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[lcl00]

When I was on ADSL there were always certain modems that were known to operate particularly well on longer lines, certain DSLAMs, etc... with anything Broadcom based functioning particularly well, or old faithful, the 2wire 2700HGV.

With VDSL I've been using nothing other than the HG612 (with a multitude in reserve).  I've got a SR102 (actually about 7 of them), and a TG589vn v3, neither of which I've decided to mess with given that DLM already hates me and I don't want it to fall out with me even more.  Is the HG612 still the best for the job in terms of sync/stability, or are there some better options out there?  I like to maximize what's possible, so once G.INP eventually makes its way here, I might be a bit more adventurous with experimenting with them.  I'm on a Huawei cabinet, which will obviously have an impact upon a recommendation.

With a bit of reading around I've seen some people prefer certain options over the other, but I really only use these as a modem, so the only real requirements are line sync/stability, pfSense does the rest.

[Weaver]

I don't have an answer to your question, I'm afraid, as I don't have VDSL.

But I just wanted to sympathise, when testing or comparing modems DLM just soon comes to hate you unless you're incredibly, ludicrously slow and careful. This makes comparisons a pain and also inaccurate. This is why we need a DLM disable button, even if you like DSL and don't wish it were on a one-way ticket to Siberia, we all need to get it under control at times.

[kitz]

The problem is line variance.  We see some modem/routers perform brilliantly on some lines, then throw a wobbly on others which is why someone may be hesitant to recommend.

On the whole most of the Billions tend to do quite well.   Another modem/router that historically seemed to perform well on some troublesome lines is the Zyxel SBG3300 - it would have been a router I wouldn't mind trying myself, but at the time its price took it over my budget.  

[Weaver]

@Kitz - do you think there's a link between certain sweetheart pairings of DSLAM (MSAN?) chipset and modem chipset in CPE especially if they have common ancestry in design or manufacturing?

I often wondered if my old Netgear DG834v3 was such an outstanding and aggressive performer because my exchange has a TI DSLAM and the Netgear is TI.

[roseway]

Although there are plenty of people who will assert that pairing the DSLAM and modem by manufacturer gives the best performance, there's no real substantive evidence to support this. There's much more evidence that certain modems perform best on certain types of line, regardless of the DSLAM manufacturer.

The old DG834v3 was (in my opinion) an outstanding performer in its own right. It was famous for holding on to sync at very low SNRM values, and this was never linked to the type of DSLAM.

[Weaver]

@roseway -I hear you, and I never found an alternative chipset in any local DSLAM anyway, so I knew it would always remain feeble conjecture on my part.

[lcl00]

I might buy some of the Billion products.  The ZyXEL looks to be a bit out of my price range considering that it'll be used as a modem and nothing more.  While all of those additional features are probably worth the money, it would just be a waste given that I have already got a router that will easily outshine it.

Anybody got any experience of the Draytek devices?  I remember they always used to get a good name.

[mjgr33n]

I might buy some of the Billion products.  The ZyXEL looks to be a bit out of my price range considering that it'll be used as a modem and nothing more.  While all of those additional features are probably worth the money, it would just be a waste given that I have already got a router that will easily outshine it.

Anybody got any experience of the Draytek devices?  I remember they always used to get a good name.

Both good and bad press in regards to the Draytek 130 modem only VDSL device, it is Lantiq based which some don't like, they where slow to get a firmware update out that supported G.INP and Vectoring and as with all Lantiq devices, G.INP and Vectoring are not supported by the chipset natively but by the firmware.

That being said since the firmware got updated a lot of people said it performs outstandingly.

The other bad thing about Draytek is they lie about there specifications, a good example was in the past, they would state things like there routers supported 255 devices, but in fact they would only support 50 which when you configuring a network for a small sized company can be annoying given they make out that their products are business type ones.

So I never use them for companies any more, however a lot of people state there newer devices are awesome and I am not one to hold a grudge, so I will probably try there products again soon ))

Billion devices can be found very cheap and used as modem only quite easily so you could use your existing routers fine, same with Zyxel.

