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Author Topic: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)  (Read 4062 times)

AArdvark

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Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« on: September 11, 2015, 01:58:02 PM »

I have just run the option to roll back your machine to win 8.1 from Win10.
(Machine had been upgraded to Win10 by accident and following the instructions rolled back from the recovery options)

The machine came back OK ... or at least I thought so.
I have discovered that the Windows Update options have been 'Locked' so updates are automatic.
As administrator I am supposed to be able to change the options but it does not allow it.
I get a message saying that I need to be administrator when I am logged in as the only user who 'Does' have administrator rights.

I tried setting up a new user and making it Administrator .... still will not work.
I found a registry hack to allow the setting to be changes or permanently set as you want.
http://www.askvg.com/how-to-change-windows-update-settings-when-managed-or-disabled-by-system-administrator/

It works in terms of the setting is changed on the Windows Update page BUT then Windows Update will not run.

I am now in the process of rolling back the Win 8.1 machine to an earlier position via restore.

MS are now getting really on my nerves ....... this is beyond simple updates but forcing your choices of what and when you update, on an OS that has always allowed that freedom.
Win10 is bad enough but you know what you are getting.
Forcing it onto Win 7 /8 is unbelievable .... do the Corporate users get this as well ?

 >:( >:( >:( >:( :shoot: :shoot: :wall: :wall: :rain: :mushroomcloud: <<--- kitz, need one of these just for MS.
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AArdvark

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2015, 02:34:55 PM »

MS are the ultimate cowboys ...... (cannot type what I really think  >:( )

I have tried to do a restore on a machine that is working perfectly on win8.1 after running win10 recovery/restore back to your old config.

Lo and behold the restore fails with a unknown error.
The restore did not happen according to the message.
Yet, I now have the same problem kitz had with her Dad's laptop.
It reboot, tries to do a 'fix', fails, asks to be rebooted and repeats until hell freezes over ....... :mushroomcloud:  >:( >:( >:( >:(
I am now going to re-install from a kosher Win8.1 image and lock it down from MS's meddliing (Pesky Kids  ;D)
I will lose all the 'crap' installed for free on the original build (Lenovo All in 1, 22" very thick tablet form factor [IdeaCentre]) but have better control ..... I hope.

 
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kitz

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2015, 08:29:20 PM »

Quote
It reboot, tries to do a 'fix', fails, asks to be rebooted and repeats until hell freezes over

I sympathise as thats the cycle dads started at.

I got past that stage by forcing into safe mode.   Its not a simple F8 - See here.  I then managed to run repair correctly.  I found on a website that it sometimes needs doing 3 times..  which is what dads did and it takes ages to repair each time going in through safe mode.   It was at that stage I was offered to do a recovery from the partition and it looked like it would have, with loss of personal data.

As you know though, thats where it all went wrong with the boot loader and I now have a drive that wont boot at all and no option to recover.    Lappy is still sat borked until I get chance to look at it further.   Health issues have changed priorities and I have far too many other things to do first :(   I dont have a key as everything was on the recovery drive so its whether or not it will pick it up from the bios.

It may be worthwhile trying the safe mode x3 steps first if you can, at least that way you may be able to get back the Lenovo stuff.     
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AArdvark

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2015, 08:40:10 PM »

Quote
I dont have a key as everything was on the recovery drive so its whether or not it will pick it up from the bios.

@kitz,

I sent you everything you need to get the key.
Re-read the multiple messages I sent you web@ and PM  ;D
I know you have been occupied by other more important things, so easily forgot.
Just a gentle reminder. ;)
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AArdvark

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2015, 08:45:53 PM »

In term of running any Windows Recovery, it is usually not a good idea.
MS automatic recovery tools are not known for being 'great' and tend to work when they work and screw things up even more when they fail.
They tend to fail more often than work.
It is a good idea to not allow them to run if you can stop them.
You can them examine the disks before windows has 'played' with them.

Just my experience of working with Windows for many years.  ;D 
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kitz

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2015, 08:59:47 PM »

Yep.  I know thanks.   
So much to read and free time (& luck) has definitely not been on my side :(

You know the situation and why I cant do anything right now.  It was just a reminder to attempt the safe mode recovery x 3 first.

