Kitz Forum

Broadband Related => FTTC and FTTP Issues => Topic started by: adslmax on October 29, 2021, 05:38:22 PM

Title: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 29, 2021, 05:38:22 PM
Openreach engineer been here three hours ago and found the DP connection pair was shared that shouldn't have been in the first place as he disconnected it and swap to single connected pair at the end of other pathway. Must be someone who lived at this address with 2nd line like shared room. Checked his kit tool and line has improved with max rate 330/50  :o ;D :)

Code: [Select]
============================================================================
    xDSL Training Status:   Showtime
                    Mode:   G.fast Annex A
            Traffic Type:   PTM Mode
             Link Uptime:   2 hours: 10 minutes
============================================================================
       xDSL Port Details       Upstream         Downstream
               Line Rate:     49.471 Mbps      329.200 Mbps
    Actual Net Data Rate:     49.301 Mbps      329.720 Mbps
          Trellis Coding:         ON                ON
              SNR Margin:        3.0 dB            3.0 dB
            Actual Delay:          0 ms              0 ms
          Transmit Power:        4.0 dBm           0.0 dBm
           Receive Power:        4.1 dBm           3.1 dBm
              Actual INP:      540.0 symbols     550.0 symbols
Attainable Net Data Rate:     48.361 Mbps      328.529 Mbps
============================================================================
Stats recorded 29 Oct 2021 17:18:38

DSLAM type / SW version: BDCM:0xc190 (193.144) / v0xc190
Modem/router firmware:  AnnexA version - A2pvfbH043q.d26u
DSL mode:                G
Status:                  Showtime
Uptime:                  2 hours 10 min 1 sec
Resyncs:                0 (since 29 Oct 2021 15:08:37)

Downstream Upstream
Line attenuation (dB):  29.5 0.0
Signal attenuation (dB): 29.5 0.0
Connection speed (kbps): 329200 49471
SNR margin (dB):        3.1 3.1
Power (dBm):            0.0 4.0
Interleave depth:       
INP:                    550.00 540.00
G.INP:                  Not enabled Not enabled
Vectoring status:        Unknown

RSCorr/RS (%):          0.0072 0.0065
RSUnCorr/RS (%):        0.0000 0.0000
ES/hour:                0 0

Now just waiting for BTwholesale checker to updated
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on October 29, 2021, 05:46:01 PM
Congratulations.  :)  Now just enjoy using the connection (and do your best not to fret over how it is operating).
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 29, 2021, 06:12:30 PM
Thanks I was surprised indeed. Must be my lucky day thanks to engineer spotted it at the DP. I blame the G.fast engineer last May never bother to check DP maybe he didn't aware it was shared pair  ???

Updated: BTw checker has updated now:

Code: [Select]
Telephone Number 01952****** on Exchange CUCKOO OAK is served by Cabinet 8
Featured Products Downstream Line Rate(Mbps) Upstream Line Rate (Mbps) Downstream Handback
Threshold(Mbps) WBC FTTC Availability Date WBC SOGEA Availability Date Left in Jumper
High Low High Low
VDSL Range A (Clean) 80 77.2 20 19 72.2 Available Available --
VDSL Range B (Impacted) 80 75.8 20 19 70.2 Available Available --
G.fast Range A (Clean) 330 330 50 42.1 301.3 Available Available --
G.fast Range B (Impacted) 330 299.7 50 29.3 280.7 Available Available --
Featured Products Downstream Line Rate(Mbps) Upstream Line Rate (Mbps) Downstream Range (Mbps) Availability Date FTTP Install Process
FTTP on Demand 330 50 -- Available --
ADSL Products Downstream Line Rate (Mbps) Upstream Line Rate (Mbps) Downstream Range(Mbps) ADSL Availability Date Left in Jumper
WBC ADSL 2+ Up to 14.5 -- 11 to 18.5 Available --
WBC ADSL2+ Annex M Up to 14.5 Up to 1 11 to 18.5 Available --
WBC Fixed Rate 2 -- -- Available --
SOADSL Products Downstream Line Rate (Mbps) Upstream Line Rate (Mbps) Downstream Range(Mbps) WBC SOADSL Availability Date Left in Jumper
WBC SOADSL 2+ Up to 14.5 -- 11 to 18.5 -- --
SOADSL Fixed Rate Up to 2 -- -- --
Observed Speeds G.FAST VDSL
Max Observed Downstream Speed 328.16 80
Max Observed Upstream Speed 48.34 20
Observed Date 2021-10-29 2021-05-22
Other Offerings Availability Date
VDSL Multicast Available
ADSL Multicast Available
G.fast Multicast Available
Premise Environment Status
Bridge Tap N
VRI N
NTE FacePlate N
Last Test Date 18-10-2021
Exchange Product Restrictions Status
FTTP Priority Exchange N
WLR Withdrawal N
SOADSL Restriction Y

