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Author Topic: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn  (Read 29602 times)

aesmith

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2015, 07:21:11 PM »

It's not one of the parameters that A & A's "clueless" server harvests when it extracts info from modems remotely (somehow) to prepare me a report. It pulls out sync rates error counts hec errors, errored seconds - the usual stuff.
Off topic, but do they truly collect from the modem, which would imply it needs to be one that supports their choice of management protocol, or do they get it from the DSLAM?    "P
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Weaver

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2015, 08:15:12 PM »

@aesmith - my feeling is that perhaps I should say it's from the DSLAM, I just don't know.

I don't know whether one of the TR-xx protocols has this kind of errors and stats extraction capability, to suck data out of the modem.

A & A sometimes have entries in their database for what kind of modem or router the user has (can be wrong, out of data) but I don't know to what extent they employ TR-xx.

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Weaver

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2015, 08:39:20 PM »

@BlackSheep -
>  Long D-side line lengths have often been made up of a hybrid of higher poundage cables, such as 0.63 Cu and 0.9 Cu, which would bring your attenuation right down to a, 'within range' integer. [my emphasis]

* Is that your feeling then? High poundage done specially for me? Good local BTOR boys!

(I am assuming, forgive my ignorance, that poundage = good cross-sectional area = good kg m-1 )

> right down to a, 'within range' integer

Would that be something in the sixties, or seventies, or what? Given that I d/s sync at 2100 - 2400 on a good day.
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Black Sheep

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2015, 09:23:00 PM »

@BlackSheep -
>  Long D-side line lengths have often been made up of a hybrid of higher poundage cables, such as 0.63 Cu and 0.9 Cu, which would bring your attenuation right down to a, 'within range' integer. [my emphasis]

* Is that your feeling then? High poundage done specially for me? Good local BTOR boys!

(I am assuming, forgive my ignorance, that poundage = good cross-sectional area = good kg m-1 )

> right down to a, 'within range' integer

Would that be something in the sixties, or seventies, or what? Given that I d/s sync at 2100 - 2400 on a good day.

Absolutely correct re: poundage of the cable. I can only ever guess (unless you PM me your landline number - or DP and Exchange Name) what cable poundages are used. But I know on my semi-rural / semi-urban patch, that longer D-side runs would sometimes have sections of higher than average poundage cables put in the ground.

Definitely not in the 70's with a 2+Meg speed.  :)
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burakkucat

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #19 on: December 14, 2015, 10:36:58 PM »

Would that be something in the sixties, or seventies, or what? Given that I d/s sync at 2100 - 2400 on a good day.

Not having a low-flying raven within reach (to disembowel and to scatter the entrails in an aid to divination), I would guess that your true attenuation will be in the 65 - 68 dB range. (But I could be wrong.)
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Weaver

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2015, 03:28:08 AM »

@BlackSheep  - one of the three lines is 01471xxxxxx

[Moderator edited to obscure the above number.]
« Last Edit: December 15, 2015, 05:52:08 PM by burakkucat »
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Weaver

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #21 on: December 15, 2015, 03:45:11 AM »

@Burakkucat, @BlackSheep - thank you for your continued kindness, patience and wisdom in the face of so very many dopey questions. You have however helped me understand a lot.
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Weaver

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #22 on: December 15, 2015, 04:10:28 AM »

FYI, One of my neighbours, a couple of hundred metres or so further from civilisation than me, can sync at >2300.

I am the closest house to civilisation, northernmost, on the edge of the village of Heasta.

In fact, I did my neighbour's DSL installation, many, many years ago, so I was trying to use  the best of everything, SSFP, the best cabling and a Netgear DG384 just as I was using myself (eating your own dogfood).
« Last Edit: December 15, 2015, 04:18:25 AM by Weaver »
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Weaver

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #23 on: December 15, 2015, 04:31:19 AM »

I wonder if it is possible that they did some serious upgrade work around the time (2004) when ADSL was first made available.

Does / did this kind of thing happen - poundage” upgrades, in advance of DSL on ridiculously long lines?

I remember that before that some repairs were carried out on the moor but I have no clue as to the extent of them. Crackles on the line from time to time were rapidly fixed. A very bad section of cable lying on the ground was a continuous problem as vehicles constantly were driving over it in order to get to the local fank, which necessitated its burying in order to protect it from more and more damage to the insulation. At the time I was using a dialup modem which regularly managed to get 48 kbps and was extremely reliable, so the line was very clean even back then, free of his and clear on the higher audio frequencies at any rate.
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Black Sheep

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2015, 07:33:38 AM »

@BlackSheep  - one of the three lines is 01471xxxxxx

Got the relevant info to work on later. I'd personally have your number deleted by one of the Mods, or re-edit the post now, Weaver. Get back to you later, my friend.  :)

[Moderator edited to obscure the telephone number in the above quotation.]
« Last Edit: December 15, 2015, 05:53:27 PM by burakkucat »
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Black Sheep

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2015, 07:35:04 AM »

FYI, One of my neighbours, a couple of hundred metres or so further from civilisation than me, can sync at >2300.

I am the closest house to civilisation, northernmost, on the edge of the village of Heasta.

In fact, I did my neighbour's DSL installation, many, many years ago, so I was trying to use  the best of everything, SSFP, the best cabling and a Netgear DG384 just as I was using myself (eating your own dogfood).

The circuit number you gave me is also synching around that rate.  :)
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Black Sheep

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2015, 07:38:30 AM »

I wonder if it is possible that they did some serious upgrade work around the time (2004) when ADSL was first made available.

Does / did this kind of thing happen - poundage” upgrades, in advance of DSL on ridiculously long lines?

I remember that before that some repairs were carried out on the moor but I have no clue as to the extent of them. Crackles on the line from time to time were rapidly fixed. A very bad section of cable lying on the ground was a continuous problem as vehicles constantly were driving over it in order to get to the local fank, which necessitated its burying in order to protect it from more and more damage to the insulation. At the time I was using a dialup modem which regularly managed to get 48 kbps and was extremely reliable, so the line was very clean even back then, free of his and clear on the higher audio frequencies at any rate.

'Poundage upgrades' are really decisions made by the Planners. Broadband has always been touted as a 'Best efforts' product due o the various types and sizes of legacy cable in the network.
I would very much doubt anything in excess of 50-100mtrs of higher poundage cable would be 'upgraded', due to this policy and of course the cost. 
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burakkucat

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #27 on: December 15, 2015, 06:01:25 PM »

Interestingly, when that telephone number was put into the BT Broadband Availability Checker it indicated that WBC ADSL2+ is available.
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Black Sheep

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #28 on: December 15, 2015, 08:30:17 PM »

Hi Weaver ...... I've looked at the cable run and you are quite right in that it almost follows the course of the road all he way back to the Exchange. There's the odd deviation but nothing to shout about.

The good news for you and your neighbours, is that way back when, the GPO laid the majority of the underground cable in varying lengths of 0.6 and 0.9 Cu. This thicker poundage cable runs from your DP all the way back to a cable-joint, somewhere around the entrance to the covered reservoir / Water Treatment Works. This WTW is on your left as you drive back to Broadford, approx. 5.5Km from the DP.
The rest of the run is 0.5Cu from the cable-joint to the Exchange.

 :)
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Weaver

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Re: Ultra-long line beyond 63.5 dB attn
« Reply #29 on: December 15, 2015, 10:43:29 PM »

@BlackSheep @Burakkucat  - many many thanks for your kindness

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