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[kitz]

Yep Im not convinced this pair is that much better.    Its now in open DLM and syncing at 73.7 Mbps.    When the old pair didnt have INP/Interleave it would sync at 76Mbps.

Nowt I can do though if it passes his tests.  I remain unconvinced because those oscillations are still there, as are the errors.   We know that its not normal behaviour and its also not really like typical High Open behaviour. 
Although saying that, Ive used the landline a couple of times and its been quite noisy.   Yet that in itself is intermittent - Saturday afternoon it was bad, yet a QLT last night was perfect. 

Its not even midday and ILQ is amber  - same yesterday.  Based on performance so far,  this line is erroring more on a normal day than the old pair did. 

 

[NewtronStar]

Have noticed the DS SNRM starts to go steady into a quieter period 0900 to 1900 now if I have learnt anything from your forum a HR fault can allow external interference onto your line as the pairs are out of balance.

As for the current errored seconds with a 120 day window open on MDWS it has not changed that much anywhere from 154 to 409 ES per day except for those monthly bursts were is that coming from  and TBH I am not impressed with your last OR Engineer as it's obvious all your UG pairs have degraded because of water ingress (rusted and brittle) UG feed needs upgraded.

[Chrysalis]

well its happened again, so tomorrow the new fault report can go in after DLM brings the line below the min estimated speed.

[kitz]

To say Im a tad mad right now is an under estimate.   
Ive just been told that the goal posts have shifted and my min guaranteed speed is now 62.57 Mbps.
Plusnet have run a GEA test and according to them all is ok so they cannot raise a fault and refuse to do anything further.

I dont have time to do anything more about it right now.

Sync speed is currently
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 68017 Kbps

[Sheepie]

Have you tried any other modem apart from the Zyxel ones?

I had similar oscillations (but only on D1 tones) which were driving me mad, I was using brand new Zyxel 1312. I tried everything and eventually there was nothing left to try but replace the Zyxel with HG612 - and the oscillations went away and have never come back.

 

[kitz]

Only been using Zyxels because of monitoring.  I lent my HG612 out to someone who had been given an ECI and not got it back. 
The Zyxel was previously ok and still using the same stable f/w.   I purchased a new 1312 but that was worse so I went back to the 8324.

[Chrysalis]

kitz I was thinking they may pull that stunt on you, there tends to be a habit of moving estimates downwards for a line if a fault is reported.

I would push the argument that you dont care what the estimate is now, what counts is what it was at the point of sale.  Also if you noticed any stability issues make sure you make that clear as well.

[burakkucat]

I can tell when the modem/router has re-trained during a "faulty phase" by looking at the Hlog plot.

If the Hlog plot shows a "tail end droop" at the high frequency end then the circuit is misbehaving.

[kitz]

Plusnet refuse point blank to do anything further as the line is now performing above the MGAL of 62.57 Mbps.

I now cannot report this line as having a broadband fault until it drops below 62Mbps.
End of.


So moral of the tale.   
Engineer can 'fix' your line for 2 days after which point the line is now syncing even lower than when the fault was first reported.

[kitz]

PS attaching results from the BT performance tester.

The MGAL appears to be linked to (but slightly lower than) the downstream handback threshold.

The downstream handback is when the EU should be refunded any connection fees, rental fees and not charged any cease fees in the event of a line underperforming and unable to be improved.    Which for the EU isnt much use unless you have a cable provider nearby where you can go to.

VDSL Range A (Clean)    80    69.1    20    20    63.1    Available    

This btw is an email earlier this year.   It wasnt really a new line, they'd swapped my account over to try resolve a billing issue.

Account username: xxxxx

When you signed up for Plusnet Broadband, we gave you an estimated line speed. Now that your broadband has been active for 14 days, we thought we'd let you know the speed as it stands today, by way of comparison.
 
Estimated line speed:   70.2Mbps to 80Mbps
Current line speed:   67Mbps

Estimated line speed: This is an estimation of the range of speeds you're likely to see based on the line check made when you signed up or upgraded your broadband service. This shows the maximum speeds your line is capable of; although you may have chosen to buy a product which runs at slower speeds.

Current line speed: This is a measure of the actual line speed you are now receiving based on the product you have taken.

Line speed is dependent on:

This is from my ticket today.   Should say they did phone me up on my mobile, but I wasn't in a position to be able to say anything at that particular time. 

I am sorry you are unhappy with our previous response but unfortunately as the services is working within the expectations for your line we will not be able to investigate this further at the moment.