The exchange is not in a current fibre priority programme

WLR is currently available at the exchange

SOADSL is restricted at the exchange

FTTP is not available.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on October 30, 2021, 12:32:56 AM
To be fair, if its not the correct way of doing it (should have been split in the house not at the DP) you can't expect the engineer to predict that.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: tubaman on October 30, 2021, 11:05:45 AM
I think the best thing you can do now is put the Openreach modem back on the line and just leave it alone. You won't have any stats to check and I'd advise not running any speed tests unless the service is obviously running slow.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 30, 2021, 11:38:53 AM
I sold it Openreach Modem on ebay.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: g3uiss on October 30, 2021, 11:57:10 AM
Obviously you just want to keep checking and reporting
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 30, 2021, 12:02:56 PM
I only keeping Gfast 330/50 until next May 2022 because of contract with my isp then join BT home essentials FTTC 40/10 for £15 a month inc line rental because I am on UC. I stopped look at the stats now. No more now because I am on full stats until next May and can't be bothered using dslstats. It's will be uninstalled from my raspberry pi and pc.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: tubaman on October 30, 2021, 12:19:49 PM
I only keeping Gfast 330/50 until next May 2022 because of contract with my isp then join BT home essentials FTTC 40/10 for £15 a month inc line rental because I am on UC. I stopped look at the stats now. No more now because I am on full stats until next May and can't be bothered using dslstats. It's will be uninstalled from my raspberry pi and pc.

If you manage to do what you have said above it'll be a really good step forward for you. Depending on what you are using the internet for then 40/10 might well be more than adequate (It's pretty much all I can get and serves my family perfectly well).
 :)
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on October 30, 2021, 04:59:07 PM
To be fair, if its not the correct way of doing it (should have been split in the house not at the DP) you can't expect the engineer to predict that.

The infrastructure is 2-pair DIG cable from the PCP to a BT52A in the external bin cupboard. The first pair in the DIG cable is connected to the NTE5C + SSFP, in the hall, with CW1308 specification cable. The other two sockets in the premises are disconnected. At some time in the past, before Max took up the tenancy, there was a second service delivered on the second pair of the DIG cable. It appears that when that second service was terminated, the second pair was connected to the first pair at the DP / PCP thus providing a single telephony service at all three sockets. Not the correct way but a quick and easy way to provide the service at all of the sockets. Eventually Max took up the tenancy and had a broadband Internet service provided. Various Openreach technicians have attended and to improve the Internet service sockets two and three were disconnected. Max's earlier VDSL2 service and now the current G.Fast service was / is provided directly to a NTE5 in the hallway. Nothing else within the premises is connected.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on October 30, 2021, 05:09:03 PM
Depending on what you are using the internet for then 40/10 might well be more than adequate (It's pretty much all I can get and serves my family perfectly well).
 :)

Just for myself, an ADSL2 service was perfectly adequate. As is known, my service provider gave me a VDSL2 service (provisioned on the Openreach 40/10 Mbps product) a few months ago. The 40.0 / 9.9 Mbps synchronisation speed is more than I actually need and comes with a bonus . . . The monthly cost is now less.

I'm sure Max will be able to cope with a 40/10 Mbps service.  :)
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 30, 2021, 09:02:41 PM
Before I moved into this property. This house use to have old BT payphone on the wall in my bedroom before the council removed it off. This house has three BT sockets and two virgin media sockets. My local shop spars told me there use to be house sharing in my house with five people's living there mostly are students from Telford and Wolverhampton.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on October 30, 2021, 09:06:05 PM
Before I moved into this property. This house use to have old BT payphone on the wall in my bedroom before the council removed it off. This house has three BT sockets and two virgin media sockets.

I remember you telling me the above, some years ago.

Quote
My local shop spars told me there use to be house sharing in my house with five people's living there mostly are students from Telford and Wolverhampton.

Ah, that is probably the reason for the odd, historic, wiring.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: Weaver on October 30, 2021, 11:39:38 PM
I remind our friend that 40 Mbps d/s is ~15 times faster than my speed per line, but I do have three lines, so only ~5.7 times faster compared with the total. And the upstream is 10 times faster. So I dream about your 2022 speed.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 31, 2021, 01:54:58 AM
Max line rate now 347/61 with this very short dsl cable.

