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Author Topic: When will copper legally be phased out?  (Read 3404 times)

Bowdon

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When will copper legally be phased out?
« on: August 25, 2016, 11:21:21 AM »

I used the word legally because I know there will be copper in the network for many decades to come.

As far as I know isn't there a legal obligation for BT / OR to maintain the copper lines for emergencies?

When do we think this legal obligation will be removed?
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roseway

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2016, 11:59:04 AM »

I don't know the answer to the question, but I suspect that the answer will be "a lot longer than many people expect". Until there is a highly reliable alternative for emergencies, copper is going to remain essential.

I had an example just a few days ago. There was a power cut which also took out the only accessible mobile phone mast, so my only way of contacting the outside world if I were housebound would have been by corded phone. I don't even live in a remote area, but merely one which is affected by topography. There must be many people in similar situations.
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  Eric

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2016, 12:28:59 PM »

Ah.  ??? We're talking about PSTN / POTS.

Not copper the metal.  ;D

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gogeta

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2016, 12:50:57 PM »

Wait, what are you talking about? If not copper the metal?
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digitalnemesis

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2016, 12:53:35 PM »

Isn't copper metal? I think it will be here for decades to come. It's going to take a huge amount of manpower and decades to replace all copper pairs with fibre optic cables.
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Chrysalis

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2016, 09:17:27 AM »

Well my own experience has mobile connectivity reliability for voice most definitely higher than copper.  But I live in a urban area, maybe things are different in rural.

The only time I have had signal issues on my phone is when on the coast.
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c6em

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2016, 09:48:49 AM »

Rural indeed!
Earlier this year I was somewhere only a few hundred yards off a Welsh A road in a substantial(by welsh standards!) village and there is no reception indoors at all at any time.  There was marginal reception outside, and this is for a 2G signal only - there is no 3G let alone 4G at all.
I later confirmed this is indeed what the situation is from the coverage charts
It's all down to topography - and to solve it needs many more masts - any you know how that would go down with the population in general of the UK.


Even where I live in the UK again semi-rural  but 6 miles from a city mobile voice calls might connect or they might not. 3G might be described as barely functional at "quiet times" of the day - As for 4G: what's that!
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Chrysalis

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2016, 11:56:44 AM »

I do think there needs to be a USO for mobile coverage.

There was discussions on digitalspy about wifi calling, people were praising it in high numbers.  But I tried to point out to them, if mobile coverage was proper in their area then there would be no need for wifi calling, it doesnt solve the ultimate problem which is lack of mobile signal coverage.

So whilst I have never had signal issues aside from at the coast, I do know issues exist, and for a modern USO, there definitely needs to be an obligation for the mobile carriers to have blanket coverage regardless of cost, it doesnt need to be 3g/4g 2g is adequate for voice and sms.  That would surely need to be in place before a consideration to remove the copper voice obligations.

In my area, I get 4 bars on 4g in my bedroom, never mind outside and can push circa 70mbit download and 30mbit upload.  5 bars on 2g pretty much all the time.

When I was last in cromer, I couldnt sleep so watched some twitch streams using 4G probably about 100m away from the seafront.
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Weaver

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2016, 06:59:49 PM »

@c6em At least here up at my house we have good 3G from Three and EE amongst others. This is due to the altitude. There is no 4G. Unfortunately, there is no 3G signal inside my tiny stone house downstairs if away from the east windows. Further down the hill in the village there is little or no coverage, or at any rate, that used to be the case.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: When will copper legally be phased out?
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2016, 11:13:50 PM »

I used the word legally because I know there will be copper in the network for many decades to come.

As far as I know isn't there a legal obligation for BT / OR to maintain the copper lines for emergencies?

When do we think this legal obligation will be removed?

There might come a day when technology offers a viable alterantive to wired phone lines (be they copper or other conductors).  But there is nothing I am aware of on the horizon that would approach the coverage or reliability of wired lines.     Mobile networks, even if your local base station tower is at the bottom of your garden, come nowhere near the reliability of wired networks.

Reliability might not seem that important,  we are all accustomed to seeing a 'call failed' message on a mobile phone, we just hit redial. Sometimes 'redial' doesn't work either, so we try again after a minute, which usually but not always, works.   But now imagine that instead of getting 'call failed' when ordering a pizza, your house is on fire, or a loved the one needs an ambulance.... :(

And remember too, that sinking feeling, when you try to order the pizza and discover your mobile battery is flat.  And again, substitute 'ambulance' or 'fire engine' for 'pizza', it takes on a new importance. :-\
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