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[coolsnakeman]

SFErr(CRCErr):  978             1142
ES:             1634            77487

3 hour connection and those errors are pretty high now. Where not so high after an hour with the connection. I would suggest you get back onto CST again cause this is NOT fixed! I will drop him another email to get him to get someone else back onto this again.

Gary

[coolsnakeman]

Email has been sent snadge. Hopefully you will receive another call from CST soon enough 

Gary

[snadge]

Many Thanks Gary, I really appreciate it

Theres a lad called BARRY who has been getting back to me via PM's on the sky forum - he is the only one who's name ive seen come back to me and he says he has passed it to tier 2 support who will call me - he also said that iam still on the 20Mb profile but because of problems only getting half that... I have praised him for getting back to me as other reps couldn't really care, mind he did says they would contact me to arrange another engineer visit, if its necessary..!!! I hope that wasnt to imply that sky may simply say "thats it pal!!...it looks like its working to us; so use it or leave" lol.

now this morning the noise was still there, i run Router Stats which showed the noise margin to be slowly going up, I went out for 30 mins...came back in and soon as i walked through the door the broadband dropped signal? I picked up phone and lots of noise, pops and clicks/cackling - I thought it cant be the door surely? so few minutes later I opened the door (the PC is behind the door when its opened which is connected to the router via wifi) and the noise margin dropped to 0db again and dropped sync...? line had noise on it... I tried again but did not work, I turned off all power at mains and plugged phone directly into the test socket without filter and noise was still there - the thing is when I stood up last night after watching TV and walked towards the PC it dropped again as I approached it??

coincidence?

there is defo noise on the line - that much is for sure, BUT, like last time if I repeatedly pull phones in and out trying diff phones & filters, after a while the noise seems to be much less on the phone...?? now, whats the betting later on it will start to creep in again?

could it be there is noise on the line - but local rein in my home is kicking it over as its already "weakened" by the noise on my line and hence when I walk to PC it dropped the broadband? LOL.......!!! - also DMT tool shows 13 gaps (before when all noise was bad, less now after faffing) throughout the entire spectrum , and the low end has unusual shape to it as if its badly affected by noise near the phone end of the spectrum - in fact the whole thing just doesnt look right:




and see the Noise Margin now smooth as a babys bum after I spend 5 minutes pluggin in 4 different filters, 2 diff phones, repeatedley trying each one then back again ..then plug other one in AGAIN.. and dialling "1" - after 5 minutes the noise became less, you could hear some noise but not as prominent as before, when there was a voice on the line the noise increased - i am using same filter and phone as before..(the result is not because iam now using working devices...it seems constantly messing with the line on/off with receiver etc has settled it a bit)

EDIT: right now, when i use the phone to dial "1" the noise margin goes UP by about 1db, when I hang up it goes back down, twice it dropped to 0db but held sync, and third time it dropped sync, this is in last 5 minutes when dialing "1" on phone, ive noticed if i dont dial and listen to the tone then the hang up tone I can hear the noise on the line



a SKY rep who worked for TLC had a rant on their forum and had his post removed... heres what he said...

I Wouldn't even waste your time calling, Sky outsource there call centre work to a company called The Listening Company, The managers refuse to take over a call if you would like to call through to them directly 02392942261 is the managers contact number i'm currently an employee at TLC but would like to take the chance to say advisors are underpaid and treated unfairly and we are taught not to call customers back as it costs sky millions we are told to tell the customers the maximum goodwill credit we can give is £10 it's not it's £60 this affects the managers bonus which is why we aren't allowed.

hehe - I put the number up for the Fibre Team for those having sign up troubles (because their website sign up process is not working properly, but if you ring fibre team they can hook you up) and that was removed hehe

[coolsnakeman]

The broadband dropping in sync when the door is open........ The door isn't caught or catching onto a part of cable going into the property by any chance? And the BB dropped sync when you walked towards the PC? Are you carrying that much static in your body it is you that is causing the REIN  That is all very unusual indeed but the bottom line is there is still a problem there that needs to be repaired and i don't think there is anything more you can do at your end to fix it. The guy that got his post removed must not be all that interested in keeping his job cause there is crawlers all over these forums from service providers watching the comments that are being made so thats why you have to be careful as to what information you give including advise.