Line capped 330/50

Code: [Select]
xdslctl info --pbParams
xdslctl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason:    1
Last initialization procedure status:   0
Max:    Upstream rate = 61129 Kbps, Downstream rate = 347287 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 49997 Kbps, Downstream rate = 329995 Kbps

Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (348,1300)
DS: (342,1194)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (348,1300)
DS: (342,1131)
VDSL Port Details               Upstream                Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate:        61129 kbps             347287 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power:          4.1 dBm                 0.0 dBm
====================================================================================
  VDSL Band Status U0 U1 U2 U3 U4 D1 D2 D3
  Line Attenuation(dB): N/A 0.0 N/A N/A N/A 29.2 N/A N/A
Signal Attenuation(dB): N/A 0.0 N/A N/A N/A 29.2 N/A N/A
        SNR Margin(dB): N/A 0.0 N/A N/A N/A 0.0 N/A N/A
         TX Power(dBm): N/A 0.0 N/A N/A N/A 0.0 N/A N/A
        kl0(dBx100):      N/A     N/A     N/A     N/A     N/A     N/A     N/A     N/A   
ZySH>

DSLAM type / SW version: BDCM:0xc190 (193.144) / v0xc190
Modem/router firmware:  AnnexA version - A2pvfbH043q.d26u
DSL mode:                G
Status:                  Showtime
Uptime:                  1 hour 13 min 17 sec
Resyncs:                0 (since 31 Oct 2021 01:02:05)

Downstream Upstream
Line attenuation (dB):  29.2 0.0
Signal attenuation (dB): 29.2 0.0
Connection speed (kbps): 329995 49997
SNR margin (dB):        2.9 3.0
Power (dBm):            0.0 4.1
Interleave depth:       
INP:                    550.00 540.00
G.INP:                  Not enabled Not enabled
Vectoring status:        Unknown

RSCorr/RS (%):          0.0023 0.0499
RSUnCorr/RS (%):        0.0000 0.0000
ES/hour:                0 0

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: Jon21 on October 31, 2021, 01:08:57 AM
Is that stranded copper cable thatís just been twisted together? Canít help but think that your asking for trouble there when it inevitably falls apart. Nice use of the food waste bin though as a stand/table/shelf.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 31, 2021, 01:12:50 AM
Yes twister together for now as I will ask my friend to soldering it together one day.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: j0hn on October 31, 2021, 02:10:56 AM
Yes twister together for now as I will ask my friend to soldering it together one day.

LOL! Noooo!
IDC connections, a couple gel crimps would do.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on October 31, 2021, 02:32:28 AM
LOL! Noooo!
IDC connections, a couple gel crimps would do.

Or, you know, just buy a short pre--made twister-pair cable.

Honestly I don't see the point though considering he is going to downgrade the service when the contract runs out.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: tubaman on October 31, 2021, 02:22:45 PM
Why are you fiddling around with a twisted together cable that's likely to cause you problems. Just use the one supplied with the router and leave it alone. At this speed if it loses you a couple of meg it really doesn't matter.
You really are your own worst enemy at times Max!
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on October 31, 2021, 02:47:58 PM
D'oh!
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 31, 2021, 02:52:36 PM
Went back to normal dsl cable now. The two twisted cable are now in the bin
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on October 31, 2021, 03:22:58 PM
Went back to normal dsl cable now. The two twisted cable are now in the bin

Good. That is sensible.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on October 31, 2021, 05:17:25 PM
Good. That is sensible.

Nice table! My mum brought me year ago. 1metre high speed dsl cable from tandy online few years ago as I use that for FTTC and G.fast now.

Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on November 02, 2021, 02:50:29 AM
My line went down for 20 minutes and come back on. I can see the G.fast dslam software version has changed.

Code: [Select]
DSLAM type / SW version: BDCM:0xc190 (193.145) / v0xc190
Modem/router firmware:  AnnexA version - A2pvfbH043q.d26u
DSL mode:                G.fast 106 MHz
Status:                  Showtime
Uptime:                  0 hour 2 min 10 sec
Resyncs:                1 (since 02 Nov 2021 02:42:06)

Downstream Upstream
Line attenuation (dB):  30.6 0.0
Signal attenuation (dB): 30.6 0.0
Connection speed (kbps): 329999 49999
SNR margin (dB):        2.9 2.9
Power (dBm):            0.0 4.1
Interleave depth:        2.0 1.0
INP:                    551.00 607.00
G.INP:                  Enabled Enabled
Vectoring status:        Enabled Enabled

RSCorr/RS (%):          0.0010 0.0022
RSUnCorr/RS (%):        0.0000 0.0000
ES/hour:                0 0
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on November 02, 2021, 05:24:23 AM
More interesting is that its now correctly reporting interleave depth, G.INP and Vectoring.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: j0hn on November 02, 2021, 11:02:24 AM
DSL Mode also now showing as "G.fast 106 MHz" rather than just "G"
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: dee.jay on November 02, 2021, 02:51:26 PM
Nice table! My mum brought me year ago. 1metre high speed dsl cable from tandy online few years ago as I use that for FTTC and G.fast now.

