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Author Topic: BT Engineers using HST 3000  (Read 11279 times)

CrazyTeeka

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BT Engineers using HST 3000
« on: August 12, 2015, 07:52:33 AM »

What tests would a BT Engineer pick to check line meets SIN349 and what results would he/she consider normal?
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Weaver

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2015, 07:18:43 PM »

You need for example Burakkucat or Black Sheep et al.
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burakkucat

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2015, 10:07:32 PM »

I think (& it would need to be confirmed by B*Sheep (who is currently very busy)) that Openreach technicians' HHTs are loaded with a series of scripted tests and those tests are launched by the press of the appropriate buttons. The scripted tests basically return a "Pass" or "Fail" indication.

So it really depends upon which part of the flock your attending technician originates . . . the "jobsworth" side, the "little training & thrown into the deep-end" side or the "dark fleece" side.  ::)
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CrazyTeeka

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2015, 11:33:26 PM »

Example - POTS Close Out Test:

DC Current 38 mA: Pass (Thresholds: Pass >= 23 mA, Fail < 20 mA)
Loss Error: Unable to read signal
Power Infl. 75 dBr nc: Pass (Thresholds: Pass <= 80 dBr nc, Fail > 80 dBr nc)
Circuit Noise 10 dBr nc: Pass (Thresholds: Pass <= 20 dBr nc, Fail > 20 dBr nc)
Longitudinal Balance 63 dB: Pass (Thresholds: Pass >= 60 dB, Fail < 50 dB))

Loss Error fails because I don't know the special numbers test needs to dial for tones and quiet line, and its not a normal line anyway.
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burakkucat

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2015, 11:50:40 PM »

Example - POTS Close Out Test:

Yes, I believe that is one of the scripted tests. You appear to posses an ex-Beattie HST-3000c.  ;)

Quote
DC Current 38 mA: Pass (Thresholds: Pass >= 23 mA, Fail < 20 mA)
Loss Error: Unable to read signal
Power Infl. 75 dBr nc: Pass (Thresholds: Pass <= 80 dBr nc, Fail > 80 dBr nc)
Circuit Noise 10 dBr nc: Pass (Thresholds: Pass <= 20 dBr nc, Fail > 20 dBr nc)
Longitudinal Balance 63 dB: Pass (Thresholds: Pass >= 60 dB, Fail < 50 dB))

Isn't the "Longitudinal Balance" just the AC Balance of the circuit?  :-\

Quote
Loss Error fails because I don't know the special numbers test needs to dial for tones and quiet line, and its not a normal line anyway.

The "special numbers" required for the other menu options of 17070 and you have a DSL only circuit from A&A, I believe.  :)
« Last Edit: August 15, 2015, 11:52:48 PM by burakkucat »
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2015, 11:56:38 PM »

I believe there is another number BT engineers use for LLU lines, as 17070 doesn't provide any line test facilities on these circuits :)
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Weaver

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2015, 12:24:47 AM »

Some A&A copper pipes do bit of voice of some sort, either free incoming calls only or something. My lines have a dial tone and I think I can probably do 17070 for quiet line test (I'm different to CrazyTeeka who is not in the stone age).

According to A&A they decided they had to put some audio down the line because if Openreach engineers heard a silent pair they would just be inclined to steal it and give it to someone else in need thinking it was still unassigned.

I don't really understand what the story is with A&A and POTS.
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burakkucat

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2015, 12:56:59 AM »

According to A&A they decided they had to put some audio down the line because if Openreach engineers heard a silent pair they would just be inclined to steal it and give it to someone else in need thinking it was still unassigned.

<Cough!> (Another fur-ball.)

I shall stand up for all Openreach technicians and suggest that it is more likely to be operatives from Kelly Communications & M J Quinn who are guilty of such transgressions.  :thumbdown:
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2015, 12:59:22 AM »

I've had some very poor Openreach engineers so this wouldn't surprise me.
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Weaver

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2015, 01:00:43 AM »

Sorry about the furball. Kitty-Malt.

It was RevK’s opinion not mine, the thing about BT engineers. In his blog.
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Weaver

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2015, 01:02:29 AM »

>  operatives from Kelly Communications & M J Quinn who are guilty of such transgressions.

?
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2015, 01:23:25 AM »

>  operatives from Kelly Communications & M J Quinn who are guilty of such transgressions.

?

I'm also confused.

Like I say, there are some very poor Openreach engineers out there too.
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kitz

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2015, 02:23:05 AM »

Kellys & Quinns are Contractors :(
They were used a lot by BT for some of the so called more simple jobs particularly FTTC installs.   BT pays the Kelly/Quinn and they in turn pay their engineers a pittance.   You'd sigh with relief if you got a proper Openreach engineer and pray that it wasnt one of the contractors.   

I myself had a bad install with Quinns.    Ironically I'd spent the previous day drilling holes and setting everything up for the installation (which was ordered as a paid for NTE shift),  but he refused to do this saying it wasnt in his remit and instead backwired 20m over normal phone cable and converted what was an old LJU2 into a 'new' NTE which really wasnt.  Because Id done all the ground work, it was only when he'd gone an I was putting a drawer back in place that I realised he'd put the SSFP so that I couldn't open the drawer properly.     The SSFP was in a totally useless place and impractical for location for the modem.

He didn't have any proper tools and had to scrat around in his van to find a faceplate for my old NTE and even tried to nick my clarity NTE faceplate and would have done if I hadn't seen him try to walk off with it.    I complained to Plusnet because I'd specifically told them I needed a master socket shift  because there was no power at site of the original NTE... who confirmed that it had been processed as such and that he should have done so.    So...  they had to call out Openreach to do a proper job. 

Openreach engineer arrived, took one look at the impractical layout, rolled his eyes and started to do a proper NTE shift.  His face when he saw the back wire job was something else.  No word of a lie this is a direct quote taken from my log:

Quote
27 July 2013 11:17·
/snip/ this definitely needs sorting and Im afraid Im going to have to report what the contractor has done. VDSL should not have been provisioned like this

A very large portion of their work needed re-doing again by Openreach.  They're not used as much these days - no need most are now home installs and there's not so much the boom that there was in 2013/2014, but they are still around. 

TBH I dont much blame the contractors themselves.   They are paid a pittance per job, dont get proper training or tools and our often out of pocket with van expenses & travelling.   To make a living wage they had to do more jobs per day than OR engineers and because they were paid per job they wanted to be in and out asap (hence why he wouldnt do the master socket relocate).
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Weaver

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2015, 02:30:03 AM »

@Kitz, Burakkucat - God's teeth. Horrendous, hopefully they can't find their way up here.  :(
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kitz

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Re: BT Engineers using HST 3000
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2015, 02:34:44 AM »

btw - Quinns lifted some of my images from here and were displaying them here until I found out.

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As regards to the AAISP case and stealing of copper pairs.

Quote
UK ISP Andrews and Arnold (AAISP), Alex Bloor, has lifted the lid on the occurrence of “borrowed” copper pairs, where an already active broadband or phone line is disrupted by a telecoms engineer (e.g. a BTOpenreach contractor like Kelly Communications) who incorrectly takes over the line for use elsewhere.

Alex Bloor said:

“Put simply – and it isn’t just me that thinks this – [Kelly Communications] have a dreadful reputation in the industry. In our support department, scarcely a week goes by without several cases of lines mysteriously going down, only to later discover that an OpenReach engineer or a contractor to BT (such as Kelly) has “borrowed” our customer’s copper pair.





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