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[Chrysalis]

I have asked AAISP to opt in, they have queried TTB and BTw to try and get some information on it.  So I expect they will opt-in if the option is open to them.

[Chrysalis]

My ECI lime no longer uses 2880 ES / 20 resyncs per day it seems to be dependant on SES also now.  If you get enough SES you end up on interleave even if you only have 500ES and 0 resyncs.  It is very annoying as I have to wait 14 days for it to be removed.  Basically a few seconds of SES and you have a reduced speed line for 14d.  Hopefully GINP will help so I really do hope GINP is coming.

I hope we get to see some people posting when they notice ECI GINP on their lines.  I still miss MDWS.

There has been a DLM adjustment unfortunately, we don't know quite know what it is, but SES is certainly a possibility.

I think the industry has decided to move to a lower expectations model which in turn leads to less fault reports and ultimately less hassle for CP's.  When the competition is selling 100s of mbits/sec, I think the difference between say a 50mbit speed and 60mbit speed isnt going to materially affect churn when compared to say 300mbit/sec.

If I am right, it explains the more conservative ECI DLM, the lower fault thresholds, the lower estimates, it will all make sense and also remember Openreach are crippled by Ofcom regulation with the revenue they can earn so it has led to a lower QoS from them.

[kitz]

I have asked AAISP to opt in, they have queried TTB and BTw to try and get some information on it.  So I expect they will opt-in if the option is open to them.

Info is available here if you want to pass the link on.   Unfortunately you need an Openreach log in to be able to read it

https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/newlogin.do?smauthreason=0&target=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.openreach.co.uk%2Forpg%2Fcustomerzone%2Fupdates%2Fbriefings%2Fnga%2Fnga00820.pdf&fromMasterHead=1

[Chrysalis]

Thanks Kitz, I will pass it onto Shaun.

[kitz]

YVW

There has been a DLM adjustment unfortunately, we don't know quite know what it is, but SES is certainly a possibility.

I think the industry has decided to move to a lower expectations model which in turn leads to less fault reports and ultimately less hassle for CP's.  When the competition is selling 100s of mbits/sec, I think the difference between say a 50mbit speed and 60mbit speed isnt going to materially affect churn when compared to say 300mbit/sec.

If I am right, it explains the more conservative ECI DLM, the lower fault thresholds, the lower estimates, it will all make sense and also remember Openreach are crippled by Ofcom regulation with the revenue they can earn so it has led to a lower QoS from them.

I'm not certain what is going on, but not sure if its just linked to SES either... as the day I have interleaving applied after the 25 Err Sec spike was also just 25 for the whole day.       
What I do know is that they have been trialling a new system since Sept last year,  which appears to be more temporal than the existing/previous 24hr period... and is possibly catching very large CRC bursts that may occur in a short(er) time frame.   I'm trying to do more digging and if I do find out any info I will let you know.

Penalising a line for a single 25 second really bad noise spike which was ok for the rest of the day seems like overkill.   It 'may' not be as much of a bad thing to apply RS encoding to lines with a large amount of CRC in a short time frame to a line which has the benefit of re-tx... but seems a tad unfair and harsh to those of us on ECI's who don't have g.inp as a first line defence mechanism against noise.
   

[adslmax]

Info is available here if you want to pass the link on.   Unfortunately you need an Openreach log in to be able to read it

https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/newlogin.do?smauthreason=0&target=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.openreach.co.uk%2Forpg%2Fcustomerzone%2Fupdates%2Fbriefings%2Fnga%2Fnga00820.pdf&fromMasterHead=1

Does anyone can copy and paste here if they do have openreach to logged in. Hate it when they hidden (not shown to the public)

Please do not do this - roseway

[ktz392837]

I'm still waiting for interleave to be removed since my last SES spike but I am monitoring my line and when it gets applied again I am expecting a SES burst the day before.  It may be some other criterion but SES seems to be the most obvious at the moment.

Back to the ECI ginp trial what is going to be infuriating is if he trial fails again knowing that with a click of a button at Openreach end you can have ginp on eci lines.  It should be made an option that the end user can turn on off.  Add the option for the customer to set target db from 3db whilst they are at it

I hope there is at least one Kitz user on the trial to report back information.

[adslmax]

My mate on plusnet has requested for a trial on his ECI cabinet. I asked him to join this forum.

[Alex Atkin UK]

I posted on the forum too to request consideration for the trial.

[Ronski]

Does anyone can copy and paste here if they do have openreach to logged in. Hate it when they hidden (not shown to the public)

That would almost certainly be in breach of the terms and conditions of the users account, and could cause issues for kitz if it was posted here.

[Weaver]

Did AA get anything back from BT yet?

This is going to bring a lot of happiness to long, long suffering people. In fact what has it been, five years ?

[niemand]

Yeah as mentioned breaching NDAs like that is a bad idea.

It's absolutely none of our business what Openreach do behind their login wall any more than it's our business what other companies are discussing internally or with their customers even if those customers in turn use their products to sell services to us.

At best it would cause disciplinary action and at worst a job being lost.

This'll probably be made clearer once BT Wholesale have briefed their customers. That's usually when things become clearer as by then things tend to be less 'confidential'.

Either way it doesn't really matter. We know what's happening so details not so necessary. The new FTTP pricing stuff is far more interesting.

[Alex Atkin UK]

The new FTTP pricing stuff is far more interesting.

Speaking of, its kinda weird that they implement the changes a week before the end of the financial year so the activation price is cheaper for that whole week before going up.

Why would you complicate things like that rather than just delaying the new pricing/packages to the week later?

[kitz]

I've managed to get hold of my DLM MTBE data and by comparing with my own stats obtained from my router, I can confirm that for all days bar one that the Openreach MTBE data matches up with my MTBE calculations (give or take 1 or 2 err secs) which would imply DLM is still using the same MTBE parameters and is only using ErrSecs.

The one day which had a difference was actually in my favour.   DLM recorded MTBE of 3500 whilst my modem captured MTBE 1630.    I was a bit puzzled by this at first especially as there was no data recorded either a couple of days previously.    So either DLM didn't capture the whole days data... or....this unrecorded data may have been discarded to a Wide Area Event.   

Wide Area Events do appear to work on my cab as there have been two instances where I know I have definitely gone into ILQ red, yet DLM has discarded the data and taken no action.   One during a thunderstorm and the other where iirc there was a period of errors after some sort of power outage.

 

[kitz]

The above calculations do not explain why we are seeing some instances of oddness where a few lines have had DLM action taken at a ludicrously low rate of errors.
 
In other news I can however confirm that Openreach are playing and looking at employing a temporal DLM which has been up for trials since Sept last year.  This info is in the public domain so I am not giving away trade secrets.   

Temporal DLMs do not run for a 24hr period and may only record data during either certain times of the day or may run for differing time periods.  (with the same params).  The idea of temporal DLMs is to increase stability for lines whose 24hr period MTBE is in effect negated by large parts of the rest of the day without errors.

Please note it is very important that this is/was a smallish trial and not in general use yet.  Only a tiny portion of lines are on the trial and that is only if your ISP is one of those elected to go on the trial.