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Author Topic: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk  (Read 18398 times)

guest

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #15 on: June 27, 2012, 04:03:21 PM »

Im quite lucky in that I get relatively few spam calls these days

You don't need to populate whois on kitz.co.uk but you do with TLDs. Try populating any of those with accurate details and see what happens ;)
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kitz

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #16 on: June 27, 2012, 04:22:00 PM »

You don't need to populate whois on kitz.co.uk but you do with TLDs. Try populating any of those with accurate details and see what happens ;)


Thats why I pay  extra and let them sort it. ;)
For eg:-

Quote
Registered through: GoDaddy.com, LLC (http://www.godaddy.com)
   Domain Name: BROADBANDINFO.NET

Administrative Contact:
      Private, Registration  BROADBANDINFO.NET@domainsbyproxy.com
      Domains By Proxy, LLC
      DomainsByProxy.com
      15111 N. Hayden Rd., Ste 160, PMB 353
      Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
      United States
      (480) 624-2599




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guest

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #17 on: June 27, 2012, 04:49:49 PM »

Fine as long as you trust them to transfer the registrar when you want ;)

I assume you haven't tried that yet or you wouldn't be showing me a GoGetF*cked reg page :D

Anyway going OT on domain stuff.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2012, 04:54:19 PM »

Just catching up on this thread,  this was related to my fields of work when I used to work for a living.   :)

So far as I recall, number portability is still most often implemented by 'onward routing'.   That is, the CP who 'owns' the number will always receive calls to that number, even after it has been ported to another CP.  If the number has been ported, then that original CP has to 'onwards route' subsequent calls to the subscriber's new CP.

So, to be on the receiving end of such number porting is easy, the other CP has to do all the work, rerouting the call.  Likewise, if a CP gets a new customer who brings his number with him, then letting him take his number away again if he walks is easy, all the work is still done by the original CP who allocated the number.

But if a CP allocates one of his own numbers to a subscriber who subsequently walks away, taking the number with him, then that CP has to implement the onward routing himself.  It sounds very much like this is what Talk Talk haven't implemented.

There are other more efficient mechanisms for number porting, that avoid the onward routing, and encouraged by OFCOM IIRC.  But ultimately,  any NP mechanism depends upon the CP supporting the required features and dialogues.   If Talk Talk have cut some corners, perhaps using signalling stacks of questionable pedigree,  I can see why they'd not be able to 'port' their own numbers to other CPs.
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kitz

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2012, 05:06:27 PM »

Fine as long as you trust them to transfer the registrar when you want ;)

..snip... I assume you haven't tried that yet


Yep I have :D
It would seriously harm GoDaddy's reputation if they started locking you in.   
I transferred one account over to Vidahost (who also now do it) from them last year without any problems.  Only reason that particular one is still with GoDaddy is I was up to my eyes in other stuff and forgot about it until the last minute and i just let it auto renew.

----
Edited to add..

That one will definitely be going on next renewal too..  just realised vidahost is much cheaper than godaddy for their privacy protection.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2012, 05:19:41 PM by kitz »
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guest

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2012, 05:10:36 PM »

Fine as long as you trust them to transfer the registrar when you want ;)

..snip... I assume you haven't tried that yet


Yep I have :D
It would seriously harm GoDaddy's reputation if they started locking you in.   
I transferred one account over to Vidahost (who also now do it) from them last year without any problems.  Only reason that particular one is still with GoDaddy is I was up to my eyes in other stuff and forgot about it until the last minute and i just let it auto renew.

That's not what I'm hearing now. YMMV of course.

Edit - IME GoDaddy's reputation is bad, even before the mass-marketing. Again YMMV.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2012, 05:12:45 PM by rizla »
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kitz

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2012, 06:20:14 PM »

Quote
There are other more efficient mechanisms for number porting, that avoid the onward routing, and encouraged by OFCOM IIRC.  But ultimately,  any NP mechanism depends upon the CP supporting the required features and dialogues.   If Talk Talk have cut some corners, perhaps using signalling stacks of questionable pedigree,  I can see why they'd not be able to 'port' their own numbers to other CPs.

Thanks 7LM for the additional info, I think the above paragraph may sum it up.

All I knew was basic fact that despite they should be able to,  they hadnt implemented the necessary technology to be able to do so...  I just assumed they were cutting corners on cost...  after all why spend money on something if a customer is no longer with you.   
Despite the fact that all the mobile providers do and BT has to or OFCOM would come down on them like a ton of bricks.
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broadstairs

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2012, 07:08:11 PM »

I now have some clarification from TT. If you move supplier of the phone service you can take your number with you as long as your new provider is willing to arrange this, apparently TT cannot prevent this. Good news.

However if you move home TT will NOT allow you to move your number with you. While this is OK if you move out of the exchange area, moving within an exchange should be allowed but they do not currently offer this service, so your only option is to change supplier in this case. Seems a bit short sighted to me as I for one would take this option on moving house (within the exchange area).

