Kitz Forum
Broadband Related => ADSL Issues => Topic started by: NoEsquire on March 20, 2021, 04:11:46 PM
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Hi folks - apologies if this post is a little wayward but I'm looking for some advice from you geniuses on what I may be able to do to improve our connection speed at our property.
Let me tell you a story.
We moved into our house a couple of years ago in the middle of a high density residential neighbourhood in one of the UK's largest urban areas. A cursory check seemed to suggest that we were able to get fibre to the cabinet, but that proved to be incorrect after we moved (and I managed a successful takedown on the offending ISP marketing team via the Advertising Standards Authority). We set up an ADSL contract with BT and had speeds of 6-8mb/s for a year or so before the line presumably developed some kind of fault as our speeds plummeted to basically unusable rates (<2mb/s down, <0.2mb/s up). BT were unable to fix the fault despite (apparently) repeatedly trying and claiming it was fixed, so we got out of that contract and have been using an unlimited 4G plan since.
Our 4G coverage will tend to give 7-10mb/s down and weirdly anywhere from 3-15mb/s up. Nothing to write home about but an improvement - however we have been experiencing an increasing number of dropouts and coverage issues so this isn't an ideal set up for us longterm.
Throughout all of this I have been in an endless dialogue with OpenReach to try and establish why we don't have fibre to our cabinet and why we're not in their plans for further fibre network improvements, despite properties just a few doors down and the vast majority of our neighbourhood benefiting from FTTC. I have repeatedly submitted OR 'Community Leads Portal' requests to see if we can fund the work ourselves and have only recently received a quote back for £14,000 for fibre to the property; not strictly what I am requesting. Ironically we have been assigned a 'Rural Engagement Officer' from OR, despite living in the middle of a large town with fibre in touching distance. I have spoken to BT regarding the broadband universal service (https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-telecoms-and-internet/advice-for-consumers/broadband-uso-need-to-know) but again they are basically unwilling to help.
I have even spoken with our MP who says he will "have a word" with BT; but that is also presumably into the void.
You may think I am being precious and that there are plenty of other UK residents in similar or worse positions than us. But our connection is affecting our ability to work from home let alone function as a modern household and is a constant headache for me personally. We are considering moving!
So what I am requesting (aside from an opportunity to vent - thanks for reading!) is any tips or advice on what I can do. Is there anything I can do to put pressure on OR to include our cabinet in their rollout plans? Any help or sympathy welcome.
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Welcome to the forum....
My first question is what does the BT Broadband Availability Checker say about your property, either using phone number (if you have a land line) or the address checker? It would be useful to know your general location as this may also help us to help you. There are some very knowledgeable folks here who will obviously comment further.
Stuart
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Talk to Andrews and Arnold (AA) who are extremely good at sorting out Openreach. See aa.net.uk. I have had just such a fault which has been very persistent and AA have got it sorted out quickly again and again. It doesn’t cost anything to talk to them. :-)
If you need more speed now, AA can set up a second line and tie the two together for full double speed in both directions, ie. a single download or upload will go twice as fast. Warning: this will not be cheap, so have your wallet ready, but the results are superb. I have done this, but with four lines that are much slower than yours, giving a combined total of approx 10.5 / 1.25 Mbps measured TCP payload.
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Welcome to the forum.
It sounds like you need a communication provider fighting your corner.
Do you know which street cabinet you are connected to?
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In the short term, have you checked other 4G providers? I had pretty poor results from Three with drop outs, they went away when I switched to Voxi (Vodafone). Granted I'm practically on the doorstep of that tower.
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And I forgot to say “welcome to the forum” too! :)
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Firstly thanks all for the warm welcome. I half expected this post to be shot down so I really appreciate the helpful advice.
what does the BT Broadband Availability Checker say about your property? … t would be useful to know your general location as this may also help us to help you.
BT can offer us ‘standard broadband’ with 5mb-11mb download. I know for a fact that our line will struggle to achieve this - we cancelled BT contract with 1-2mb down because they were unable to fix this and meet their guarantee and seemingly incapable of fixing it.