Gary

[snadge]

aye I see

yeah I think it was coincidence - no cables at the door, just pure coincidence

I have had sky call me, been on fone for nearly one hour to tier 1 and tier 2 CST - very nice, pleasant and helpfull chaps, they have restored my faith in sky  - long story short(er), the Tier 1 chap entered into computer what steps I took to test the line too make sure it wasnt internal, i told him I tried 4 filters, 2 phones and 2 routers, I even turned off the mains and tried a phone on its own in the socket and it was still the same, he called me on my mobile and ran tests and seen there was a fault showing, he put me on hold and called the CST Tier 2 and spoke to them, he passed me over , I spoke to a nice man called 'Gregory' there, he  agrees and thinks its in exchange but because the fault is showing as an external engineer fault it means he can not directly put it too the NOC team for an exchange engineer to check, so, he put me on hold while he spoke to some of the members of this "NOC" team as they were in his office - he phoned me back and said he has too put it through to an external engineer (first) who will probably want to be in my neighbours garden to look at this iffy DP, which has loose non-protected wiring just dangling down from soffits on either side into their garden into a DP somewhere, because from the notes the first engineer seemed to think that was the problem (but his supervisor advised to leave the job because there was a dog in the garden..lol), and I told him the 3rd engineer said the same to me, but because he thought he'd fixed my line he just left it at that and didnt investigate.

then, if there is a fault he will repair it, and he has requested that he to go to exchange and ensure its all working fine down there after the repair, but if there is no fault, then he will 'bounce' it too the NOC team (who are already aware of this situation) and then they will get an exchange engineer to look at the equipment, he mentioned doing a "coop" (which I think might those 'joint-meets' you told me about, is it?) so they can check over other many bits of hardware (he said their names but went over my head, I recognized 1 or 2 , but I just kept agreeing hehe) and hopefully it will be resolved soon.

obviously during the call I understood a lot of the stuff and he could tell I knew a lot about it and he said "can I ask...did you used too work for BT? as you seem to know a lot about it?" - hehe - I said "no I dont, I fix computers and years back I was coming across a lot of broadband problems and I knew nothing about it , so I self taught and I speak to BTo engineers and others who work in the industry and learn from them online via forums" - he replied with "oh I see, just its nice to be able to speak to someone who actually understands and knows what your talking about haha"

he was lovely chap, he said he is in tomorrow and Saturday and will keep checking the engineers notes for progress, if he gets any news over those two days he will call me on my mobile and let me know whats happening

NOW THATS WHAT I CALL CUSTOMER SERVICE!!! - quite pleased with them now actually

[Black Sheep]

Good luck, Paul.

Btw ....... "he mentioned doing a "coop" (which I think might those 'joint-meets' you told me about, is it?)" .

No mate, a 'co-op' is what the engineer has to do if it's down on his task to do so. If we don't do a 'co-op' and it's been requested, we (OR) don't get paid. So, when the engineer does do his co-op, the SKY Tech Helpdesk should test the line and confirm whetehr it is ok or not, and then decide to either close the job or carry on 'faulting' it ?

HTH.

[Black Sheep]

Whoops, sorry  ................ forgot the main bit. The co-op is done by the engineer phoning SKY, not meeting up on-site face-to-face.

[snadge]

ahh Black Sheep there you are...hehe I was wondering where you was... 

thanks for the explanation... so, what is a "co-op" exactly then? I know you say he has to do it..but what is it?

connection has dropped 11 times in last 4 hours, ive even raised my margin to 10db but does it no good , around about 4pm the noise started to get worse and router stats noise margin monitor went from nice straight lines to zig-zags hehe - wierdly DLM has lowered my interleaving depth from 64 down 8 up to 32 down and 2 up , im gunna attempt a switch to ADSL1 with a 12db Noise Margin ...see if i cant make it stable for now..

[Black Sheep]

ahh Black Sheep there you are...hehe I was wondering where you was... 

thanks for the explanation... so, what is a "co-op" exactly then? I know you say he has to do it..but what is it?

connection has dropped 11 times in last 4 hours, ive even raised my margin to 10db but does it no good , around about 4pm the noise started to get worse and router stats noise margin monitor went from nice straight lines to zig-zags hehe - wierdly DLM has lowered my interleaving depth from 64 down 8 up to 32 down and 2 up , im gunna attempt a switch to ADSL1 with a 12db Noise Margin ...see if i cant make it stable for now..

