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Author Topic: why transfer to fibre?  (Read 5800 times)

Black Sheep

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2012, 07:43:50 PM »

Im also unsure what to do, FTTC came here a few weeks ago.

The geekiness in me wants it..  but just right now I dont know if I can justify the additional cost.  Im also concerned about the wiring because I dont have any power sockets in the hall where my NTE5 is.   Ideally I'd want the modem in my PC room (upstairs) and not sure how an engineer would act on this since the copper pair is UG and comes straight up and then through the hall wall at the side of the house.

My existing 21 Mb down and 2.6 up meets most my existing requirements quite nicely. The vast majority of my bandwidth is streaming which works fine.  The additional upstream sure would come in handy when working on this site though.

Where is the Hub now, Kitz ?? It's obviously not at the NTE position, and if it's in your PC room now, there must be a metallic path facility going up there ??
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smucat

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2012, 07:46:49 PM »

@ Kitz

Geekiness will out 8)

You have to experience and "live the BT values" at first paw, in order to fully empathise with your fellow Kitizens :-\

Personally, I think the Openreach install would be preferable to waiting until a self-install solution is available (with due respect to B*cat). And the Kudos of being an early adopter is too much temptation :angel:

It would, of course be useful to hear of the 'best case' solutions...

Disclaimer: Other 'values' are available.
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smucat

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2012, 08:28:44 PM »

Back off my soap-box, and to answer your question smucat, we would have just wired from outside to a convenient point in which to enetr the house and 'pick up' the internal wiring. Yes, you would definitely have been left with a phone service. ;D 

I never really doubted that, but sometimes I do enjoy playing devil's advocate >:D to see what the response would be. I don't know the H & S rules and I was genuinely a little surprised that lofts are so classified when you guys are still made to climb poles. I guess the poles are 'controlled known conditions' whereas Joe Public's loft is an unknown, unquantifiable risk.
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Black Sheep

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2012, 08:44:50 PM »

Pretty much spot-on smucat.  ;)

TBH, common-sense and a local risk assessment, should ensure the best engineering method is adopted !! If the attic/loft isn't boarded out, and has low ambient lighting, then only a fool would attempt to crawl through it. Vice-versa, and there wouldn't be a problem. :)

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Black Sheep

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2012, 08:55:42 PM »

Just an indication of potential hazards, which make it BT's policy not to enter unboarded loft spaces. Apologies for going on, just trying to emphasise our guidance documents.  :)

Falls from loft
Moving objects in loft to gain safe access
COSHH - Asbestos, biological hazards, vermin, insects, birds etc.
Confined Space - Asphyxiation
Electric Shock - Contact with faulty equipment / cables
Defective Building Structure
Collisions in loft - head injuries, poor lighting
Fire - electrical fires, flammable materials in loft
Temperature - Extremes of temperature
Loft Atmosphere - Airborne dust and fibre particles
Lighting - poor lighting levels
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TwitDotTv

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2012, 02:54:26 PM »

Im also concerned about the wiring because I dont have any power sockets in the hall where my NTE5 is.   Ideally I'd want the modem in my PC room (upstairs) and not sure how an engineer would act on this since the copper pair is UG and comes straight up and then through the hall wall at the side of the house.

Very similiar situation for me in that my NTE5 is in the hallwall far away from any electrical sockets. It is, however, less than a metre away from the tiny cupboard that stores gas and electricity meters along with the fusebox for the premises.

When I eventually order fibre, I will try and see if I can just run an electrical extension on the day of the install and tell the engineer that I will have an electrician round later to do something more permanent with the supply.
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Chrysalis

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #21 on: December 25, 2012, 02:43:38 PM »

in my case it was a clearcut choice.

I have a very bad E-side cable which wreacked havoc on adsl even when it had very high noise margins set.  Also to me the 5-6mbit sync I could obtain on adsl would be a bit too limiting eg. hd content.

I was on virgin media for a while which done away with the adsl issues but the problem with virgin media cable si the extreme overselling they do and the affects of their congestion can be worse than a poor adsl line.

So in came vdsl2, whilst I am somehat annoyed I have lost over 30% of my attainable speed in 2 weeks the resulting 71mbit down 20mbit up which is very stable so far is currently far superior to both previous solutions.  I do suspect tho I will end up lower than my estimated speed.
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Alex Atkin UK

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #22 on: January 11, 2013, 02:20:01 AM »

Going back onto the subject of self-install, its really not all its cracked up to be in my experience.

