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Author Topic: Discussions on Breach of Copyright  (Read 4245 times)

Chunkers

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Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« on: February 21, 2016, 08:17:05 AM »

This, and subsequent, posts have been split off from the original thread.



I read these threads with interest and a little amazement at the bare-face cheek of people, I mean using an image off google images is one thing ..... but copying entire webpage(s) including text, images verbatim onto your own site and claiming it as your own content is pretty outrageous.

Some people.

Chunks
« Last Edit: February 21, 2016, 10:46:30 PM by burakkucat »
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Bowdon

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2016, 12:13:22 PM »

Is there a way to hardcode a webpage to a specific domain name?

I remember back in the day, old html, I used to do this. It took longer coding keep having to write out the full domain name. The downside for me at the time is if the url changed then I'd have to manually go in and change all the addresses. A friend had taught me after how to make the pages more flexible to be able to move them around. Which helped me. But I'm thinking doing that would make it easier for pages to be stolen.
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d2d4j

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2016, 12:33:19 PM »

Hi

I could be wrong as I do not the full setup, but from memory, a good stats program would usually show external links to pics etc from other websites. I know awstats does and smarterstats

I think most are lazy or just want to save bandwidth, so they just reference the pics

Watermark is the only true option though, I think

I myself, do quote and link to others, but always place a full URL link to the page/website and never take credit for anyone's work, which I used to ask first for permission, but every time was granted so long as full URL displayed prominently and credit given. Most who gave permission actually thanked me for asking and stated most do not, and do not give credit.

There is one more thing which you could implement but would only protect your rights, and that is to display full copywrite terms and conditions, which some of our clients utilise, but this in itself will not stop the content been used elsewhere, it could however, protect you against someone slightly changing your content and passing off as their own work

Many thanks

John
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2016, 09:55:11 PM »

It's all a bit of a legal minefield but as far as I am aware there is nothing much to be gained from making a copyright statement, or displaying the (c) symbol.   Copyright protection is always provided, regardless of whether ownership is stated.  Danger of displaying it would be, if you show it on 29 pages of a 30 page website but forget on the 30th, could the thief claim that he thought you didn't care about that page?

Similarly for trademarks, although some jurisdictions may make it cheaper to pursue a trangressor (costs automatically recovered) if the trademark is registered.   And while it is usually legal (if it is true) to say something like 'muddle is a trademark of 7LM' alongside the 'TM' symbol, it would not be legal to show the 'R' (for registered) trademark symbol, unles the trademark really had been registered. ::)

Anyway Kitz, sounds like you have a very good case.   Just so annoying that nowadays people, who probably wouldn't steal a mars bar from the sweet shop, feel it is OK to steal the hard work of other folks on the web. >:(
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Dray

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2016, 10:08:36 PM »

That's probably because copyright infringement isn't theft.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2016, 10:30:02 PM »

That's probably because copyright infringement isn't theft.

Technically you are right, whilst Copyright infringement is a civil offence, it does not automatically equate to the criminal offence that is theft.   But it might, there have been lengthy court cases to debate it .   But in terms of everyday usage of language, distinct from legal definitions, many people with good moral compass would view copyright as a form of theft.

Unfortunately, 'copyright is not theft' may be a mantra that rings in the ears, and justify the imorral acts,  of those who seek to unlawfully benefit from the hard work of others. :(
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d2d4j

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2016, 10:55:45 PM »

Hi

I'm sorry, I appear to have taken this slightly off topic, so I apologise but I was actually trying to infer the copyright to alter change or mask the original version, in order to portray as your own work, rather then give credit to the original author

I will pm anyone who wants to see this in action as it were, where copyright has been defined subject to gaining authority to do so from some of our client sites we host.

I'm sorry for taking this off subject

Many thanks

John
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2016, 11:24:04 PM »

@d2d4j

I hope it is not me to whom you were saying sorry, my post which followed yours was meant as a continuation, not a termination.

It's all a bit of a sore point with me because, as an App Developer, copyright protection doesn't help a lot.   Suppose I had invented the game of Chess (I didn't) and published it as an App.  Others could subsequently publish bootleg Apps of my Chess game, but without breaching copyright, as copyright doesn't protect ideas.   I'd could maybe get them for trade dress if theirs looked like mine, but I'm not American, or patent infringement, but I can't afford patents.   :(

Hence my remarks, it would be a better world if 'morality' just counted for more.   And an even better world if there were an easy way of punishing those who steal the work and ideas of others, regardless of legal terminology.   :)
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kitz

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2016, 12:36:20 AM »

I do have awstats, but its pretty useless for that sort of thing.  Circa 2 million hits per week on one hotlinked image would be like looking for a needle in a haystack.   You'd be surprised if you counted up just how many pages I do have.  The main site is and always has been much busier than the forum.

