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Author Topic: FTTC woes  (Read 64345 times)

kitz

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #30 on: June 01, 2015, 07:37:05 PM »

hmmm  Ive just had a quick look at your graphs - not a pretty sight.    What's your internal wiring like irrc didnt you need the master socket moving or something but ended up with self install?   Is there a long run of extension cable..  I'll agree with b*cat theres a lot of what looks like RF ingress.
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #31 on: June 01, 2015, 08:04:18 PM »

We've got an NTE5 with MK3 faceplate, so the extensions are all filtered. The HG612 goes directly into that: the modem cable is very short and I have changed it more than once with no change :(
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lf2k

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #32 on: June 02, 2015, 06:40:57 AM »

@Alec - so you're back on interleaved (quelle surprise) and the CRCs have all but been eliminated...

Looking at your SNRM graph now shows an interesting pattern (ignoring the rapidly changing aspect) - an exaggerated dip over night.

Any progress on the line fault?  Since Kitz and BC have pointed out "RF ingress", have you done the AM radio trick to look for local interference?

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GigabitEthernet

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #33 on: June 02, 2015, 07:32:48 AM »

We had REIN issues on ADSL and Openreach got their REIN team involved. There was quite a lot of interference at one point but I believe they solved the issue.

That was only a year or so ago so I wouldn't think things would change that much in that time? We're in a fairly rural area with nothing that would cause interference between us and the cabinet, I believe.

I also believe we're the only live line on our cabinet thus far.
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #34 on: June 02, 2015, 08:32:48 AM »

Got a reply back from the TalkTalk OCEs today, not good news :(

Quote
I'm sorry for the delay. I've re-run the line test which is now clear and the connection looks stable. The line is also in sync at 44.9mb which looks good in relation to the predicted speed for the line.
 
I can't see any recent speed test results. Could you run some more speed tests in a wired state so we can see how your speeds compare. Are you also using the Super Router or the BTOR modem and separate router?

For reference, the TalkTalk Community thread is located here.

Edit:

Looking at other peoples' graphs (this cannot be healthy :lol:) it seems to be that the SNRM on my line is dropping a lot more than anyone else's, at night. Now I understand that it would be considered normal for this to happen but surely it dropping so much on my line may further indicate a poor AC balance which bk* alluded to before?
« Last Edit: June 02, 2015, 08:48:56 AM by AlecR »
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jid

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #35 on: June 02, 2015, 12:46:51 PM »

As I expected, they won't do anything unless a line test fails :no:

However, the line does not look at all healthy, B*cat does point out the dip overnight, does indicate some form of possible interference.

REIN could be an issue, as for AC balance, I assume a line test picks this up if it were a problem? Although B*cat would have to correct me if I'm wrong on this as I'm not sure :)
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #36 on: June 02, 2015, 02:47:29 PM »

The weird thing is TalkTalk's first line test said there was a fault. Literally nothing changed in two days so I don't understand why it's now coming back clear.
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burakkucat

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #37 on: June 02, 2015, 04:51:18 PM »

The weird thing is TalkTalk's first line test said there was a fault. Literally nothing changed in two days so I don't understand why it's now coming back clear.

An intermittent line fault would do just that. Test the circuit on one day: "Ah, yes, there's a fault", test the circuit two days later: "I do not see a fault. LTOK".
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burakkucat

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #38 on: June 02, 2015, 05:10:25 PM »

. . . as for AC balance, I assume a line test picks this up if it were a problem? Although B*cat would have to correct me if I'm wrong on this as I'm not sure :)

As xDSL operates in differential mode then part of the technique to prevent spurious RF ingress is to ensure that the pair of wires (of which the circuit comprises) is electrically balanced. The test for AC balance is one of the menu options on an Openreach technician's HHT.

The fundamental faults for which Alec could check are (in no particular order) --
  • All internal wiring is with CW1308 specification cable (or greater).
  • All circuits are using twisted pairs and that there are no split legs.
  • There are no "dead ended" cables that have been left connected.
  • There are no "cross links" between two separate branches of the wiring.
  • That the service feed to the NTE5/A does not include any non-twisted cable, such as the figure-of-eight cross-section cable which was typically installed in the 1960s - 1970s.
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #39 on: June 02, 2015, 07:11:40 PM »

We can tick off any extension problems surely as we're connected directly to the MK3 faceplate via a short DSL cable?

The line to the NTE5/A was only replaced five or so years ago so I don't think it will contain any non-twisted cable?
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #40 on: June 03, 2015, 12:53:44 PM »

No reply from TalkTalk today, thus far.

I wonder if I can force through an engineer visit...
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burakkucat

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #41 on: June 03, 2015, 02:22:35 PM »

We can tick off any extension problems surely as we're connected directly to the MK3 faceplate via a short DSL cable?

The line to the NTE5/A was only replaced five or so years ago so I don't think it will contain any non-twisted cable?

Not wishing to be provocative but both of your above questions are based on assumptions. How difficult would it be for you to actually check?

You have a Mk 3 SSFP fitted at the NTE5/A. As a temporary test, power down the modem, remove the lower front plate of the NTE5/A to disconnect all extension wiring and connect a wired telephone to the socket so exposed. (The socket in the SSFP.) Once 30 minutes have elapsed since the time that the modem was powered off, then re-energise it. Harvest a set of snapshot graphs (Bit loading, Hlog, QLN & SNR).

Whilst waiting for the 30 minutes to expire, check that each and every telephone extension socket is not "live". Look to see if there are any long forgotten junction boxes. If your service is an aerial feed then check (with binoculars) that the drop from the pole-top DP to the premises is contiguous. Check where it runs down the exterior of the building for any joins.

You will now know the condition of the wiring, within and without.  :)
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #42 on: June 03, 2015, 04:08:10 PM »

Quote
As the sync speed is within the predicted speeds, we are unable to raise a slow sync speed fault to BT Openreach.
 
We can send a replacement router (Super Router) to see how the connection compares. Would you like us to arrange this?

???
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jid

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #43 on: June 04, 2015, 12:04:47 AM »

Quote
As the sync speed is within the predicted speeds, we are unable to raise a slow sync speed fault to BT Openreach.
 
We can send a replacement router (Super Router) to see how the connection compares. Would you like us to arrange this?

???

As i expected  :(
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GigabitEthernet

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Re: FTTC woes
« Reply #44 on: June 04, 2015, 10:07:22 AM »

Looks like upstream interleaving has been enabled but the SNRM has plummeted...
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