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Author Topic: Daily Error Spikes  (Read 6205 times)

Chrysalis

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #45 on: December 27, 2017, 08:49:23 AM »

:-X  I was only saying that whatever is causing it, is still obviously there.   I'm not obsessing over it or chasing my ISP, was more mentioning it because I was seeing how long DLM takes to remove.

Whatever it is is a PITA, because aside from the one minute period per day, the line is OK and doesnt need any DLM interaction.   Just that sometimes that one minute spike, causes the line to spaz out for a while.   By the time DLM takes action, the line will always be stable again and in no need of DLM.

Yep I have said this for a while.

A more useful DLM would take action "right away" whilst the errors are occurring, it would also recover the line quickly (at least on first time events for say 30 days).
The DLM as it is now will wait until the next day so "hours" after the event and can leave the line crippled for days at a time when the problem is long gone.  (interleaving, I know banding is way longer).

So not sure why ejs replied the way in he did.

--edit--

Outside my neighbours front door the entire pavement is dug up, I looked for signs and I think its possibly power company related, so this is the likely cause, however I just rang the council to moan, because its taking the entire width of the pavement which is quite wide and forcing people to walk on the main road.  No workers there today so seems no urgency to close it up which I am not happy with.  Will be an issue for me personally with my walking aid if its still there next week.

--edit--

Impressed council came out, they agreed is H&S issue, parents taking children on main road to get by, scooters etc, and with sunlight glaring in peoples eyes, he rang the power company, and he said if they dont clear it by end of day, the council will do it themselves and charge the power company. Is off topic, but thought I would give update.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2017, 01:58:14 PM by Chrysalis »
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #46 on: December 28, 2017, 07:48:54 PM »

Line resync'd this morning.   Exactly 14 days for DLM to reverse its action.
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #47 on: December 28, 2017, 07:49:45 PM »

Upstream & Downstream SNRM oscillation showing since switching the modem off to-day  ???

Despite me trying several times to clear this myself - including leaving the modem switch off for a few hours, I could just not get this to clear and the oscillations have persisted the whole time since DLM caused my line to resync and apply FEC.

This morning its gone - SNRM is once again straight lining.  The difference being that this time it was DSLAM that dropped my connection and caused the resync.
Thus conclusion (and not for the first time!) as far as the oscillations are concerned, whatever it is causing it always starts and usually only ends at the remote end.
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #48 on: December 28, 2017, 07:52:16 PM »

had a spike myself last night I assumed I am screwed, but I might just be ok even with sky only using the standard profile.

MDWS shows 1371 ES for the day, just below the 1440 sky profile limit.

Just had a look at your MDWS stats. Luckily for you, it looks like you escaped by the skin of your teeth :)

Quote
A more useful DLM would take action "right away" whilst the errors are occurring.

Unfortunately don't ever see that happening, I don't think ANY DLM systems are capable of taking action so quickly as most modern systems rely on MTBE & MTBR over the course of the day.   It is damn annoying for me though,  that every single time DLM takes action my line has already recovered and therefore no longer needs any DLM action.

Quote
it would also recover the line quickly (at least on first time events for say 30 days).

It does (for INP).   First time it happened it took 24 hrs of MTBE of green.    The whole point of me recording what is happening is not as some may think to complain, but more as a point of recording so it can be publicly seen what DLM is doing.

So far
1st offence.  Recovery 24hrs
2nd offence.  Recovery 10 days
3rd offence.  Recovery 14 days.
4th offence.  Recovery 14 days.   It may have duplicated the 14 days as it is some months since it last took any action as I've normally been able to catch it before the MTBE goes over the limit.

I'm happyish with that - seems fair in the grand scheme of things.  From what Ive observed on other lines next step will be a month or more. 

MTBE & INP appears to be working fine.  MBTR (resyncs & banding) doesnt :(

Quote
I know banding is way longer).

