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[coolsnakeman]

Nice graphs  . See the reason why i had first said for you to get these results in the test socket is so sky can't give any excuses for your results. So if you go to them with those graphs and tell them each result was taking from the test socket they can't say there problem could be related to faulty equip or internal wiring etc etc.

Gary

[snadge]

Nice graphs  . See the reason why i had first said for you to get these results in the test socket is so sky can't give any excuses for your results. So if you go to them with those graphs and tell them each result was taking from the test socket they can't say there problem could be related to faulty equip or internal wiring etc etc.

Gary

Thanks Gary,

Yeah they are all Test Socket bar the bottom right WLR3 one, which I may go back and see if it can do so and get it looking better than it is which would make it look even more persuasive ...

still not heard back from the rep I emailed, I bet he is ignoring my emails as he said he is closing my case, Iam emailing his work account directly... cant believe sky like...

[Bald_Eagle1]

Yes, great looking graphs.
Well, not great at all, but you know what I mean .

The data is really useful as a quick snapshot of a given connection's current status & is much easier to see when presented so graphically.

For maximum impact though, I believe the graphical presentation of fluctuating data over time periods can add even more weight as proof of instability / deteriorated conditions.
i.e. A "before & after type" scenario all on one page.

My ISP paid some attenuation to my snapshot graphs, but eventually reached the stage of saying the changes were natural fluctuations, within acceptable limits and as to be expected.

Thus my development of the Ongoing Graphs.
They were sent to my ISP asking questions on the lines of "should users really expect to see all those fluctuations as depicted in the graphs, especially sync speed fluctuations of between 35Mb & 8Mb?"

More recently, I have been able to identify "fluctuations" that coincide with changes in weather conditions.

Many engineers have visited, usually with the warning that I may be charged if no Network fault is found.
These warnings have all come following remote tests conducted by both my ISP & BT where Line tests O.K. (LTOK) has been the result.

Each visiting engineer has ended up carrying out some different repair work that has slightly improved stability & speeds, therefore I have not been charged for any of the visits.

One of the simplest graphs that appeared to have the most impact in keeping my ISP engaged with my own connection issues was a graph of my IP Profiles since having FTTC installed last June.

The early data is rather sketchy as my connection was initially so good that I didn't feel the need to monitor it on a daily basis.

This graph is attached for reference.

If anyone wanted to graph such data, as long as they have the graphing applications installed, all that is needed is a simple text file in the following format.
The batch file that generates the graphs is available if required:-


01/08/11 10376
02/08/11 8714
03/08/11 8318
03/08/11 12257
04/08/11 23464
05/08/11 14830
06/08/11 15050
07/08/11 15050
08/08/11
09/08/11 20866
10/08/11 23149
11/08/11 23149
12/08/11 17657
13/08/11

[coolsnakeman]

Snadge,

How many WLR3 neighbours results do you have against SVBN customers? Remember to get at least 10 or more on SVBN alone if at all possible cause if sky do not then do some sort of investigation in regards to an MSO (major service outage) or MSF (major service failure) then you can go to ofcom with your results and evidence and ask them to look into it. Just so you know MSO and MSF both mean the same thing just some people call it MSO or MSF or at times just an outage 

Gary

[snadge]

bloody heck BA -    how many visits you had? haha

the majority of my problem is constant though, the late evening fluctuations vary, it seems to be worse at the weeked but need more data from this weekend to see if thats true, but I will keep an eye on those

sky have responded to my 3 page complaint I sent online (didnt have graph)

Dear ********

Thank you for your email regarding the slow speeds, noise the line and loss of earnings caused . I’m very sorry for the poor service you’ve received and apologise for any inconvenience you’ve suffered as a result of this.

I am unable to locate your account details, from your previous email. I tried to call you today although was unable to get a response. Please can you confirm your account number and address?

I will be working with you on this case until resolved and you can contact me via responding to this email or calling 08442 *** ***.

Yours sincerely

Mo Chaba
Service Excellence Consultant

Executive Support Team

I think before I respond Iam going too look at that JB/Shed scenario at the end, if it turns out to be something in their shed...who's fault is that? BT's for installling the JB on gable end of someones house?

