Kitz Forum

Broadband Related => FTTP Rollout => Topic started by: S.Stephenson on June 07, 2021, 09:03:12 PM

Title: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: S.Stephenson on June 07, 2021, 09:03:12 PM
 https://www.openreach.com/fibre-broadband/fibre-first/where-and-when-were-building-ultrafast-full-fibre-broadband (https://www.openreach.com/fibre-broadband/fibre-first/where-and-when-were-building-ultrafast-full-fibre-broadband)

My exchange is within the plans now.  :fingers:
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Black Sheep on June 07, 2021, 09:09:55 PM
Nice find - and knowing which Exchange area's are pencilled in right up to 2024, that I am aware of within my own work area that is ... I'd say that is bang on the money !!
 
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: S.Stephenson on June 07, 2021, 09:23:43 PM
I take it that if you live in a shack deep in the woods in an exchange area that the odds of getting fttp still are close to zero.

I'm in a fairly populated place so I'm hoping I'm in the initial plans for the area.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on June 07, 2021, 11:44:38 PM
They've still not updated the Availability Checker though, just the map and the PDF.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: dee.jay on June 08, 2021, 10:09:43 AM
Thanks for this - I couldn't find it this morning!

Just as well I wanted to look, BT have announced FTTP plans for my area :) (Or at least they've specifically called out the exchange that I am connected to)

And indeed, the map now shows where I live in Red (In plan).

Happy days, it's a start.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: kjw on June 08, 2021, 10:32:35 AM
Now begins the constant refresh to see it change from red to yellow to purple!

I know the feeling well :) We changed to purple back in Jan 2020, with surveying and work starting in September (one of the first rural builds) and finally went live in the last few weeks!

Its worth the wait!
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: GigabitEthernet on June 08, 2021, 11:00:44 AM
Map doesn't seem to work very well at present.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: GigabitEthernet on June 08, 2021, 11:02:02 AM
Openreach were kind enough to tell me Wandsworth is in scope to be done by the end of 2023.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: meritez on June 08, 2021, 11:39:54 AM
Wow I'm purple!  :o
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: dee.jay on June 08, 2021, 11:43:27 AM
Now begins the constant refresh to see it change from red to yellow to purple!

I know the feeling well :) We changed to purple back in Jan 2020, with surveying and work starting in September (one of the first rural builds) and finally went live in the last few weeks!

Its worth the wait!

Ah so we're looking at 9-12 months from now? Not terrible - least we know it's coming. I've tried to find out a better ballpark date for our area.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: tubaman on June 08, 2021, 12:13:07 PM
Not even in the planning stage where I live. I suspect I'll be on FTTC for many more years  :(
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Ronski on June 08, 2021, 01:27:12 PM
We showed up on the map in February 2020 roughly, and whilst loads of area's around us are going live, apart from our estate being surveyed, nothing else has happened, as we are DIG, so being left to last as more expensive to do  :(
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: dee.jay on June 08, 2021, 02:06:44 PM
I've seen OR putting new kit on poles in my area too lately. Is this indicative of anything?
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: kjw on June 08, 2021, 02:34:28 PM
I've seen OR putting new kit on poles in my area too lately. Is this indicative of anything?

Depends what they have been fitting! If its a CBT, or splitter then it looks good :)
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on June 08, 2021, 09:54:30 PM
Wow I'm purple!  :o

You might want to check yourself into the hospital for that. ;)

I've seen OR putting new kit on poles in my area too lately. Is this indicative of anything?

If it looks like any of these then time to get excited.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: meritez on June 08, 2021, 10:09:33 PM
You might want to check yourself into the hospital for that. ;)

If it looks like any of these then time to get excited.

Is it a known vaccine side effect?
https://support.aa.net.uk/VoIP_How_to:_Voice_reinjection
Curious about this
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: burakkucat on June 09, 2021, 12:36:55 AM
https://support.aa.net.uk/VoIP_How_to:_Voice_reinjection
Curious about this

There is no great magic involved once you've looked at the circuit diagram. That page is poorly written and is a bit garbled.