Strange thing is my thread on this is now locked so I cannot ask why!

Stuart
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burakkucat

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2012, 07:36:19 PM »

Quote
Strange thing is my thread on this is now locked so I cannot ask why!

Are you sure that you, the OP, cannot re-open your thread? Look under the "Topic Options" drop-down menu . . . I think that is what it is called.

Failing that, just open another thread!  :)
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2012, 07:46:21 PM »

I now have some clarification from TT. If you move supplier of the phone service you can take your number with you as long as your new provider is willing to arrange this, apparently TT cannot prevent this. Good news.

However if you move home TT will NOT allow you to move your number with you. While this is OK if you move out of the exchange area, moving within an exchange should be allowed but they do not currently offer this service, so your only option is to change supplier in this case. Seems a bit short sighted to me as I for one would take this option on moving house (within the exchange area).

Strange thing is my thread on this is now locked so I cannot ask why!

Stuart

Very strange.

Personally, I'd be open minded to the possibility of the following scenario...

1) They lack the technology to properly port numbers, as described in my earlier post.

2) The subtleties of what can/cannot be done are beyond the reasoning ability/ attention span of TT support.

3) Like most unskilled support staff they prefer to BS the customer, rather than admit they don't understand their own technology.

That's just one possible explanation for what you've been told, and pure speculaton on my part. There may be others explanations that will become apparent, though it's hard to see that happening if your thread has been blocked.

PS, i see B'cat has posted as I typed, no contradiction, posting anyway.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #25 on: June 27, 2012, 10:44:52 PM »

Pondering this some more, it is of course (moving house) quite a different problem from number portability, which is more about swapping providers whilst keeping the same line.  The former may be more of a plumbing issue within the exchange, rather than any signalling wizzardry.

Perhaps it is only BT, with their command of exchange wiring, who can provide the service of keeping old number at new address nearby (ie same exchange).  Yet, if a subscriber migrated from TT to BT, then moved home keeping number, then migrated back to TT, the miracle would have been achieved. So it must be possible.

I wonder... do other LLU providers offer this service, taken for granted for decades now, of moving home with same number?  I'll be intriqued to hear the proper technical explanation, if TT ever provide one. 

- 7LM

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guest

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #26 on: June 27, 2012, 10:52:12 PM »

I know from neighbours its virtually impossible to keep the same number with Virgin, doesn't matter where you move to. Not sure if that is still the case but it was in 2008 when it was apparently possible in theory but in practice it didn't happen within 3 months.

To be quite honest I can't see what the problem is - we got calls forwarded for 3 months after we moved, much like the Royal Mail. I can see it being an issue for business (then again just use VoIP, job done) and older people but its not really an issue many people will care about - and even less will care enough to actively complain.

Not trying to say its fine but I think its one of these issues which has limited interest to regulators.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2012, 10:56:47 PM by rizla »
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kitz

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #27 on: June 27, 2012, 11:11:17 PM »

>> Perhaps it is only BT, with their command of exchange wiring,

No idea, but you would think it would not be impossible to be done since  WLR 'telco' providers can request BT to do this.   

Once upon a time it was impossible to move back from datastream to ipstream nvm LLU without hastle and long downtimes.
With the advent of MSANs which hold both Telco and adsl on the line cards you'd think it could be done with a bit of jumpering and electronic switching.

I think perhaps not as many are bothered about retaining numbers when they move, as many people may move to a different area served by a different exchange and are willing to accept things like call forwarding and mail forwarding as an expense to be considered in moving costs.
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sevenlayermuddle

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #28 on: June 27, 2012, 11:18:07 PM »

and older people

Steady now Rizla, that may include a lot of folks here :lol:

Seriously, the following considerations may arise...

1) A person may have a number he just likes. 

2) A person may not want to bother writing to all old friends and relatives, notifying them of new number.

3) The 'new' number assigned may have been recycled from somebody else who freely volunteered the number on loyalty card applications, prize daws and the likes, leading to a big increase in nuisance calls.

Admittedly though, most times we move we switch exchanges too, so we have to live with the hardship.  And we survive.  :)
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guest

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Re: Unable to keep phone number when leaving TalkTalk
« Reply #29 on: June 28, 2012, 06:52:55 PM »

Feeling pretty damn old myself these days :)

You can get a new number if the assigned one is prone to spamming for previous scumbag ;) You just have to complain within 3 months of the line going active.

Writing to people, well email and BCC is the way to do that. I know there will be a fair few elderly people who don't use email, so email their relatives. Otherwise you do what we've always done, send out loads of "change of address cards".

None of this detracts from TT's failure, just trying to point out that we have more options now. Everyone still had to be told in the past and getting a number change because of anything other than harassment used to be damn near impossible.

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