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Author Topic: Stat check on my line please  (Read 15061 times)

michty_me

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #45 on: June 23, 2018, 07:27:16 PM »

Could well be that. I've switched it all off just now as I'm out for the night. I'll investigate tomorrow though.
Can I just ask spring, why in the config screen shots you posted (possibly in another thread) that SRA was set to disabled?
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spring

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #46 on: June 23, 2018, 07:29:07 PM »

Try enabling it after the ZyXEL was turned off & unplugged from DSL, because it might be that you lost sync 11 hours ago. It lowers sync rate in an event that would cause loss of sync, but I first attribute this loss of sync / line problems to the x1 because it's possible from my observation of the x1. The x1 may be more unstable. x1 instabilities are visually seen on the SNR graph.

I disabled it since most ISP's don't support it, and if not supported it's better disabled [some routers don't sync with it enabled when there's no support].
« Last Edit: June 23, 2018, 07:43:32 PM by spring »
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michty_me

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #47 on: June 23, 2018, 07:45:21 PM »

I've noticed more errors than normal anyway with the x1 firmware Zyxel compared to my Netgear D7000. I don't think it would have been enough to drop the speed but what do I know.
I need to go through all my kit again, may even start from scratch and see how I get on.
I think I may install that other firmware too.
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spring

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #48 on: June 23, 2018, 07:46:51 PM »

The first day that I changed DSL driver [or in this case between modems] I always had more errors: but the x1 graphs are visible from the start & later on.

I don't understand what there is to go through, and I change v14 firmwares without changing anything else because they have the same configuration.

The SNR graph is the first thing to look at. If you desynced and don't want to resync with the x1 I understand that & don't recommend that either, but we'll never know how the SNR graph looked, how the x1 performed.

Edit: The SNR graph is to identify x1 as the cause, not because it's unlikely to be. If you already desynced then try this one tomorrow.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2018, 08:06:31 PM by spring »
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michty_me

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #49 on: June 23, 2018, 08:18:13 PM »

Ok, for test purposes and to check out the X1 firmware. I'll get it reconnected when I get home tonight, try and get dslstats working and get any information I can that may help to prove/disprove that there may be an issue.
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spring

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #50 on: June 23, 2018, 08:22:21 PM »

Well, the x1 had days like this:

Code: [Select]
day 10

Latest 1 day time = 2 hours 25 min 56 sec
FEC:            14              0
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC:            30              29
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0


but also this:


day 13 or 14

Latest 1 day time = 18 hours 3 min 16 sec
FEC:            13              196
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC:            31              281
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            0               0
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0

The former is what had me recommending it  :-X

For comparison, what I've got with v is :

Latest 1 day time = 15 hours 33 min 19 sec
FEC:            23              42
CRC:            0               0
ES:             0               0
SES:            0               0
UAS:            26              26
LOS:            0               0
LOF:            0               0
LOM:            0               0

Note that one is 15 hours and not 24 like the stats from x1

All that's left is the bitloading+SNR graph for seeing what's behind the issues. Nothing else can directly point at x1, and even if nothing is seen on the SNR graph the next time issues happened x1 would be replaced with v. If something is seen it's with certainty that it was caused by it.


Edit: Right now I'm leaning towards switching to v anyway [linked to in my previous posted - Don't know if I tried Johnson's but Olipro's is flawless so I'm recommending that] but it's interesting if the graphs look the same for you as they do for me - indicating x1 is problematic. I assume nothing about it bothers Johnson: https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,21273.msg375521.html#msg375521 But note he said he has lower downstream: my SNR graphs show the cause - loss of downstream SNR at the last few tones.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2018, 11:06:27 PM by spring »
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burakkucat

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #51 on: June 23, 2018, 09:47:06 PM »

It appears I've gained another 2db on the downstream and lost another 6Mb sync speed.

Ah, now that you have explained I can see it.  :-[

As you appreciate the two parameters are intimately related. It really depends upon the prevailing situation when the ZyXEL device was powered up and allowed to synchronise.

[Edited to fix the typo.]
« Last Edit: June 23, 2018, 11:54:55 PM by burakkucat »
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j0hn

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #52 on: June 23, 2018, 11:05:13 PM »

I recommend you use the xDSL driver that comes with the firmware version you are using.
That's not the 3925 version, as that contains an xDSL driver from another device (the vmg3925).

With you swapping modems for stability reasons to try get DLM to remove the banding on your line this is even more a reason to use the correct xDSL driver.

Must say that's very strange seeing the SNRM go up but the attainable go down like that.
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spring

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #53 on: June 23, 2018, 11:48:41 PM »

I think it boils down to what Cisco said about x3 [also x1?]:
Quote
This firmware package is released to meet the requirement of a specific Cisco customer and is not claimed to be a general availability. Other Cisco customers can download and upgrade to this firmware package but Cisco recommends customer to do their own qualification before installing it in production network.
Not 100% sure [and can't be when doing guess work] if the x1 package from 3925 isn't modified/incompatible/doesn't have a good fit, but this explanation makes perfect sense [would be nice to test A2pv6F039w1 but takes a lot of digging for that :D]. I'd also guess the widely used versions are often more stable.