Basically the components between the telephony socket on the front of the SSFP and the "test socket" on the back plate are removed, thus isolating the the telephony side from the incoming pair. Once that has been done, the telephony socket on the front of the SSFP can be used to re-inject back into the local telephony extension wiring.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on June 09, 2021, 02:19:00 AM
Or rip the extension cable out the back and crimp an RJ11 on it.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: dee.jay on June 09, 2021, 06:54:32 AM
You might want to check yourself into the hospital for that. ;)

If it looks like any of these then time to get excited.

I think so? I've only driven last and I think there are covers or something on them but looks familiar.

Where I live all cabling is underground and we are further up from where I e seen those on poles. Fingers crossed the plans cover our street too.......
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Bowdon on June 09, 2021, 10:39:06 AM
I just checked the map and its very strange for my area.

Most of the rural areas are in the plan yet nothing for either Oldham (and my area Shaw) or Rochdale.

OR seem to be working backwards. I don't really understand it from a business view. Surely it is more profitable to install FTTP in populated areas first as there is more chance of take-up with a bigger customer base. But instead they seem to be focusing on rural areas first which as a lower amount of people in them, at least in my part of the country.

It looks like the government have incentivised them so much to focus on the rural areas that urban areas, unless its a MDU, are a lower priority.

So it looks like I won't be getting FTTP until after 2026  :(
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: SlimJ on June 09, 2021, 12:53:13 PM
Surely it is more profitable to install FTTP in populated areas first as there is more chance of take-up with a bigger customer base. But instead they seem to be focusing on rural areas first which as a lower amount of people in them, at least in my part of the country.

I agree and disagree to some extent. Many urban areas are already likely to have decent FTTC services so therefore the majority of the potential customers are likely to be more than happy with their current connections and are less likely to upgrade until such time that they feel they need a faster service.

Whereas, those in rural areas (like myself) where my connection is an 'adequate' 20 / 1Mbps (but can be unstable and unreliable at times) would be more inclined to jump on the opportunity of an upgrade to FTTP service once available.  Out of the 10 properties in our rural area where we are all sub-superfast, 7 of us have pledged our gigabit vouchers as part of a CFP to receive full fibre here - we should have the infrastructure in place by February next year.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: S.Stephenson on June 09, 2021, 02:28:54 PM
Maybe with the data that Openreach has they figure its not worth competing with Virgin Media in some areas?

Barnsley has no plans as far as I can see and Cityfibre are doing the work right now, Pontefract was recently connected by VM and isn't on any plans either.

Question is will Openreach actually surrender some areas to Cityfibre and Virgin Media?
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: niemand on June 09, 2021, 02:48:50 PM
It's not the final plan to 2026, neither is it a complete list of everything being built right now let alone 5 years out.

Have a look at all the gaps in London, Birmingham, Leeds, Manchester, etc, etc.

Think that's a tad more than 5 million premises missing.

I can see 2 exchanges in Leeds MDC alone that are receiving Fibre First builds, that's literally the project names, and aren't featured on the map or lists.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: GigabitEthernet on June 09, 2021, 03:47:02 PM
It's not the final plan to 2026, neither is it a complete list of everything being built right now let alone 5 years out.

Have a look at all the gaps in London, Birmingham, Leeds, Manchester, etc, etc.

Think that's a tad more than 5 million premises missing.

I can see 2 exchanges in Leeds MDC alone that are receiving Fibre First builds, that's literally the project names, and aren't featured on the map or lists.

Yes, Wandsworth is missing but is in scope as I mentioned above.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: highpriest on June 11, 2021, 09:24:04 AM
Not even in the planning stage where I live. I suspect I'll be on FTTC for many more years  :(

Same. We are last in line to get anything new, as always. Meanwhile in other cities like Bath, there are 4 different operators rolling out fibre ???

https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2021/06/cityfibre-uk-starts-1gbps-fibre-broadband-rollout-in-bath.html

As an added bonus, we also have some of the worst 4G coverage in the country (all carriers).

