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Author Topic: New BT Bell Wire Filter  (Read 22557 times)

soms

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New BT Bell Wire Filter
« on: January 10, 2008, 11:04:40 AM »

Hi all,

Just a little heads up on a development you may or may not be aware of.

All new BT NTE5 units (which are now Openreach branded) include a bell wire filter in the standard faceplate to help reduce interference being induced onto the line and causing problems with ADSL. Of course it is still a great idea to use an ADSL adaptor faceplate if it suites you.

This development appears to aimed at reducing the number of ADSL faults reported as a result of noise on the line. As you can imagine the majority of home ADSL installations are simply plugged into existing wiring with no thought for how it works.

In theory all field engineers who deal with line work or stuff like Vision should have them and use them when required. In the case of openreach this will  be for any new analogue exchange lines or replacement lineboxes.

If you can't fit an ADSL adaptor to your master socket and you have an engineer out faulting your broadband problems, you might want to ask him/her to replace the master socket with a new one including the new front plate.

I have known about this for a good few weeks but didn't know if it was in the public domain or not. It clearly is now as I typed it into google and found relevant results.

The faceplate is also available to engineers as a separate item. I have attached a pic which shows how to tell the difference.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2008, 11:40:45 AM by soms »
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jaydog

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2008, 11:38:28 AM »

isnt it much easier to just snip the bell ring wire like i did?!
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soms

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2008, 11:43:18 AM »

Yes perhaps but this saves having to do that. You won't have to worry about reconnecting anything if you move house and the new occupiers won't be puzzled at why their old phones won't ring (most new phones being 2-wire and all that).
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jaydog

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2008, 11:49:41 AM »

one of those new plates measns you have to rewire everything behind the socket though, as all wires are attatched to the back of the faceplate!
if i move, il just claim i know nothing about the bell wire, new installations dont install the wire anyway.
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soms

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2008, 02:55:26 PM »

Quote
one of those new plates measns you have to rewire everything behind the socket though, as all wires are attatched to the back of the faceplate

In a standard daisy-chain installation you would only have four wires from one cable attached to it and to guarantee a proper termination you should avoid having more than two wires connected to each of the terminals. I'm not sure how removing and replacing these few connections qualifies as a rewire?
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jaydog

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2008, 06:32:25 PM »

just snip the bell wire, 60 second job
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Astral

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2008, 06:39:17 PM »

Quote
just snip the bell wire, 60 second job

It's the persuading someone to do it that takes the time. ;)
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jaydog

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2008, 06:42:37 PM »

lol i know, but its not a case of "oh snip it, itl be good!" id rather snip than replace the faceplate.

lets face it, a new faceplate wont have an effect if the ringwire is already snipped.
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roseway

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2008, 07:29:28 PM »

>> lets face it, a new faceplate wont have an effect if the ringwire is already snipped.

Well yes, it probably will. Snipping the ring wire removes that possible source of interference pickup, but the remaining extension wiring can pick up interference itself. Ideally the extension wiring would be proper twisted-pair cable, which would minimise interference pickup, but this is rarely the case - extension wiring is usually done with untwisted cable (which is cheaper). A filtered faceplate completely isolates the extension wiring from the ADSL signal, and gives a result which is effectively the same as plugging into the test socket.
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  Eric

soms

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2008, 07:54:06 PM »

Quote
Snipping the ring wire removes that possible source of interference pickup, but the remaining extension wiring can pick up interference itself. Ideally the extension wiring would be proper twisted-pair cable, which would minimise interference pickup, but this is rarely the case - extension wiring is usually done with untwisted cable (which is cheaper). A filtered faceplate completely isolates the extension wiring from the ADSL signal, and gives a result which is effectively the same as plugging into the test socket.

I agree with roseway, an ADSL adaptor which seperates the ADSL before any extension wiring is involved is certainly this is the best possible way of doing things.

My point was that this modification has been designed for the average premises where people are not aware of what makes broadband work and not work and where the customer uses their ADSL equipment at an extension point. Being included with the NTE5 it will be fitted by default in the future with the hope of reducing ADSL fault reports the likes of which can be cured by disconnecting the ring wire.

With regards to twisted pair extension cable, all the proper telephone cable I have ever seen and used for hardwired extensions has been twisted,  I reckon it must be part of the CW1308 specification. It is often commented how similar CW1308 is to category 3 ethernet cable.

Of course use cat 5 or cat 6 if you can be it is most unsightly if surface mounting is the only way to run it in. Another choice to make for cat 5/6 is whether to use plain UTP or FTP/STP screened cable for maximum resilience to sources of interference.

The classic example of un-twisted cable is I see quite a lot of friends who use flat extension leads/kits to get their router to go where they want it.
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setecio

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2008, 11:11:33 PM »

Quote
Another choice to make for cat 5/6 is whether to use plain UTP or FTP/STP screened cable for maximum resilience to sources of interference.


Last time I looked into STP cable, I got the impression it was more likely to cause more problems than cure things .... it had to be grounded correctly and there were other issues .... forgive me if this isn't correct but I got the impression it was too complicated.

These links were in another thread to new adsl filtered faceplates with the ability to punch down adsl extensions as well as telephone extension
http://www.clarity.it/xcart/product.php?productid=16134&cat=262&page=1
http://www.clarity.it/telecoms/adsl_faceplate_mod.htm
http://www.adslnation.com/phpapps/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=24&products_id=90

I've read you get poor and good quality adsl filters, but adsl filtered face plates only seem to be supplied by a few companies and are 10-15, is is safe to say they will all be good quality, well espc from the companies above?
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roseway

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2008, 07:13:06 AM »

I think it's generally accepted that the Clarity and ADSLNation products are good quality. I use a Clarity one myself, and it certainly made a difference when I installed it.
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  Eric

soms

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2008, 07:20:59 AM »

Quote
've read you get poor and good quality adsl filters, but adsl filtered face plates only seem to be supplied by a few companies and are 10-15, is is safe to say they will all be good quality, well espc from the companies above?

The one sold by Clarity is based on the design used by BT, it is identical but features a different terminal arrangement on the back, notably this allows you the option to "pass through" the ADSL if you please on a dedicated set pair of wires.

 ADSL nation claim their ADSL faceplate to be of a very high standard, better than all the available plug in ADSL filters.

I am not a fan of the sockets for extension points with built in splitters though. One of the main reasons being the sturdiness - try and fit one in a flush wall box without it bending horribly. I one of these people who doesn't over tighten things but it just can't be avoided with products like those. Crabtree secondary sockets all the way.

Also I didn't know STP cable ought to be grounded but you might well be right.
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setecio

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2008, 11:36:24 AM »

People who have house alarms fitted to the telephone wire have to get the alarm company in to install a broadband filter. How would they ever know if those were cheap or expensive filters .... I could see situations where a poor quality filter fitted on the alarm system could cause adsl connection problems and never be detected as the problem.

Does anyone know if alarm adsl filters are usually specialist high quality devices ?

I presume that adsl filters on these sort of alarms are necessary, in the same way that every telephone needs to be filtered ?
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mr_chris

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Re: New BT Bell Wire Filter
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2008, 04:38:03 PM »

I presume that adsl filters on these sort of alarms are necessary, in the same way that every telephone needs to be filtered ?

Yes, they are necessary - and a good question actually. You might be onto something there...
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Chris
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