It's what it says on the tin mate. The engineer has to co-operate with the ISP's techy desk people before he closes the task. It takes away the engineers sole decision that the line is now ok, it has to be confirmed by the ISP as well, whilst the engineer is on-site.

That answer your question, Snadge ?? 

[snadge]

aaahhhh right... i see

yep that answers it for me mate

having really bad connection tonight, 2-6Mb on ADSL or ADSL2+ , the downstream line attenuation is climbing slightly and upstream attenuation has dropped loads -  error counts are really high (I think)

bah humbug!  hehe

[snadge]

I have been told by someone that it sounds like SPLIT PAIR at the exchange and that needs SFI or Frames Engineer to sort it, whats your reckoning on this black sheep?

[Black Sheep]

I have been told by someone that it sounds like SPLIT PAIR at the exchange and that needs SFI or Frames Engineer to sort it, whats your reckoning on this black sheep?

The only 'split pair' scenario in an Exchange would be on the 'tie pairs'. This is the 100pr link cable (of which there are many), from the ISP's DSL equipment to our Main Distribution Frame (MDF). It can and does happen.

If it is this that's the problem, then a bog-standard 'Frames' task could be requested from the ISP to OR. The ISP would just give OR a new set of 'ties' for the Exchange Jumper Man to connect to. If the ISP requests an engineering visit, then yes, it would have to be an SFI engineer, not a network engineer.

Again, if this is the issue, the ISP has to make the decision to either present new 'ties' straightaway, or, request an SFI for the engineer to decide if new 'ties' are required.

Hope this makes sense ??

[coolsnakeman]

BS has hit the nail on the head with co-op's. Usually what happens is the engineer stands in his little corner at the exchange and calls the number the ISP has given to him for co-op's. The ISP then usually runs a tone through the bar par and confirm with the engineer if he is able to hear this tone (this confirms if the tie pairs are faulty or not). There is a couple of other things that are done aswell but i am to to sure what that is but i am sure BS has done plenty of co-op's in his time. The joint meet is something that use to happen between BT OR and "sky engineers" but i am not to sure if these are done anymore cause they where stopping them i think before i had left. They only happened if BTW where receiving alot of repeat faults for the same customer so we would of been sent requests from BTW for details of a joint meet.

Gary

[snadge]

thanks for the insight guys, as you know I appreciate you sharing the knowledge

anyway, OR engineer came here this morning (even though he wasnt supposed to, as it was external booking which requires no access) - I explained and he setup his stuff in my socket, he was here 3.5 hours - basically, he found the fault to be between the DP on our wall and the DP at the other end of the row of houses (why couldnt 3 other engineers spot this?) - luckily there were 2 spare ties in that cable so he swapped them over and his tests come back ok and no battery contact? he did say it may raise its ugly head again later but might not too.... anyway, the line does sound a lot better but it IS early days.. then I put on the broadband and its still syncing at 11Mb even though Iam on a 20Mb profile... line test said no echo and 'some' noise...? the upstream line attenuation is erratic still.. 13.5db , then after reboot it is now 10db?? (downstream LA is 26.5db)

DMT Tool still reports same gaps although the SNR at lower end of spectrum near the upstream signal looks better than it did last night, HOWEVER, Iam not convinced its fixed, I think the cable has had a developing fault and that may have been removed but theres still something else going on...

Iam going to wait until tonight and do an Indian rain dance in the garden in hope it pees down and it all starts up again with problems hehe  because something is not right here still... unless sky can get me up to 18Mb again but it should have gone straight back up...

INP = 1.14
Interleaving = 64 / 8
Output Power = 19.1dBm
Line Attenuation = 26.5db / 10db
Noise Margin = 7.5 / 7.5
Sync Rate = 11,600 / 1043

whats your thoughts on this?

edit: NM goes up 1db when we use the phone - is that normal?

[coolsnakeman]

Hold on was it not syncing higher than that before that fault was fixed??? Have to agree something still not put right there. This looks like it is going to be a long road for you snadge is that engineer number 4? I would recommend you get this escalated to a manager and request it to be escalated to a field manager in openreach to get this sorted out once and for all! BS any thoughts on the increase in SNRM when phone is in use cause i am not to sure and do you think this should be escalated to a field manager?

Gary