@ Gary , cheers - I have found another sky user who says its slower since moving from BT but having just met them on the field I didnt wanna be rude and ask if I could come over and start testing their line...she said her hubby is a web designer so would know if something was up...lol... I didnt want to say that theres a good chance he doesnt hehe, for all I know he MAY be a xDLS freak....just like me!!!  anyway she has been with them 6 months, should be on SVBN, but that bottom right WLR3 result has been with sky for 6 months too (longer than me) and they are still on WLR3...why is this? I was with sky 2 weeks and I got letter saying I was being moved over to SVBN in 4 weeks time... yet the lady on the end on WLR3 has been with them a good 3-4 weeks and has not had any letter, and those I just mentioned are same and been with sky 6 months...  how do they decide who is being moved over to SVBN , and who isnt ?

also, both tracert results (on the WLR3 connections) 2nd hop were dr0.elnba.isp.sky.com IP's which are typical of SVBN MSAN... might be the Broadband Only MSAN - but befire I was moved to SVBN my IP was summit like 9450e59.bb.sky.com and one rep said i was on an ISAM and the last one said i was on BB only MSAN

I think...

123-456-78-90-easynet.net = Easynet DSLAM (WLR3+BB only)
12E4f567.bb.sky.com = ISAM (WLR3+BB only)
dr0.enlba.isp.sky.com = MSAN (WLR3+BB only or SVBN)

of course those addresses arent fixed and can change slightly

or you could say:

easynet.net
bb.sky.com
enlba.isp.sky.com

it seems they can port your broadband just about anywhere while phone is WLR3 provisioned

[snadge]

...sorry for all the changes I make after posting.. I cant help but rush everything then realise after posting it could be better...yes I do use preview too lol...

I have made loads of changes to above post

[Bald_Eagle1]

Just a thought, but could any of your sync speed / throughput issues have anything to do with perhaps a suspect implementation of 'Cool Broadband' that has recently been mentioned in this thread:-

http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,11097.0.html

It appears that it has been removed for business customers following many complaints.

I THINK that Sky use Lower power mode L2 for some customers when individual demand has dropped, but I'm not sure.
You have mentioned SRA etc. so maybe a possibility that your power levels and/or sync speeds aren't being woken up properly when demand increases?

Do you ever see L2 in your info --stats logs?

This is mine (always):-
Link Power State:   L0

[snadge]

i know about cool broadband (ive joined that thread too so i can see what BS brings to the table for us ) but, no it aint effective on SKY's MSANs by looks of it... not yet anyway, whether or not sky will be rolling it out I dont know, I would imagine they will as it stands to save considerable amounts of money...

Link State: L0

and Output Power is alway 19.1dBm

thanks for the insight to L0/L2 etc anyway,

I have just heard that my neighbour who is with BT said his broadband ha become slow recently, he thinks Ive broke his connection with plugging my router into his socket to test the SNR etc all those weeks ago (and suddenly now its slow) lol.. I heard from my neighbour (his Pal).... mustnt be that bad or he would come and see me about it.!! ive been to 3 other non-BT neighbours twice to do same thing and they have no complaints... yet i fixed his laptop for him and showed him how to email etc...bah!!

maybe he has cool broadband issues ?

anyway, i cant go and help him as I will be dropping my neighbour in it, so now I have to smile and say hello and pretend like nothings wrong when I know he is not happy with me

[coolsnakeman]

Snadge,

Thats the sort of things you have to face when looking at other peoples technology problems. You have brought it to his attention there is an issue with the service. You have performed some basic simple tests to prove there is a wider issue in the area which would of course have no impact on his BB speed unless you took a hammer to his socket. However since you did some work your easier to blame for an issue that has just been brought to his attention. Would he have blamed you if you had NEVER brought these issues to his attention? Would he have ever even had a clue there was problems there? I would think not lol. So don't worry to much about his concerns they won't go no further than that. Cool broadband is still running with business customers at the minute the ones that are complaining of issues with it are being removed from it. I think its only BT services that are on this cool broadband thing at the minute which is only having an impact on 21cn customers so FTTC and 20cn are fine.

