or to their web admin UI, so users could not tamper with the modems. But I set a strong password anyway because later on I did manage to work out how to get my router to provide admin access to the modems, so they were then exposed.

That is the great thing about the Vigors, in my experience, you just plug them in and they work, zero config.

The Vigor might be a great performer because its chipset is related to that in the particular FTTC cab. That is very true for my ZyXEL VMG 1312-B10A modems and my exchange’s DSLAM chipset: both are Broadcom-designed and both speak Broadcom’s PHY-R L2 retx protocol (gives greatly enhanced reliability, and in a sense more speed, as you can risk pushing it harder), which is more-or-less the same as G.INP for ADSL2(+).

[Zico]

Thanks for the response Weaver.

I've skim read across several threads that don't seem to say how to get through access from the router to the modem.

Regards to the password, I am not too worried about internal access to the modem (I'm the only person on the internal network) but more so about external access to the modem. I will most likely change the default password soon but wasn't too sure if this would make any difference to the router connecting to the modem in general.

[Weaver]

No, you’re ok. Changing the admin password won’t affect internet access, the router talking to the modem. The router doesn’t use any password for that, and this password is just for humans gaining access only. You’re right - in your situation, there is no security issue anyway, even if there were visitors, guests on your LAN, as they can’t get through the router to the modem.

[Zico]

Bit of a bump for this.

Is there any way to add a time delay to Vigor 130 when re-syncing/re-connecting the VDSL line?

I have a neighbouring FTTC line that when both mine and the other line are down due to say a power outage, cause problems for each other when they try to re-sync. If I could add a time delay (120 seconds for example) onto my re-sync then I am hoping this may help me in the short term.