Kitz Forum

Broadband Related => Broadband Hardware => Topic started by: AStalUK on July 29, 2022, 08:46:43 AM

Title: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: AStalUK on July 29, 2022, 08:46:43 AM
https://www.draytek.co.uk/products/business/vigor-167

Looks like Draytek have released a new modem, presumably as a direct replacement (speculation) of the Vigor 130, does anyone have one how does it perform?

Thanks.
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: Weaver on July 29, 2022, 09:39:26 AM
I would like to get hold of one. It won’t do the kind of stats info I’m used to though, and won’t have Mr. johnson’s special stats-over-http  interface that I use, so it would just be for lab purposes.
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on July 29, 2022, 02:33:07 PM
I would like to get hold of one. It won’t do the kind of stats info I’m used to though, and won’t have Mr. johnson’s special stats-over-http  interface that I use, so it would just be for lab purposes.

You planning on being the official supplier of VDSL routers to the UK once 95% have FTTP? ;)
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: AStalUK on August 29, 2022, 05:50:27 PM
Brought the Vigor 167 a few weeks ago as I wanted try it out. For the last few months my connection has been stable at 49Mbps but refused to sync higher despite running for years at 69Mbps. I suspect this is something to do with the Vigor 166 I tried and had any number of issues with, but because the line was above BT’s guarantee they refused to send an engineer to reset it.

The Vigor 167 has now been in place for 2 weeks and the link is now syncing at 64Mbps and running stable. Overall the 167 seems to be a decent product, the CLI looks to have gone away and replaced by a GUI which gives you all the specs on your line, clean and simple to use so can’t complain.
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on August 29, 2022, 07:01:58 PM
You don't need an engineer to "reset it", your ISP can do this remotely.  Although if its dropped even further that would rather suggest a reset probably wont fix anything.

Its also not unusual for different units to sync at a different speed, so it may be what you used before was better on your line.  Or crosstalk has reared its ugly head.
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: AStalUK on August 29, 2022, 09:19:03 PM
You don't need an engineer to "reset it", your ISP can do this remotely.  Although if its dropped even further that would rather suggest a reset probably wont fix anything.

Its also not unusual for different units to sync at a different speed, so it may be what you used before was better on your line.  Or crosstalk has reared its ugly head.

Interesting I thought only the BT engineers can call for a profile reset. My line had been stable at 69Mbps using the Vigor 130 for years but after switching to the 166 for testing the line speed continually degraded over the couse of a couple days/weeks even reverting back to the 130 didn't increase my sync speed it was almost as if it was stuck at whatever the 166 last synced at.

I suppose it's also possibly a problem with internal wiring or the line to the cab is in some way impacted, but as it stands the line appears stable and speeds are consitant and the connection stable for the last 3 days, the last reset being me switching hardware around.
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: meritez on August 29, 2022, 10:13:36 PM
You may want to stick with the Vigor 130 as it's Openreach MCT approved:
https://www.draytek.co.uk/information/our-technology/bt-sin-498

https://kitz.co.uk/routers/MCT.htm

Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: AStalUK on August 30, 2022, 07:07:03 AM
You may want to stick with the Vigor 130 as it's Openreach MCT approved:
https://www.draytek.co.uk/information/our-technology/bt-sin-498

https://kitz.co.uk/routers/MCT.htm

Apparently all Draytek products are MCT approved, https://www.draytek.co.uk/products/comparison/router-comparison. And also listed on the spec page, https://www.draytek.co.uk/products/business/vigor-167#specifications
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on August 30, 2022, 01:46:10 PM
I doubt being approved necessarily means "will get the best performance".  That would be more focused on feature set and stability, OR would rather a line be completely stable at a lower speed than the end user be right on the edge of stability but getting a much faster speed.

Exactly which modem can push the most out of a given line on the cabinet is mostly just trial and error.
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: Weaver on August 30, 2022, 10:02:27 PM
And getting the highest sync rates is counterproductive if you’re getting errors (meaning data corruption and hence data loss) all the time. This is because although if you’re using TCP or QUIC errors will be corrected by those protocols by retransmissions, that will slow the transport down a lot, as there’s not only the cost of the retransmission, but also there’s the time for the transport to recover to the full speed it had before loss was detected. Even though my ultra long lines are usually so clean that I get literally get zero errors even at 3 dB SNRM, if a line is i’ll then I have to really watch the error rates as real throughput with TCP suffers. And there’s also the question of applications that don’t use TCP or QUIC, but UDP without retransmitting protocols, and these application protocols will just fail sporadically.
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: meritez on August 31, 2022, 12:51:41 AM
Apparently all Draytek products are MCT approved, https://www.draytek.co.uk/products/comparison/router-comparison. And also listed on the spec page, https://www.draytek.co.uk/products/business/vigor-167#specifications