When I moved to Be I was left without a phone line for several days as due to it being self-install, nobody checks the line works at the customers premises after doing the jumpering at the exchange.  I was told the problem was a faulty tie-pair, so it seems nobody bothered to even check it was working where it leaves the exchange either.

Then when I moved to Origin Broadband on Digital Region EXACTLY the same thing happened again, except this time of course the error was at the street cabinet.

I must point out that from what I can gather the engineer did exactly as described on the job sheet.  The problem is that did not factor in the potential for the instructions being wrong about which jumper block my line was fitted at.

So Wednesday I was disconnected first thing in the morning, by Thursday evening both me and my ISP knew my E side had been incorrectly jumpered to someone elses house as they had tried calling my number and left a message on the persons answering machine.  Of course neither of us could get that message across to Openreach due to the amount of bureaucracy between the parties involved. 

By Saturday the other persons line had been repaired, but mine was left hanging (turns out literally, my line had been completely disconnected and left loose in the cabinet) until Monday.

Granted the last case was made over-complicated due to the shared architecture, but the biggest delays was Openreach saying it must be Digital Regions cabinet that was faulty.  Openreach outright refused to come out and double check it wasn't their fault, Digital Region actually sent out engineers to their cabinet TWICE on connection day to prove everything was working there.

In both of these cases if they had been engineer installs, the problems would have been fixed in minutes rather than days as the engineer would have found there was a problem immediately.
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Black Sheep

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #23 on: January 11, 2013, 07:37:08 AM »

Going back onto the subject of self-install, its really not all its cracked up to be in my experience.

When I moved to Be I was left without a phone line for several days as due to it being self-install, nobody checks the line works at the customers premises after doing the jumpering at the exchange.  I was told the problem was a faulty tie-pair, so it seems nobody bothered to even check it was working where it leaves the exchange either.

Then when I moved to Origin Broadband on Digital Region EXACTLY the same thing happened again, except this time of course the error was at the street cabinet.

I must point out that from what I can gather the engineer did exactly as described on the job sheet.  The problem is that did not factor in the potential for the instructions being wrong about which jumper block my line was fitted at.

So Wednesday I was disconnected first thing in the morning, by Thursday evening both me and my ISP knew my E side had been incorrectly jumpered to someone elses house as they had tried calling my number and left a message on the persons answering machine.  Of course neither of us could get that message across to Openreach due to the amount of bureaucracy between the parties involved. 

By Saturday the other persons line had been repaired, but mine was left hanging (turns out literally, my line had been completely disconnected and left loose in the cabinet) until Monday.

Granted the last case was made over-complicated due to the shared architecture, but the biggest delays was Openreach saying it must be Digital Regions cabinet that was faulty.  Openreach outright refused to come out and double check it wasn't their fault, Digital Region actually sent out engineers to their cabinet TWICE on connection day to prove everything was working there.

In both of these cases if they had been engineer installs, the problems would have been fixed in minutes rather than days as the engineer would have found there was a problem immediately.

For info.

The problems with migrating to a different CP/ISP is that when the order is being progressed by your new provider, it comes to Openreach and a routing (the pair of wires from the Exchange to the EU's premises) is robotically calculated. Obviously, it 'sees' the existing routing you are on as a 'worker', due to you still being connected with your current provider, so it has to offer up a different routing. Ergo, there will always be engineering work required to get the DT/DSL services to your premises.

Also, when the Exchange work is done, the 'Frames engineer' has to carry out a line test (Eclipse/Fast Test), it is mandatory. The obvious problem is that the new routing could very easily be connected to a master socket in an empty property, or in a premises that has moved to Virgin Media but still has the old BT master socket intact. Therefore, the test result will show as LTOK (Line tests ok).

Hope this makes sense ?
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CurlyWhirly

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Re: why transfer to fibre?
« Reply #24 on: January 18, 2013, 11:45:07 PM »

Well when my exchange gets the FTTC upgrade I will definently upgrade as I only get 3 Mbps downstream.

I can justify the additional cost as I am almost always online (except when I'm in bed or in work ! )
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Mike
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