[lcl00]

The real question is whether or not these perform much better than a HG612.  I suppose the difference between a Billion 8800NL, a Sky SR102, a Huawei HG612 and a Technicolor TG589vn v3 really shouldn't be that much because they all use the same Broadcom chipset (correct me if I'm wrong). 

The Draytek does look quite interesting though... even though the price is a little steep for a modem only.  I remember when the Draytek 120 (I think) came out for ADSL, it received quite a lot of initial criticism for having dodgy firmware and not syncing as well as the Broadcom equivalents... I suppose that's leaving me a bit skeptical about the 130.  Although after it was fixed up, I think it did perform exceptionally well.

I guess it's going to be a matter of trying them all out (while avoiding the wrath of DLM) to see what they do... I suppose buying some of them used on eBay may be a feasible way of doing this.

[PhilipD]

Hi

I don't think you will find anything substantially better than the HG612.  I think overall there is much less variance on VDSL between modems because VDSL is new and lessons are largely learnt from interoperability issues from ADSL, plus the FTTC cabinets are more standardised regarding the kit, and on the whole line lengths are shorter and therefore suffer less random interference.

If you are on a very long line then you may see some differences, but as others have said, it's what works best with your line rather than one particular modem that always outperforms all others.

The ZyXEL 8924 has a built in common mode noise reject filter as close as you can get to the chip, I've seen over time that it is consistently 0.5 to 1db better in the SNR stakes than a HG612, but that could just be quirk of my line, and the VDSL face plates have common mode noise rejection filters in them anyway.

Regards

Phil

[lcl00]

I had actually thought this, and with people reporting large variances in sync, I was actually putting it down to individual devices.  For example, I had 3 different Be* modems back in the day (can't remember the model number), and they all synced differently to one another (one was consistently about 10% higher, and one 30% lower than the one in the middle).  It didn't matter which power adapter I used, and given that they were interoperable, I was able to play around with them to find what worked.  I had the same joy with the SR102s, which is why I had so many... Sky didn't seem to care whether or not they were sent back, so when one looked like it was going a bit dodgy I just asked for another.

I'm considering that there really isn't a huge difference, and people reporting differences in sync rate between certain devices actually are only unlucky, or lucky with a particular device being a good specimen against the other that may have been from a poor batch, possibly with a noisy power adapter.  The problem is, it's so very difficult to actually narrow down exactly what is making the sync/stability better!

[kitz]

I'm on an ECI cab, yet both the BCM6368 and 63168 out perform the VRX-268 chips when it comes to sync speeds.

The majority of lines Ive seen with a Zyxel VMG-8324 do seem to sync higher than with other modems.  For my own line 3.5Mbps more than the HG612 and 7Mbps more than the VRX-268 based modems. Ive seen some claims of >10Mbps more, but conversely there have been a couple of lines who say it shows more ErrSecs.   Whether this is down to the line being pushed to its limits or not I dont know..  but the caveat is there.  Conversly the lantiq chips perhaps dont give as much sync, but they do seem to be rock steady.

Personally Im with roseway on I dont think matching dslam chipsets makes much difference these days.  My own opinion its more down the the type of noise that the line experiences and how the modem handles it. 
I had a line fault last year which was generating lots of noise.  I put the HG612 back on but it was worse so soon I swapped back to my VMG8324.  The quite recent discovery of the filter near the chip could have had something to do with this... or it may not 

[lcl00]

Has the VMG8324 been discontinued?  I can't seem to find it on sale anywhere, apart from unusual places with quite limited numbers.

If so, what is its replacement?

[konrado5]

Netgear DGND3700v2 with BCM6362 chipset is better than D-Link DSL-2740B with BCM6358 chipset. Synchronization rate is 200-300 kbps higher for downstream and 32 kbps higher on upstream. Attenuation in winter 23.0/15.3 dB instead 24.0/14.4 dB.

Best regards
konrado5

[GigabitEthernet]

Has the VMG8324 been discontinued?  I can't seem to find it on sale anywhere, apart from unusual places with quite limited numbers.

Here