We just started a new contract with TalkTalk who offered a 5.7mb/s guarantee. Guess what? We don’t get near that. I know just flipping ISP wasn’t going to fix any hardware issues on the line but I was curious and can now look forward to more endless discussions with TalkTalk to get them to ether investigate the fault or rip up the contract.
I live in Poole in Dorset. I have mapped out our local area according to whether fibre is available using Open Reach’s checker - as you can see it is somewhat inconsistent: https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/edit?mid=1igleOqYYuOzMzUb-SkYSHVMLdnfTeSPj&usp=sharing
Talk to Andrews and Arnold (AA) who are extremely good at sorting out Openreach.
Thanks for the tip! I’ll get in touch with them. Interesting about the doubling up of the lines - certainly an option I’d be interested in exploring.
It sounds like you need a communication provider fighting your corner.
Do you know which street cabinet you are connected to?
Yep I know our cabinet number and our exchange. We’re quite far from the exchange I think (1km) which is likely a contributing factor. But as I say, cabinets around us have fibre so it surely feels achievable.
When you say 'communication provider', would the aforementioned Andrews and Arnold be an example; or are you talking about some other kind of body?
have you checked other 4G providers?
When we made the decision to abandon BT broadband and go for 4G about 6 months ago, I tested a whole bunch of SIM cards and we decided to go for Vodafone as they had the highest speeds in our tests (15-20mb/s) and had an unlimited data no-contract plan. Speeds have dropped since then to the 7-10mb I mentioned, not totally sure why but just another twist in the tale. Plus the connection seems somewhat unreliable. It drops out sometimes and also it often seems to take a couple of seconds delay when a device makes a request. So the speed is generally OK but the connection isn’t optimal. That behaviour is observed using a TP Link 4G router over both Wifi and ethernet.
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Looking at your map that's pretty appalling inconsistency in coverage, I am truly surprised for such a large urban conurbation. I am surprised that BTOR are not installing proper FTTP in your area. I'm guessing you don't have Virgin Media fibre in your area, if you did BTOR might be more inclined to improve their offering. Competition talks ;)
Stuart
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A communications provider just means an ISP effectively. So yes, AA is a normal ISP. They used to have a "fix your line in a month" deal for new customers; I haven’t checked to see if this is still running. Ask them for help and advice - that doesn’t cost you anything and then you can decide if they’re right for you and whether you wants go for the double speed ‘bonding’ option. There are other ways of doing bonding but some of them have weaknesses, such as requiring that two downloads to be in progress at the same time to see the benefit, or not speeding up uploads only downloads. Others may be able to advise about alternative bonding methods. The combination of AA plus the right router gives full n x speed in both direction on everything including single down-/uploads.
I have DSL lines that are good for approx 2.7 / 0.4 Mbps IP throughput. Bonding four lines gives me a measured TCP payload rate of 10.5 Mbps down and ~1.2 Mbps upstream, from various speed testers so it’s very effective in both directions. For some reason, the upstream efficiency is not as good as the downstream. That could be because one of my lines has a slow upstream and it may be that the unequal rates cause some upset to TCP’s performance. I ought to test this theory by temporarily switching that slow upstream line out some time, as an experiment. If you have fewer lines then you will get better performance.
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Gonna take a stab in the dark that you're off Cab79 or Cab46, based on the wide geographical area ??
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P15? as far as I can tell.
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I'm guessing you don't have Virgin Media fibre in your area, if you did BTOR might be more inclined to improve their offering. Competition talks ;)
Stuart
Just checked near cab 79 and and Virgin Media is available for postcode BH12 3BB, actually looking on TBB it looks like most the area is covered https://labs.thinkbroadband.com/local/broadband-map#15/50.7255/-1.9386/virgin/
NoEsquire, have you tried Virgin (https://www.virginmedia.com/shop/bundles)?
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Virgin would be dramatically faster. Even though the performance would be variable, according to reliable reports, it would be far better than ADSL2.
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Weaver, its very dependant on area, and I think its fairly safe to say that the congestion issues they have such a bad reputation for are very few and far between now, but some areas still have issues. My speeds don't vary much at all, day or night, I just absolutely hate dealing with them, its a nightmare if you get a problem as I have had on a couple of occasions, and negotiating a new deal can be difficult, but was actually pretty easy this year. I don't like VM, never have done, but with the choice of 40/6Mbps VDSL or 370/36 (I could go faster still) on Virgin, it's an easy decision.