Gary

[snadge]

he is on WBC (ADSL2+) - is that 21CN..?

I have had a result with sky... they are sending out a special sky networking engineer with BT broadband engineer (so the sky engineer has full access) and they are going to start with the JB on end of my row... Im still not convinced as my (now unhappy) neighbour who is with BT is in that JB and he had no noise on his line like ours on sky - the rep was adamant that its not the hardware, also , some of the things he said seem to contradict some of the things ive been told, like moving from WLR3 (BT Line) to SVBN -> he said there is no physical moving of the cable within the exchange and that its just a setting change (or something alonng them lines) - im not convinced, my phone line was on BT's PSTN , then moved over into sky's part of the exchange into the ISAM (thats what he called it, ISAM, not MSAN?)

even if he meant the wire terminates at MDF before splitting off, there is still moving around from BT to SKY for the phone line...!! just didnt seem to make sense what he was telling me, I should have checked it with him, I just said "right" lol... you know you dont want to upset them by trying to tell them their jobs..haha  but there HAS been some physical changes to the line itself , doesnt matter if the broadband hasnt changed, ive said it for a while now that I think its something to do with the Telephony hardware side of it.. I may be wrong, but i can only guess...

http://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/topic,11218.0.html

[coolsnakeman]

Snadge,

21cn is ADSL2+ you are correct. Well you may be getting some results there sky have agreed to a "joint meet" with BT openreach so both sides of the field have full access to everything and can bash there heads together to get this sorted. Good luck mate.

Gary

[roseway]

To be slightly pedantic, 21CN is just a major upgrade of the BT national network. The feature which brings ADSL2+ capability is WBC (Wholesale Broadband Connect) and many exchanges are upgraded to 21CN-WBC but do not have the full 21CN upgrade.

[burakkucat]

. . . into the ISAM (thats what he called it, ISAM, not MSAN?)

A pedantic cat replies --

No, sorry Snage.    You've got things muddled. It is an MSAN -- a Multiple Services Access Node. 

The last time I recall seeing the abbreviation ISAM (in the 1980s), it stood for Indexed Sequential Access Method! 

[snadge]

@ Eric - I thought that WBC was part of 21CN

@ B'Kat - no I have not got muddled, thats what he said.  - 
ISAM - Integrated Services Access Manager. - Ive had 1 sky rep and 1 sky network engineer refer to ISAM's now at the exchange, they must have both?
when I asked months ago if I was on Dslam or Msan I got reply saying I was ported directly into their ISAM , my IP on tracert 2nd hop was something like AE527F120.bb.sky.com which users on Sky User said they hadnt seen before? - then the rep that was dealing with my case later said it was a Broadband Only MSAN..?  ive a feeling it was this ISAM and that was his way of describing it too me.

maybe all sky's MSAN's and DSLAM's go into sky's ISAM...?

now im on SVBN my ip on 2nd hop is dr0.enlba.isp.sky.com , but, my two neighbours that are on WLR3 also have enlba.isp.sky.com addresses on 2nd hop

Easynet Dslam (stinger) is something like AE527F120.easynet.net

the evidence would say (and it has been suggested by an ex sky rep) they can put your broadband wherever they like , regardless of your phone being on WLR3, normally it is the case (or has been) with sky that when your phone is on WLR3 you get put on the stinger Dslam (easynet.net) - then your moved over to SVBN MSAN if and when your exchange has the equipment

it has certainly been educational - by time its finished i will know sky inside out haha

[roseway]

@ Eric - I thought that WBC was part of 21CN

Well, as I said, I was being slightly pedantic. 21CN and ADSL2+ are not synonymous - the WBC component of 21CN enables ADSL2+ as an option, but other types of ADSL are supported too. And it isn't necessary for an exchange to be upgraded to the full 21CN to get these options - only the WBC component is needed.

(Sorry, I have a habit of doing this. I think I must have been a schoolmaster in another life. )