Windows 10 is just one other thing I could have done without.
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HPsauce

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2015, 09:06:52 PM »

which is what dads did and it takes ages to repair each time going in through safe mode.   It was at that stage I was offered to do a recovery from the partition and it looked like it would have, with loss of personal data.

As you know though, that's where it all went wrong with the boot loader and I now have a drive that wont boot at all and no option to recover.   
I don't want to cheer you up Kitz, but a friend of mine went on holiday last week leaving me his PC which was getting very messed up upgrading to W10.
It went through a very similar cycle of events finishing with a non-bootable non-recoverable hard disk.  >:D

And trust me, I tried every trick known to make that disk bootable!

In the end I put a new hard disk in (I had a suitable spare), reinstalled W7 (I had the keys and luckily the right media) and upgraded to W10 on a "clean" system.
Slight bonus in that the old system was x86 with 2GB ram but could take 4, so I added another 2GB and started off again as a 64-bit system.

I then had the boring task of connecting the old hard disk (still perfectly readable) and copying all the relevant data across.
My mate is back from holiday tomorrow, but straight into hospital for some circulatory surgery, so has a finishing off job to do when he gets out. It'll keep him busy during his recuperation when he can't drive or go out for a while.  ;)

Good luck sorting your dad's laptop out when you can, fingers crossed.  :cool:
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AArdvark

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2015, 09:12:19 PM »

Yep.  I know thanks.   
So much to read and free time (& luck) has definitely not been on my side :(

You know the situation and why I cant do anything right now.  It was just a reminder to attempt the safe mode recovery x 3 first.

Windows 10 is just one other thing I could have done without.
It has rebooted and run every variation on recovery 6-10 times ..... even when I did not want it.
Every time you do something and it fails it runs a 'fix' which does not work.
I have just completed a full disk backup using a Macrium PE boot USB.
(I created one on my win7 machine and made sure it was compatible with Win8.1)
I am now going to recover the machine back to the Original Lenovo build (Win 8.0).
I will then do the Win 8.1 update 'again' and lock down the automatic update option.
The fix I found which does not work after win10, does work in win8.x if it has not been broken by win10 beforehand  >:(
I can lock the options down so it cannot be overwritten.
i.e before any mystery update tries to make any changes.

I do not trust anything MS now sends as an update and will run a .reg file to restore the registry after any update.  ;D
I will now fight MS with their own tools if that is how they want to be.  >:( >:( ;D :D
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Chrysalis

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2015, 12:01:25 AM »

got a screenie?

Have a look at the policy editor to see if its been disabled in that.

I updated my laptop yesterday (as well as removed GWX as that has been left on there for months).

I first installed the updates via komms update checker as I always do (great app reccomend it).
I then ran windows update to get straggling updates as KUC doesnt include updates from things like silverlight and .net.

Guess what happened?

Usually it will pre select all critical updates and leave all recommended updates unticked (unless you enable the option to treat recommended same as critical).
Basically all the critical were unticked, and one update was ticked under recommended, windows 10.

So if I had auto updates enabled or blindly clicked proceed after running the check it would have been bumped to win10 and this was "after" I uninstalled GWX.

By the way there is more bad news about windows 10 (affects 8.1 also).

In older versions of consumer windows users could tweak delayed ack's (I disable I prefer responsiveness to saving upstream ack bandwidth), as well as some other tcp stuff.  In windows 10 microsoft moved these to a powershell tool get-tcp and set-tcp tools.  The system they using is similar to sysctl on linux so is quite good and they use a template system so one can switch between templates with ease, except one problem, its all locked down to read only on non server versions of the OS, switching templates as well as changing settings is on the server version only.  There is only very limited tuning possible on desktop OS, e.g. they let you change to a compat template to switch from CTCP to newreno, the RWIN auto tuning can still be tuned for the downstream but thats pretty much it.  The rest is locked down.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2015, 12:11:32 AM by Chrysalis »
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AArdvark

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Re: Recovering back from Win10 to Win 8.1 (MS still naughty)
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2015, 01:26:14 PM »

Too late for the screen shot.
I after great trouble getting the machine back to bootable win 8.1 ran the 'reset' option to restore factory install.
Win 8 + UEFI is the spawn of the devil.
What a great combination ........ NOT !!!!
I am now applying updates after locking down Windows update to not be automatic.
Then I will update to win 8.1.
What a pain :(
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