Code: [Select]
The Vigor167 comes preconfigured in bridge mode for VDSL2 installations.
There will be a firmware update towards the end of the year or early next year where full routing functionality wil lbe added similar to the Vigor130.
The Vigor167 does support SOS/ROC.
The chipset used is EcoNet EN7556N
This router is running the latest OS DrayOS v5.0

https://forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/9xv6n62x

You have swapped a tried and tested Lantiq modem for a Mediatek modem.

The Vigor 167 only has one firmware release in the UK, over in Australia it's interesting.

German reviews have the Vigor 167 syncing at 45mb less than a Lantiq fritzbox on a VDSL 35b connection.

There's other modem code available but I'm not aware it the other two modem codes show up on your UK 167.

https://fw.draytek.com.tw/Vigor167/Firmware/

The original 5.0 firmware only allowed the 167 to function as a bridge modem.
5.1 brought in full router mode.
I would be curious if the 167 performs better on 5.0 if you're willing to downgrade as it would have less of an overhead.


Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: Weaver on August 31, 2022, 05:28:53 AM
I got on reasonably ok with a DLink modem that was Mediatek based, but it was too aggressive, and its downstream SNRM would sometimes droop inexorably towards zero dB over time. Stick to Broadcom unless matching a compatible cab.
Title: Re: Draytek Vigor 167 VDSL/ADSL Modem.
Post by: Wasabi on January 07, 2023, 06:30:45 PM
Brought the Vigor 167 a few weeks ago as I wanted try it out. For the last few months my connection has been stable at 49Mbps but refused to sync higher despite running for years at 69Mbps. I suspect this is something to do with the Vigor 166 I tried and had any number of issues with, but because the line was above BT’s guarantee they refused to send an engineer to reset it.

The Vigor 167 has now been in place for 2 weeks and the link is now syncing at 64Mbps and running stable. Overall the 167 seems to be a decent product, the CLI looks to have gone away and replaced by a GUI which gives you all the specs on your line, clean and simple to use so can’t complain.

Despite concerns raised by other users regarding the Draytek 167, which appear to be based around conjecture and opinion of the mediatek chipset rather than actual usage of the device, I have to say that my real world experience with the modem/router echoes that of AStalUK almost exactly and that I'm very pleased with the device used in modem mode, running the latest official firmware.

I originally used a HG612 on my FTTC Openreach line (leased via Zen Internet and around 275m from the green cabinet which is a Huawei), in the interest of using more modern hardware I "upgraded" to a Draytek 166, whch over a short period and many errors, had reduced my line speed from 72mb/s to around 62mb/s.

For this reason, I switched back to the HG612. Over time the the line stabilised, creeping back to around 68mb/s, but never returning to the initial sync speed prior to the introduction of the Vigor 166. I put the reduction in speed down to the line stabilising over time and decided I would simply live with the new rate and not risk making things worse by changing hardware further.

Fast forward a few months, I recently had a chance to test a Vigor 167 and as we're due to switch to FTTP shortly I thought I'd give it a go. I'd read that the new hardware had dropped G-Fast support and was specifically optimised for VDSL2 connections and if it all went wrong and I lost a chunk of speed, I'd soon be receiving a pure fibre connection anyway, so I really had nothing to lose!

Immediately upon installation of the Vigor 167, the line sync was around 2mb/s higher than with the HG612. Over the following two weeks the sync rate continued to rise with the modem now syncing around 78mb/s, resulting in a usable throughput of around 73/74mb/s. The ping has also improved by 2-4ms like for like when running tests on identical servers.

For comparison, over the past year, I've tested a Broadcom based Billion Modem on the line / Openreach ECI modem / The old faithful HG612 (standard and custom firmware) in additon to a Fritzbox 7530 operating as both a modem and combined modem / router.

Thus far, the Vigor 167 provides the most stable and consistent connection and is the only modem that has actually improved speeds, both upon initial installation and over time, presumably due to a reduction in errors on the line.

Overall, I'm really happy with the Draytek 167 and would recommend to anyone looking for a modern take on VDSL2 hardware that appears (at least on my line) to significantly outperform the default HG612.