Also say for example this image.   Its used on help forums all over the place to show people what a master socket looks like.   I dont really mind that, its the websites that take whole pages and copyright it as their own.

Those that I go after usually take a whole page (or pages as has been the case in the past or more than one occasion) and host the images as their own. 

Hence why I use copyscape.
 

There's been at least 4 small yet at the time, fairly well known ISPs (such as Newnet/Vispa/Enta resellers) who have taken several pages of content and listed them as their own help files.   There's also been 2 router manufacturers who used the Interleaving page as their own (complete with images). 

Quote
that is to display full copywrite terms and conditions,

Each and every page displays the copyright notice (bottom left) and that links direct to all the correct legal jargon about copyright and intellectual property rights which spells everything out very clearly. 

The worst offenders are usually small one/two men business doing IT repairs and broadband etc.
Some try to ignore the notification thinking I wont take the next step, but I do, and theres been a couple of whole sites which have totally been pulled or blacklisted by google.  So warning if anyone is using it commercially then I will go after them. 

Quote
Most who gave permission actually thanked me for asking

Use it with permission with proper links and I will probably agree.   Theres lots and lots of sites where Ive given free permission to use content.  Im not in it to make money, but Im not going to stand by whilst commercial sites make a profit from my content and pretend its their own.     

If you were say an average bod and you saw my content on say TP-links webpages and then saw the same content on mine.  Who would you think had been doing the copying? Google automatically assumes the big corporate is the original author and will down rank me.  Thats why I have to protect it. 
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kitz

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2016, 12:42:20 AM »

As regards to the rest of the convo re is copyright/theft..   I believe its down to some ancient definition of theft is removal of item so that the other can no longer use it.   Hence why we have such things as copyright law or intellectual property rights which is usually used when it comes to websites.

Im shattered though and really need my bed.   So not even going to start looking up correct terminology. 
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loonylion

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2016, 01:12:33 AM »

As regards to the rest of the convo re is copyright/theft..   I believe its down to some ancient definition of theft is removal of item so that the other can no longer use it.

Yes, theft involves depriving the rightful owner of the property. Copying does not deprive the rightful owner and therefore is not theft in legal terms
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Chunkers

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2016, 04:18:36 AM »

The only vaguely similar thing to this which has happened to me is on my YouTube channel where someone copied large sections of one of my videos and re-edited them into their own video.  I had no idea and was PM'ed by another viewer who noticed.  When I challenged them they immediately removed the video, I guess I was lucky or they felt guilty about being caught,  but I always wondered what my 'rights' were.

If you create an image or video and publish it to the internet do you automatically have 'rights' to it?  I mean by posting it you are effectively releasing it into the public domain. 
Also, there don't seem to be any many good tools for searching for copies of your content as far as I know?

Just curious really, its annoying when you put work into something and someone else rips it off, hence my initial rather indignant post.

Chunks
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2016, 08:35:23 AM »

I am absolutely not qualified to give any kind of advice, or legally qualified in any way at all.   But as regards YouTube, my understanding (which may be wrong) is as follows...

YouTube (Google) being governed by US law and the DMCA, a powerful weapon is to serve a DMCA takedown notice.  It's a relatively easy process.   Google should then respond, without making judgement as to whether you are right, by taking down the offending material.   It is then up to the other party to notify Google that they intend to contest it, in which case the material would be reinstated while you slug it out with the other party - possibly in court.

https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/2807622?hl=en-GB

However, DMCA is a legal process.   Just by filling out the Google form, you are committing an irreversible act that could lead to an expensive US court battle, if the other party contends it.   You may also find your details published on websites of campaigners that oppose the DMCA.

We have served DMCA notices on a number of Apps and to date, have all ended well.

Repeat, I am not qualified to give legal advice, above is not intended to constitute legal advice.
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d2d4j

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Re: Discussions on Breach of Copyright
« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2016, 09:06:51 AM »

Hi

@sevenlayermuddle, sorry it was not aimed at you or anyone.

@kitz, sorry I was only offering suggestion, and did state I did not know your setup

The copyright I was trying to think off, which I have just looked up from a client site is creativecommons.org

I do understand though it would not stop anyone who wanted to use the content/pics etc

Lastly, I'm sorry, I very rarely look at Kitz on a PC, I use tapatalk 99% of the time, and only use a PC when I need to add a pic

Many thanks

John
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