Just move the table closer to the socket!
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: maxheadroom on November 02, 2021, 05:42:45 PM
Or stop chasing the ultimate speed go back to 80/20 stop doing speed tests and enjoy life.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on November 05, 2021, 07:08:46 PM
Got new dsl cable 10cm length. Happy with it overall. Will use that for my current G.fast then FTTC 40/10.



[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: Weaver on November 05, 2021, 07:20:08 PM
Be careful that you donít end up accidentally damaging the plugs/sockets. I wouldnít go with anything shorter than 30 cm myself. And difference between 30 cm and 50 cm wonít be that much unless you have strong local sources of interference and really bad cable.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on November 05, 2021, 07:53:27 PM
Be careful that you donít end up accidentally staring the plugs/sockets. I wouldnít go with anything shorter than 30 cm myself. And difference between 30 cm and 50 cm wonít be that much unless you have strong local sources of interference and really bad cable.

If anything going too short could cause more problems.

You're forcing the router closer to the mains outlet and PSU, sources of interference.
You're putting it somewhere it can get kicked and pick up more dust off the floor.
Its the LEAST optimal place for WiFi reception.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on November 05, 2021, 07:55:22 PM
OK thanks. I will put it back 1metre dsl cable back on and binned that shorter cable didn't know it will make it worsen.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on November 05, 2021, 08:54:56 PM
OK thanks. I will put it back 1metre dsl cable back on and binned that shorter cable didn't know it will make it worsen.

A one metre (or one yard) cable is probably the most appropriate default length for a domestic installation.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on November 05, 2021, 08:59:31 PM
Thanks I have put that one metre dsl high speed with electric noise (orange) cut out electricity inference 50cm length cable
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on November 05, 2021, 10:29:51 PM
Have you given any thought to the number of times that the G.Fast circuit has now been retrained? And in what time frame?  :-\

G.Fast is just a particular variant of xDSL, with a DLM process watching over each circuit.

Please stop fiddling with things . . . just use the service.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: tubaman on November 06, 2021, 12:04:33 PM
...

Please stop fiddling with things . . . just use the service.

I'll second that. Just use it and leave it alone. Don't look at the stats and don't run speed tests unless it's very obvious that something isn't right.
Please!!
 :)
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: meritez on November 06, 2021, 12:18:19 PM
Got new dsl cable 10cm length. Happy with it overall. Will use that for my current G.fast then FTTC 40/10.

What happens when you have to use the bin?
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on November 09, 2021, 12:40:19 PM
I am now using Openreach Modem directly to TP Link Wireless Router with 1 metre dsl cable.

No more stats, no more dslstats and no more speed check. Not anymore.

Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: jelv on November 09, 2021, 01:18:08 PM
binned that shorter cable

In the past you've made us aware that your financial situation isn't as good as it could be. Have you ever totted up how much money you have wasted due to your obsession with the speed of your internet connection?
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: g3uiss on November 09, 2021, 02:47:22 PM
And you said you sold the openreach modem on eBay
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on November 09, 2021, 02:59:47 PM
The isp advise me not to sell Openreach modem during the contract period because if the fault was on the line you have to use Openreach supplier modem to avoid any charge if they found no fault of my own router
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on November 09, 2021, 04:55:40 PM
I am now using Openreach Modem directly to TP Link Wireless Router with 1 metre dsl cable.

No more stats, no more dslstats and no more speed check. Not anymore.

That is a very sensible decision.

Remember that you can "talk" about anything (within reason, of course) in "Chit Chat (https://forum.kitz.co.uk/index.php/board,9.0.html)".  :)
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: tubaman on November 09, 2021, 04:58:18 PM
I sold it Openreach Modem on ebay.
I am now using Openreach Modem directly to TP Link Wireless Router with 1 metre dsl cable.

No more stats, no more dslstats and no more speed check. Not anymore.


Which quote above is true Max because this is getting very confusing.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: adslmax on November 09, 2021, 05:20:10 PM
Mod can you locked this thread as this have to closed thread now.
Title: Re: Openreach fixed G.fast due to incorrect DP pair shared
Post by: burakkucat on November 09, 2021, 05:24:02 PM
Mod can you locked this thread as this have to closed thread now.

Yes, if you so wish, it will be done. And to be honest, this thread has now meandered away from its opening topic.  :-X