I started to make a reply to one of your posts in another thread before Xmas related to this.   Unfortunately my hands got too sore and I never got to finishing it.  I think I still have most of it in notepad somewhere, I may just post as it is in the relevant thread rather than delay further.
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NewtronStar

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #49 on: December 30, 2017, 11:51:35 PM »

I'm confident you will find away to stop the modem seeing those odd errored seconds ramping up from 9am to 11am, you should not have to go down this path if the BB circuit was normal, the more times I see this happen on your line it point's to a dodgy port on the line card and neighbors may also may be seeing the same thing who are on the same card.

And I know how difficult it is to get your ISP to ask OR to look into a possible line card fault, Spikes of CRC's which turn into errored seconds DSLAM sends you to Interleaved SNRM starts Oscillating 14 day later DSLAM sends you back to fastpath SNRM stops Oscillating  ::)
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d2d4j

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #50 on: December 31, 2017, 07:45:56 AM »

Hi NS

My thought is it is not a line card issue (sorry if Iím wrong)

I think it is localised and may well cause the same issue on neighbouring connections

I think this because it only happens within a few hours each day, and from my understanding, a drop/reconnect resolves issue, so it has to be local to kitz and/or neighbours as it is very short term

Many thanks

John
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #51 on: December 31, 2017, 09:23:44 AM »

I think NS is talking about one of the other symptoms I've been seeing for a long time which is oscillating SNRM.   That always starts after the line has been dropped remotely, ie DSLAM end.    I tried several times last week to clear it myself by disconnecting the line here and even leaving it switched off for a while.   That did not clear until the DSLAM removed FEC, so in that respect he is correct that I only got the Oscillating SNRM whilst the line had Interleaving applied

The other issue of the daily spike is separate.  When it first started a few years ago.. it was usually around 10.30ish, but over the past year the time has been more random.   That daily spike has been there for years, but it causing the line to stick and continue producing the CRC and Err Secs is more recentl
I could be wrong because the high E/Secs only happens occasionally to be certain about this, but I think that only started after I was swapped over to a new pair. 

The 'new' pair syncs lower than the old pair did, but it has less range of oscillations than the old pair.  ie range of about 1dB, the old pair oscillated by anything up to 3dB.    I was a bit fobbed off by the OR Engineer who knew this was the last available pair and I was told to see how it went for a week or two, because really it needed new cable pulling through and he said he couldn't do that on that particular day.    In the meantime my MGAL reduced so although on occasions I fall below the BTw estimates for my line, PN wont do anything about it because its still above the MGAL. 
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AngelRex

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #52 on: January 09, 2018, 12:13:47 PM »

I've noticed in the last few months I'm getting this a few times in the day.

If you take a look at Angel-Rex on MDWS  and set to 5 days the pattern has been quite regular.

My DS has also been dropped from 37mb sync to 29mb - Any thoughts?

Should I call this into SKY to get investigated?
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #53 on: January 09, 2018, 12:38:34 PM »

Whilst I can see the spikes, I think contacting your ISP would be a waste of time.   
Mine have been going on for a few years now and I can't get to the bottom of it.  Your spikes are smaller than mine and also insufficient to even take you out of ILQ green. (see below for compare)  Mine run into the thousands and quite often by the end of the day it will have affected my ILQ status, yet there is nothing that can be done at the Openreach end..  which is why I'm trying to manage it myself before it goes ILQ red. :/
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kitz

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #54 on: January 12, 2018, 02:28:08 PM »

This thread had information about setting up error notifications from DSLstats to notify my phone so I could remote resync the line.
Because this became rather a long discussion, it is deemed worthy of a thread in its own right.   
I've split off any posts about notifications and moved them to a new thread here :- Using DSLstats to detect line errors and force line to resync
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AngelRex

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Re: Daily Error Spikes
« Reply #55 on: January 15, 2018, 02:09:24 PM »

As a follow up - My line went mad at 9am on Sunday :/  Showing a minus SNR and everything!

I called the ISP who has arranged a fibre engineer to come Wednesday.  I had to re-install the SKY SR102 router so they could diagnose the line on Sunday but I managed to get some of the info on MDWS in case anyone was interested.

My ES and CRC errors are in the thousands :(  Hopefully this won't mess up my line completely.
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