Does any of our "insiders" know if there are any plans for Winchester? Thanks.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: highpriest on June 11, 2021, 09:37:53 AM
I agree and disagree to some extent. Many urban areas are already likely to have decent FTTC services so therefore the majority of the potential customers are likely to be more than happy with their current connections and are less likely to upgrade until such time that they feel they need a faster service.

Only if you are lucky to live close enough to the cabinet (as I do). Friend of mine lives much further away from her cabinet and she only gets 20 down, 3 up :shrug2:
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: parkdale on June 11, 2021, 10:24:13 AM
Does any of our "insiders" know if there are any plans for Winchester? Thanks.

My Dad lives about 100m from Barton Farm >:D (all new builds... maybe FTTP?) he's still using ADSL supplied from a cab in Park road.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: dee.jay on June 11, 2021, 10:45:51 AM
I agree and disagree to some extent. Many urban areas are already likely to have decent FTTC services so therefore the majority of the potential customers are likely to be more than happy with their current connections and are less likely to upgrade until such time that they feel they need a faster service.

FTTC is not always reliable though - it is susceptible to crosstalk and other factors. Crosstalk has robbed me of 20Mbit downstream on each circuit over the years. I had FTTC literally the first weekend it was available here (Way back in April 2012!) and 80Mbit all the way.

Also, FTTP month to month will be cheaper for me (but then I am the outlier because I have two x FTTC circuits as it is)
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: SlimJ on June 11, 2021, 11:11:38 AM
Crosstalk has robbed me of 20Mbit downstream on each circuit over the years. I had FTTC literally the first weekend it was available here (Way back in April 2012!) and 80Mbit all the way.

Also, FTTP month to month will be cheaper for me (but then I am the outlier because I have two x FTTC circuits as it is)

Hence why I said the majority - I think many here (including ISPReview and TB forums) that already have 50/60Mbit+ would be part of a small minority in the grand scheme of things that would jump on to FTTP when it becomes available. The majority of users with already decent FTTC connections are not likely to care enough to upgrade until such time that Ultrafast services are cheaper and there's a need for extra speed.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Bowdon on June 11, 2021, 11:25:34 AM
The problem with FTTC is the more popular it becomes the less well it functions as its more susceptable to cross talk/interference.

I think 4G and 5G services could have been deployed to more rural places as a stop gap until FTTP was rolled. Then all those on ADSL technology could have at least upgraded to faster speeds. The deployment would have been faster, and could have been a stop gap of a few years before the FTTP upgrade happened. So by 2027 you'd have a world class FTTP system and world class 5G services too.

CarlT made a good point earlier that there are many highly populated areas that so far haven't featured in any public plans. In my area Manchester hasn't been in any announced plans by either OR or CityFibre yet they are both there. I can see them via roadworks website.

I wonder if OR are only publishing smaller areas because they are less commercially viable to their rivals. Then later on suddenly the bigger areas will appear in plans, when they are already half done.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: highpriest on June 11, 2021, 11:31:40 AM
Hence why I said the majority - I think many here (including ISPReview and TB forums) that already have 50/60Mbit+ would be part of a small minority in the grand scheme of things that would jump on to FTTP when it becomes available. The majority of users with already decent FTTC connections are not likely to care enough to upgrade until such time that Ultrafast services are cheaper and there's a need for extra speed.

You are also assuming that everyone with decent ADSL in your rural area will upgrade to full fibre when it is available.

You'd be surprised. Especially over the past year, with increased WFH and remote lessons for kids and so on, having fast broadband (faster than FTTC) is more important than ever. My wife and I both work from home and when kids are using the internet as well, 80/20 can get pretty stretched. There's also the fact that most people will not get full FTTC speeds and various other factors can affect reliability and stability of the connection.