Edit: Also note this
Quote
This release has PHY firmware A2pv6F039x3 for Annex A and DSL driver version 26d.
Interesting if it runs well on the 3925.

Edit2: For DSLStats, check if you did this [and LAN page group name is selected/applied as Default]:
Quote
Click Add New Interface Group which will open a new window.  add new interface group

Group Name:  Bridge
WAN Interfaces used: PTM type > VDSL/ppp1.1
Available LAN Interfaces:  Click LAN1 and move it to the Grouped LAN Interfaces

Click Apply.

or vlan group [LAN group name applied as: Bridge], or: https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,21517.msg372730.html#msg372730 [bridge ip = 192.168.2.1 by default - can be seen by going to  network setting > home networking > selecting group name: Bridge]
If your router is an asus also try: https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,21508.msg372706.html#msg372706
last resort: https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,14621.msg284717.html#msg284717

LAN cable access = group name: Default [dsl stats set to connect to 192.168.1.1]
WAN cable access = group name: Bridge [dsl stats set to connect to 192.168.2.1]

Edit3: Attached what I think is the cleanest example of x1 [2 days sync] & v [3 days sync] graph differences that I've got so far because of the hour at which it was taken ::). I'm doing this even though x1 was unstable sometimes, because it sometimes worked fine. This x1 graph makes me hope that it would stop behaving this time :o.
About the bitloading entirely missing on some upstream blocks, that didn't happen before, is like that from this sync and I'll see if it happens next time I resynced in a day or two.
About whether to switch to v I'm already saying feel free to do it because of DLM, but if you want to go in details then sure :D
« Last Edit: June 24, 2018, 09:43:56 AM by spring »
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michty_me

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #54 on: June 24, 2018, 12:45:59 PM »

See attached bitloading graph.
So should I change to the firmware that Spring linked to further up the thread in post #48 or change to the official release for this unit?
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spring

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #55 on: June 24, 2018, 01:35:24 PM »

Where's the SNR graph? Go to Configurations > Items to monitor   and tick "SNR Per Tone - Include with Bitloading"

Also, disable "Scale snapshots" in the snapshot tab.

If you will change, it would best be what I linked.


Attached this afternoon's snapshot of x1

With bitloading missing from a block of upstream tones, I get this error count:
Latest 1 day time = 8 hours 54 min 27 sec
FEC:            18              298

You don't miss bitloading, however my old logs show high upstream errors as well:
Latest 1 day time = 18 hours 3 min 16 sec
FEC:            13              196

So what I suggest is that you show the snapshot and then get the firmware I linked to, look at the time [32 minutes until next turned on] - turn off the modem from button, unplug DSL cable from it, turn it on & wait 1 minute, flash, wait until it gets you back to the gui, turn it off, turn it on 32 minutes from when you first turned it off

Guess x1 outright sucks for VDSL [I don't know ADSL ::)]. Oh well, at least we don't have to try it in the future now  :lol:
Sorry, I was naive thinking a week was enough to tell it's a good driver  :( And I forgot about the fact I made an affirmation about the not fully tested x1, as 2 weeks passed until your vmg1312 arrived, I guess it was more what I used/called best back then and was meant to be informational [misleading  :fingers:], at the moment of flashing I would have said to not use it as it was not finished testing. Moreover when you flashed I was already seeing the bad side of x1, there wasn't a question asked about it, but I didn't see right to pretend I know for sure that it would not perform well on your line once I saw you flashed to it.

Edit: The x1 package taken from vmg3925 in this firmware may be made for dsl driver d26n, while vmg1312 is d26a - so not necessarily x1 behaves like this, could be this x1 package is made for a dsl driver other than d26a [d26n is not a requirement for correct operation of x1].
« Last Edit: June 24, 2018, 02:21:51 PM by spring »
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michty_me

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #56 on: June 24, 2018, 02:22:49 PM »

Please see the attached new file.
I'll change firmware just shortly.
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spring

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #57 on: June 24, 2018, 02:26:46 PM »

I don't know if the drop I'm seeing at the first downstream tones is caused by x1 [to be seen], but even if it looked perfect I would blame x1 anyway. It doesn't matter how it looks, just how it performs, but if the v performs similarly then the graph from the x1 could be useful.

If you can wait for longer than 32 minutes before turning on the device hooked to the DSL, then I recommend waiting for as long as you could see fit, as the switching between modem drivers will probably make your DLM go even worse.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2018, 02:34:24 PM by spring »
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michty_me

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #58 on: June 24, 2018, 04:00:23 PM »

Here is the bitloading graph with the other firmware installed.
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spring

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Re: Stat check on my line please
« Reply #59 on: June 24, 2018, 05:07:12 PM »

Looks the same but will perform differently, but the first days will be rough as always. If it doesn't improve on the 4th day, turning off from power button & turning back on after 31 minutes is needed to verify, if it still continued it would be either 1. the modem or 2. something else changed

At the bottom of the bitloading page there's an icon of a green camera - it saves the snapshots to the location set in Configuration>Snapshots>Snapshots directory. I've set it to the same folder DSLStats is in.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2018, 05:18:22 PM by spring »
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