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[NEXUS2345]

Tommy, have you taken a look at Uno? Their packages run through TTB and for the most part are not too expensive.

[tommy45]

Uno/Xilo  Despite the Line being on the BTWholesale platform and all other providers being able to offer bb services on this line , the UNO checker says no just has it does for several others who have tried to join them, Uno say that it isn't a fault with their checker but with BT, or due to a tag/marker , which would also stop others too, leaving the customer unable to migrate to any provider, The fault /problem is down to their checker, and or the info that is pulling from the BT OR data base But they don't seem interested in resolving things for potential customers, I gave up on uno/xilo because of this several years ago

[NEXUS2345]

If it truly was an issue with the BTW adsl checker site, then it isn't Uno's fault at all. The issue needs resolving by BTW who need to update their database.

[tommy45]

If it truly was an issue with the BTW adsl checker site, then it isn't Uno's fault at all. The issue needs resolving by BTW who need to update their database.

So matter who's fault it is they aren't bothered about it must have enough customers

[Icaraa]

As for the HR fault ,Zen claimed that they were unable to run the CIDT test because they aren't my phone (PTSN)provider, which i didn't believe, but later, after making further enquiries into this  i found it to be true, So i asked my PTSN provider who was helpful and said that even though it wasn't affecting the voice  they would run the tests , Why did Openreach devise a test (CDIT) roll it out to nearly all exchanges but prevent ISP's running that test if they don't provide your PSTN service as well, because back in 2011  when they launched this test  there were not the amount of isp's selling overpriced bundles as there is now, it makes no sense at all, unless they don't wish to be run off their feet with faults?

Not quite sure what they're banging on about here. If that was the case they'd never be able actually get an HR fault fixed that was affecting your broadband!

On a line that has FTTC they should be using the standard Openreach FTTC Brandeburg test system, which looks for HR (and other) faults. They might also know it as a FastTest GEA test. Whatever they call it, it will see an HR fault on the D-side.

[tommy45]

Not quite sure what they're banging on about here. If that was the case they'd never be able actually get an HR fault fixed that was affecting your broadband!

On a line that has FTTC they should be using the standard Openreach FTTC Brandeburg test system, which looks for HR (and other) faults. They might also know it as a FastTest GEA test. Whatever they call it, it will see an HR fault on the D-side.

The end to end GEA service test isn't very good at detecting line faults the CIDT test does the following https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/productdevelopment/latestempenhancements/latestempenhancements/R1700_downloads/cidt.doc
Some llu supliers  include this test with other tests in their TAM tests

[Icaraa]

The end to end GEA service test isn't very good at detecting line faults the CIDT test does the following https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/productdevelopment/latestempenhancements/latestempenhancements/R1700_downloads/cidt.doc
Some llu supliers  include this test with other tests in their TAM tests

I'm not sure about the GEA test not being very good at detecting line faults! It seems pretty good to me!
"Potential HR joint detected on GEA service", we fix faults like that day in day out.

As far as I know you can't run the standard copper CIDT test on an FTTC enabled line.

[tommy45]

I'm not sure about the GEA test not being very good at detecting line faults! It seems pretty good to me!
"Potential HR joint detected on GEA service", we fix faults like that day in day out.

As far as I know you can't run the standard copper CIDT test on an FTTC enabled line.

Why not, there is no reason why it would not work and the GEA FTTC service test did mot pick up this fault or a previous fault which was on the D side pair

[ejs]

Perhaps this Openreach PDF about the CIDT makes it clearer:
https://www.ciz-openreach.co.uk/Consumer/content/155/Copper-Integrated-Demand-Testing-CIDT-fact-sheet

CIDT uses signals from the modem to find faults and check for modem connection

But with FTTC, a CIDT test from the exchange won't have access your VDSL2 modem, so it can't work.

[burakkucat]

But with FTTC, a CIDT test from the exchange won't have access your VDSL2 modem, so it can't work.

Explicitly, the low-pass filter, located in the cabinet housing the DSLAM, will stop all signals (other than voice band) proceeding from the D-side ---> E-side and the converse.

[Icaraa]

Why not, there is no reason why it would not work and the GEA FTTC service test did mot pick up this fault or a previous fault which was on the D side pair

I'm not going to argue with you but I'm telling you from experience (think about it) that Openreach doesn't use the copper CIDT test to diagnose and test for HR faults on FTTC enabled lines.

The CP requests a test from the Openreach system. That triggers the GEA test for FTTC enabled lines. If it shows an HR fault an engineer is sent out. The engineer cannot close that fault until they get a clear result "GEA service test completed and no fault found" (as opposed to "Potential HR Jount detected on GEA service") on the GEA test. They totally rely on that test so I don't know why you would say it isn't reliable.

Explicitly, the low-pass filter, located in the cabinet housing the DSLAM, will stop all signals (other than voice band) proceeding from the D-side ---> E-side and the converse.

Thank you.

[tommy45]

I'm not going to argue with you but I'm telling you from experience (think about it) that Openreach doesn't use the copper CIDT test to diagnose and test for HR faults on FTTC enabled lines.

The CP requests a test from the Openreach system. That triggers the GEA test for FTTC enabled lines. If it shows an HR fault an engineer is sent out. The engineer cannot close that fault until they get a clear result "GEA service test completed and no fault found" (as opposed to "Potential HR Jount detected on GEA service") on the GEA test. They totally rely on that test so I don't know why you would say it isn't reliable.


Thank you.

Because Zen had ran a few of these GEA tests and it detected nothing, and the same thing happened with another line fault whe i was with plusnot It did on one occasion give a result saying that there was a PTSN fault , but the engineer  found a fault with the test head its self , and the engineer testing for my test jack found a minor issue with the battery at the exchange , So in my experience that test is far from perfect, as once again  the engineer was able to find a hr that it didn't detect

[Icaraa]

Because Zen had ran a few of these GEA tests and it detected nothing, and the same thing happened with another line fault whe i was with plusnot It did on one occasion give a result saying that there was a PTSN fault , but the engineer  found a fault with the test head its self , and the engineer testing for my test jack found a minor issue with the battery at the exchange , So in my experience that test is far from perfect, as once again  the engineer was able to find a hr that it didn't detect

I actually find the GEA test very sensitive at detecting things like HR faults and star wiring.

Do you mean the engineer that came to your house was able to find an HR fault with his handheld tester?

[tommy45]

I actually find the GEA test very sensitive at detecting things like HR faults and star wiring.

Do you mean the engineer that came to your house was able to find an HR fault with his handheld tester?

yes with his Exfo device

[Icaraa]

yes with his Exfo device

You say he found a problem with a battery at the exchange and also a problem with the test head at the exchange? Neither of those things would affect your FTTC broadband anyway as that only runs over the D-side. But then maybe you weren't on FTTC with Plusnet.

I'm not surprised the Exfo was able to see something that a line test couldn't though, that can happen.