I think 1) Openreach engineer has fobbed me off as line is no better
2) Just right now I have far too much on my plate to even attempt to take it further

[almostgivenup]

  Hi, first post in this forum...

Reading this thread compelled me to join up incase there is anything I may add or gain as I have a very similar issue (except mine actually drops as well and only bounces on download SNRM) and guess what... I am on an ECI cab too.

Leaving everything off overnight gets me a couple of days service max but you can guarantee that the bouncing SNRM will return and once triggered will continue through multiple re-syncs.

Interleaving, INP and probably banding are applied by DLM on download and 2 BT OR engineers have found my line results are perfect.

I talked one engineer in to a port and card swap at the cabinet which he did but still the same problem and I have rewired and replaced NTE & faceplate twice, tried 3 modems and I have no extension wiring, I've run modem/router on car battery with mains in house off and monitored on laptop and exactly the same and I've spent hours monitoring for any trace of REIN on a communications receiver scanning 0.5-30mhz and nothing which leaves me to believe that there is a hardware fault at the cabinet but nobody is listening to me 

Saga ongoing since at least December and really is quite depressing now 

I think I may pay some local youths to steal a car and drive it in to the ECI cabinet, no internet for a while but hopefully a new cabinet will cure the fault 

^^^ Tempting as it is, that last sentence is a joke!

Next plan is... there is no plan, I am just going to continue in the hope it will fix itself one day or I just get fed up and cancel the DD. Maybe a better technology will develop in the next few years and it will work?

[kitz]

Hi there and welcome to the forum.

There's a few of us who have the SNRM oscillations - and all appear to be on ECI's.   Its so damn annoying that previously the line was very good and rock steady. 

I dont really see what much else I can do.   One thing that just happened is that my line has just resync'd a few mins ago and came back up without interleaving.
A full reset by the engineer has obviously put me back at square one DLM so after one full day without err secs its removed INP.
However I notice a very nasty spike of 1.6 million CRCs just after it came back up so will have to wait see what happens next. 

Leaving everything off overnight gets me a couple of days service max but you can guarantee that the bouncing SNRM will return and once triggered will continue through multiple re-syncs.

Yes sometimes it will clear it.   Sometimes it wont.   The fact alone that having to do this tends to make me feel it is something more related to the linecard/cab.
My symptoms arent typical of normal HR faults and as Ive mentioned elsewhere another time I did see similar type of behaviour was many years ago when there was a problem with a certain MSAN line card.   It was years ago and I cant recall the DSLAM make - Azzaka from Zen may remember as they were passing quite a few faults over to BT back then which had this problem.   However I cant say for sure if it is the line card, its just the only time Ive ever seen something displaying similar symptoms which wasnt REIN.

Like you I have no plans what to do next.

----
btw I noticed yesterday when I was going to the chemist to pick up a prescription that there was a lot of digging going on next to my cab.   I asked what they were doing and they said they were laying new fibre between my cab and the one across the road.
They were also putting new foundations down for the PCP which will have a shiny new case.

[almostgivenup]

Thanks for the welcome.

I have a theory but remember I am in no way an expert in these systems but do have a solid background in electronic engineering etc...

Having walked past these cabinets you can hear the fans inside and feel the cabinets are warm to the touch.

We all know heat is a major contributor to and indicator of component failure.

My theory is that possibly through age or otherwise something in the cabinet, perhaps the port/card we are connected to is breaking down (could be as simple as a slow cooling fan or blocked air flow?) and when there is heavy data use over a period of time on your connection the card heats up and starts throwing a wobbly creating these strange oscillating SNR issues but there is nothing to indicate this to an engineer until it breaks totally. Simply disconnecting your modem overnight is enough to let whatever it is cool down and then when you reconnect the modem it starts operating normally again until is gets hot over a period of hours/days.

This would explain why simply re-syncing straight away would not clear this problem as the faulty component would still be hot?

Don't shoot me, I'm running out of ideas and patience too

[Black Sheep]

All idea's and theories are most welcome, and that may be the case in some circumstances ......................... but Kitz's issue (from what we read), appears to be the UG (Underground feed) to the premises.

PS ..... welcome, almostgivenup. 

[j0hn]

I think that's an unlikely cause of your issues, however plausible it sounds. The DSLAMs are fitted with variable fans and a whole bunch of heat sensors/temperature alarms, and will automatically shutdown if the temperature of any of the components got too high.

We also know that the ECI cabinets were retro-fitted with heat pads to prevent the temperature getting too low and to stop condensation forming. The ECI shells are the most vented also, probably the reason the heat pads were needed.