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Author Topic: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.  (Read 266282 times)

jid

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #405 on: May 27, 2015, 10:38:04 PM »

Are you & ip75 both using HG612 modems or maybe a Billion or ZyXel?

HG612 with wolfy's latest firmware I'm using

Hmm.

I might see something in due course via my HG612 then.

I have to say that some of BTOR's statements can be a little ambiguous at times, at least for us EUs.

Kitz's theory may be right though, the line may have simply not needed it, the resync was the 25th, and the roll out for the new DLM profiles was the 26th wasn't it?
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Jamie

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ip75

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #406 on: May 27, 2015, 10:38:52 PM »

HG612 here too.
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kitz

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #407 on: May 27, 2015, 10:39:30 PM »

I'm afraid I can't really answer that, unless it only affects those modems such as ECI, HH5A etc. that aren't G.INP capable on the upstream direction.

But it was posted by a member that a HG612 modem on a Huawei cabinet lost G.INP on their upstream I can't verify this as there is nothing to backup the claim  :(

Perhaps it didn't need it?
Could be, but now my upstream ES count is increasing, so seems G.INP was helping ???

I dont know for certain.... 
But you are still below the 300 MTBE limit which DLM considers ok?
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jid

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #408 on: May 27, 2015, 10:41:16 PM »


I dont know for certain.... 
But you are still below the 300 MTBE limit which DLM considers ok?

Don't know, but either way, upstream isn't of a concern to me so I didn't think it was a major issue :-[

The resync did improve a few things, the SNR margin increased a bit downstream, pings etc all remained the same though
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Jamie

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kitz

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #409 on: May 27, 2015, 10:51:14 PM »

Thanks, kitz.

I hoped you would spot my question & re-confirm what you had mentioned previously.

Actually I should clarify on that and say "profiles for non ReTx modems" which is slightly more correct.   I'll change my post for the sake of clarity.   
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NewtronStar

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #410 on: May 27, 2015, 10:55:34 PM »

Don't know, but either way, upstream isn't of a concern to me so I didn't think it was a major issue :-[

I would not dismiss your upstream errors as it also part of the overall MTBE count  ;)
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jid

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #411 on: May 27, 2015, 10:57:34 PM »

Don't know, but either way, upstream isn't of a concern to me so I didn't think it was a major issue :-[

I would not dismiss your upstream errors as it also part of the overall MTBE count  ;)

It only affects upstream profiling though doesn't it? Next step should be upstream G.INP technically if we assume DLM removed G.INP up if it didn't need it.
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Jamie

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kitz

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #412 on: May 27, 2015, 11:02:42 PM »

I have to say that some of BTOR's statements can be a little ambiguous at times, at least for us EUs.

Your'e not wrong there.   The main reason why Im not quoting all the info I do have and blindly say "Openreach says blah blah blah" because some of it IMHO simply raises more questions, so Im just trying to interpret what info I get and ask for further clarification.    We all know that the statement released to TBB was wrong about the ECI modems, and also the info given to ISPr also raised more questions as it didnt appear to be what we were seeing in the field.

I wish I could say I knew all the answers but I dont :/
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kitz

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #413 on: May 27, 2015, 11:04:18 PM »

Don't know, but either way, upstream isn't of a concern to me so I didn't think it was a major issue :-[

I would not dismiss your upstream errors as it also part of the overall MTBE count  ;)

But they are counted separately.   The upstream and downstream are configured independently.
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NewtronStar

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #414 on: May 27, 2015, 11:10:31 PM »

It only affects upstream profiling though doesn't it? Next step should be upstream G.INP technically if we assume DLM removed G.INP up if it didn't need it.

Yes if the Upstream is quiet (low noise) then fastpath is a better option than the US being stuck on the G.INP profile as long as it can move from one to the other on the fly when the upstream incounters longer periods of noise it will work very well indeed.
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Dray

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #415 on: May 27, 2015, 11:11:44 PM »

As I understand it, they are removing the upstream G.Inp in order to test that scenario.
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kitz

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #416 on: May 27, 2015, 11:17:41 PM »

It only affects upstream profiling though doesn't it? Next step should be upstream G.INP technically if we assume DLM removed G.INP up if it didn't need it.

I honestly dont know the answer to that, but we know on the old system that INP was one of the parameters that could be configured to control the depth of interleaving and amount of error correction.  From the profile params above it shows that there is a specific param for RTX_Mode, which I suppose like INP could be 0 or 1 or whatever.  Without knowing what the options are for that parameter Ive no idea.. other than it does seem to be a configurable option.    I dont even know if its 0 = Off, 1 = On  or like with INP it has various numbers which defines a level - ie 3= low etc.    I know nothing about the available parameters, so your guess on that is as good as mine. :(
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ktz392837

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #417 on: May 27, 2015, 11:26:54 PM »

My line is on the G.INP ECI modem trial and I just put a Billion 8800NL on instead so I could see what the DLM was doing. At the moment there is only G.INP on the downstream, I'll leave the Billion connected and see what happens as it does support it on the upstream.
This is interesting news. 

When you say Ginp on the downstream is that to the end user - e.g the 80 bit of the 80/20 connection?

There was talk the ECI cabs could only do Gimp in one direction - at least if it the end users download that makes more sense than the end users upload.
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NewtronStar

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #418 on: May 27, 2015, 11:28:12 PM »

But they are counted separately.   The upstream and downstream are configured independently.

But the MTBE threshold will be much lower on the upstream than it is on the downstream and don't know how the DLM reacts when the US errored second has reached it's limited but it should not be any different than hitting 2880 ES or (2000 ES on EE) over a 24 hour period  :(
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kitz

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Re: G.INP - BT rollout 2015.
« Reply #419 on: May 27, 2015, 11:31:25 PM »

As I understand it, they are removing the upstream G.Inp in order to test that scenario.

The testing has seen various situations and since most of those that have been testing are using HH5A and ECI modems, we dont really know whats been going on because none of those modems produce proper stats.    We've seen some lines have interleaving removed yet they still must have error correction applied.  What really would have been the most informative is for one of the testers on the trials to be using a HG612 usings Asbo f/w then we would have some decent stats.   

Now we will have to wait until its rolled out to all cabs and BE has kindly offered to roll back to Asbo f/w once he knows his cab has had the new changes applied.   Until then we wont know much for sure.   Im very dubious about results coming in from over at places such as the BT forums who are simply saying 'Yes its improved', but when you look closer its improved the latency but theyve not recovered the lost sync... or they dont have true before and after stats to compare with.   There's only one HH5A tester that I was likely to believe would be a true representation, but said person is away on holiday atm.   We are also not sure whats going on with the HH5A's either, they have had some f/w update and Im not even sure if they like the TPlink have the possibility for a proper modem fix.  It would appear there is no scope for upgrade on the ECI's which is why they are making the DLM config changes.

I'm aware theres a lot of ifs and maybes, but I'd much rather say Im unsure rather than blurt out something that later turns out to be false.   
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