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P15? as far as I can tell.
Ah yes, I missed that beast as I scoured through Cab's with associated DSLAM's. Cab15 is indeed still copper only.
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I had a good look around and Cab 15 is surrounded by FTTC cab's :( ???
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We are on Cab15, yep.
If I put my postcode into Virgin's checker, it sends me down the path of putting in my personal details as they aren't sure what we can get. On submitting the form it says that they will get in touch within 10 working days, but never ever do.
I got a reply back from our OpenReaech 'Rural Engagement Officer' (lol) who says that their Communited Leads Portal process is only for getting fibre to the property and not to the cabinet. She suggested getting in touch with our local authority, which sounds suspiciously like passing the buck. She said copper is being replaced 'within 4-5 years'.
A&A have also said that there's not really anything they can do to expediate fibre to cab15 but that they do offer a 'fix my line' service to new customers to try and improve the ADSL connection.
It's just so infuriating - it's like I can't get anybody to listen to my concerns. I know I am just one poor sod who doesn't deserve special treatment but the advice from OfCom literally says "Every home and business in the UK has the legal right to request a decent, affordable broadband connection", but that is just hot air because there's seemingly no route for me to inact that request. OR say do the Community Portal but then quote £14,000 for FTTP. I think any voucher schemes for this are also about to expire anyway.
It's just bonkers to me that in 2021 I have to connect our house over 4g - we have to work and school from home for goodness sake! I've contacted my MP but am starting to consider further campaigning to central government; this country is way behind.
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Oh also, are there any good resources to actually see the map of cabinets? I know we are on cabinet 15 but there's actually a couple of candidates for which one that could actually be walking around my neighbourhood.
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Oh also, are there any good resources to actually see the map of cabinets? I know we are on cabinet 15 but there's actually a couple of candidates for which one that could actually be walking around my neighbourhood.
Codelook - https://www.telecom-tariffs.co.uk/codelook.htm - is the only one I know but the cabinet locations can sometimes be a bit off.
Put in your phone number and then 'Lookup Number'. Then select your locality and it should give a link to the cabinets.
:)
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With regards to Virgin do you live in a house or flat?
Flats can be complicated to install Virgin to and any other telecoms as well, as they need permission from the building owners, these are called Wayleaves.
If in a house check what it says for immediate neighbours.
Do you have a Toby in the pavement out side? A Toby is the connection point for VM, nowadays it's a plastic cover with Virgin Media on it, but could have something else on it depending on when it was installed.
If you have a Toby outside it would be worth phoning VM.
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We live in a house but no sign of a 'Toby' outside our house (or anywhere on our street). I can't currently use Virgin's postcode checker as it appears their website is having some issues (infinite loop JavaScript errors in the console) - but will persist.
I spoke with a TalkTalk support agent for an hour today. He tried to run some 'Direct Line Management' tests but to no avail - we're still stuck at 2.5mb/s down. What is extraordinarily frustrating is in my TalkTalk account area they have a big box that says they observed 12mbps to our router yesterday, which is just patently not true. I might set up some kind of local monitoring server to track download speeds at intermitent time intervals just to call them out. The support agent's advice was ultimately to just wait because 'speeds can take 10-14 days to ramp up' - which again is BS. So I think I'll have to trigger a cancellation at which point TT will have 30 days to salvage the contract or cut us. This house is just not connectable to the internet in 2021.
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A Toby, It's not unknown for pavements to be completely covered over by "Tarmac Gangs" so you might not see it at all :fingers:, I used to see the one outside our house - many years ago :lol:
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Weaver, its very dependant on area, and I think its fairly safe to say that the congestion issues they have such a bad reputation for are very few and far between now, but some areas still have issues. My speeds don't vary much at all, day or night, I just absolutely hate dealing with them, its a nightmare if you get a problem as I have had on a couple of occasions, and negotiating a new deal can be difficult, but was actually pretty easy this year. I don't like VM, never have done, but with the choice of 40/6Mbps VDSL or 370/36 (I could go faster still) on Virgin, it's an easy decision.
You are right. Thanks for the information!