My colleagues in Southampton who live in the coverage area of Toob (https://www.toob.co.uk/) have all upgraded. At £25 a month for a 900 Mbps symmetrical connection, why wouldn't you?
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: SlimJ on June 11, 2021, 12:33:06 PM
You are also assuming that everyone with decent ADSL in your rural area will upgrade to full fibre when it is available.

You'd be surprised. Especially over the past year, with increased WFH and remote lessons for kids and so on, having fast broadband (faster than FTTC) is more important than ever. My wife and I both work from home and when kids are using the internet as well, 80/20 can get pretty stretched. There's also the fact that most people will not get full FTTC speeds and various other factors can affect reliability and stability of the connection.

My colleagues in Southampton who live in the coverage area of Toob (https://www.toob.co.uk/) have all upgraded. At £25 a month for a 900 Mbps symmetrical connection, why wouldn't you?

My rural area, ADSL is probably 5Mbps at best, the exchange is too far away. Most with 'decent' ADSL are probably still likely to be slower than my current speed of 20/1Mbps. Like I say, 7 out of the 10 households in our area have opted to upgrade to FTTP as part of a CFP.

Myself and my partner WFH over the past year, she is a teacher doing online lessons, apart from our poor upload speeds we didn't have any issues (however, we don't have kids).  I don't quite understand how your 80/20Mbps connection is being stretched though - in our offices, we have around 30 staff, we have a 70/18Mbps connection and we don't feel the need for any more bandwidth currently (we're uploading/downloading files, managing servers, Google Meets/Zoom, using the internet for our call centre system, etc).

The Toob service, I agree, but the price point is the same as what I pay for my current connection. It's a different value proposition compared with the Openreach 900Mbps service (£25 vs £60) - I personally can't justify spending £60 for a 900Mbps service (different story if it weas £25!).
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: highpriest on June 11, 2021, 12:42:41 PM
Myself and my partner WFH over the past year, she is a teacher doing online lessons, apart from our poor upload speeds we didn't have any issues (however, we don't have kids).  I don't quite understand how your 80/20Mbps connection is being stretched though - in our offices, we have around 30 staff, we have a 70/18Mbps connection and we don't feel the need for any more bandwidth currently (we're uploading/downloading files, managing servers, Google Meets/Zoom, using the internet for our call centre system, etc).

It's mainly due to the nature of my job which involves sometimes uploading vast quantities of data. When others are using the internet, especially for video calling, the upstream bandwidth is limited, which means long waits for me.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: gt94sss2 on June 11, 2021, 01:42:10 PM
I wonder if OR are only publishin smaller areas because they are less commercially viable to their rivals. Then later on suddenly the bigger areas will appear in plans, when they are already half done.

If OR announce rural areas as part of their commercial rollout, those areas become ineligible for BDUK type funding.

Big cities like London and Manchester are always more likely to have a competitor so there is little benefit to announcing those areas in advance - neither would they be public funded.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: GigabitEthernet on June 12, 2021, 08:45:29 AM
People also have forgotten reliability as a major draw of FTTP. Doesnít go down in thunderstorms, no HR faults etc
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Ronski on June 12, 2021, 08:59:46 AM
My colleagues in Southampton who live in the coverage area of Toob (https://www.toob.co.uk/) have all upgraded. At £25 a month for a 900 Mbps symmetrical connection, why wouldn't you?

Lack of product knowledge and availability. My brother occasionally does some computer work for a local printers, but only when their IT man can't handle it.

Their ISP initiated a move from ADSL to VDSL, they plugged the new router in and nothing worked, so called my brother. I knew their VDSL cabinet had been live since early 2017, in fact from their front door you can see the cabinet, about 50 meters away, if that. So here we have a printers that surely must be uploading/downloading proofs etc, yet they've been running on ADSL when they had 80/20 VDSL available for 4 years!

900/900 for £25, yes please!
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on June 12, 2021, 09:21:37 AM
People also have forgotten reliability as a major draw of FTTP. Doesnít go down in thunderstorms, no HR faults etc

Its not the going down in thunderstorms that bothers me, its the fact it could take the entire house network with it.  Its the ONLY reason I plan to port my number to VoIP the second I can, no longer having to unplug the broadband in a storm.  Most people don't think to do that, but once you've had something fried with a lightening hit once, you never forget it.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Alex Atkin UK on June 12, 2021, 09:23:50 AM
900/900 for £25, yes please!

My usage would probably bankrupt them.  I already killed off Digital Region!  ::) :lol:
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: adslmax on June 13, 2021, 02:18:12 AM
I use this checker rather than openreach site cos it lots quicker to find it: https://api.superfastmaps.co.uk/fibrecities/2.0/
TF7 (no planned yet) oh well I have to be very patient!  :fingers:
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: gt94sss2 on June 13, 2021, 10:51:25 AM
Openreach were kind enough to tell me Wandsworth is in scope to be done by the end of 2023.

While good news, by then I expect a lot of Wandsworth to be covered by Community Fibre or g.network.

Openreach really need to upgrade this area faster, if they don't want others to eat their lunch..
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: niemand on June 13, 2021, 11:31:58 AM
Which means diverting resources from elsewhere, probably within Greater London and also being overbuilt.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: GigabitEthernet on June 13, 2021, 04:20:45 PM
While good news, by then I expect a lot of Wandsworth to be covered by Community Fibre or g.network.

Openreach really need to upgrade this area faster, if they don't want others to eat their lunch..

Fair point although isnít Community Fibre mostly doing blocks not houses? G.network though is an interesting one.

Also possibility of a Virgin Media expansion? There are streets where they seemed to just stop for reasons unknown.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: gt94sss2 on June 13, 2021, 04:55:22 PM
Fair point although isnít Community Fibre mostly doing blocks not houses? G.network though is an interesting one.

Community Fibre are also doing quite a few streets. I know they are doing the Southfields grid for instance.

Quote
Also possibility of a Virgin Media expansion? There are streets where they seemed to just stop for reasons unknown.

As I live in one of those streets, that would be nice but the cable network was installed in the 90s by what was then Videotron - don't think VM have any plans to infill anything here.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: Chrysalis on June 13, 2021, 09:04:58 PM
Map is interesting, can see they now got some tiny Leicestershire villages as planned.  Which probably have extremely weak commercial case.  But the page at least admits now there is political leverage. (government road plan).  The city completely blank.

They not covering the bigger towns in Leicestershire though, the coverage is mostly over farmland. The biggest village covered has just 3600 population.

Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: S.Stephenson on June 13, 2021, 11:26:22 PM
Wish they at least gave a year or something so Iím not obsessed checking roadworks and news all the time .
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: dee.jay on June 15, 2021, 08:37:55 AM
I use this checker rather than openreach site cos it lots quicker to find it: https://api.superfastmaps.co.uk/fibrecities/2.0/
TF7 (no planned yet) oh well I have to be very patient!  :fingers:

Nice, direct link to the map underneath the website! Very useful, thank you.
Title: Re: BT Fibre First map updated today
Post by: adrenalize on June 16, 2021, 12:19:58 AM
Map is interesting, can see they now got some tiny Leicestershire villages as planned.  Which probably have extremely weak commercial case.  But the page at least admits now there is political leverage. (government road plan).  The city completely blank.

They not covering the bigger towns in Leicestershire though, the coverage is mostly over farmland. The biggest village covered has just 3600 population.
To the very west of Leicetershire where I am for the last couple of years OR have been rolling FTTP out to a lot of previously sub 10Mbps premises (slowly) and in the last 6 months there has been a lot more activity. Our exchange area has been added to the Fibre villages plan (Dec 2026) and even more surprisingly they appear to be retrofitting the estate I am on (circa 2006) - I guess because spine cabling runs close already due to previouslbuild and it is ducted - so a cheap/quick win (blockages depending!). I can't see any other part of the village in plan yet! Pretty weak commercially though.